Arsenal Thread - 2022/23

[Goone0304]

The same Wenger who was happy to spend the money Danny Fiszman provided to enable the purchase of Henry, Overmars, Petit, Vieira etc. and fund Sol Campbells £100k per week salary at a time when their turnover was around £30 million a year.

Wenger didnt buy Overmars, he was already at the club. As for Vieira, he was playing in the AC Milan reserves and his transfer fee was 3m pounds. Wenger was not one for spending big, wasnt his style. Ferguson was the one who broke his own transfer record every year. This was before clubs really developed deep and global scouting networks. Wenger was ahead of the curve in this regard. His was always signing these players dirt cheap and them going into become great players. The richer and more global the premier league got the worse he got and his primary skillset was made more redundant. As a scout he was hands down the best.

He would beat anyone on a budget. The lower the budget, the more he would win. The higher the budget, the less effective he was.

Still went unbeaten in the league on the discount

 

[Blueboy73]

Erm, I think you'll find that Wenger did sign Overmars, Wenger joined Arsenal in 1996 and Overmars signed in 1997.

Are you trying to say that Wenger didn't spend big?
If you are you are talking through your backside, he had more to spend than the majority of clubs at the time on transfer fees and wages.
Paying a player £100k per week back in 2001 was unprecedented back then in this country as was the case with Sol Campbell.
I suppose you think that all of those expensive imports he signed such as Overmars, Petit, Grimandi, Kanu etc. or the expensive signings he inherited such as Bergkamp and Platt who became integral parts of his team were really born in Islington and played for free?

The fee for Vieira was 3.5m by the way not 3m - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Vieira
This was still a big fee back in 1996 and certainly bigger than the majority of clubs he was competing against could afford at the time, especially for what you would class as a "reserve" at another club.

Wenger is a hypocrite, constantly bitching and moaning about City with his snide digs about "financial doping" yet conveniently forgets that Danny Fiszman bankrolled Arsenal in what would be the equivalent of £1.5 billion in today's money on transfer fees and wages.
Arsenal not for the first time in their history had someone come in and back them financially which is fine, but when the likes of Wenger and your entitled fanbase whine about others spending and try to imply that everything Wenger did was on a shoestring then it comes across as a tad hypocritical.

I love the way you cling on to this unbeaten in the league mantra, that 90 point season wouldn't have won the league in 5 of the 6 full seasons that Pep has been managing in the Premier League, but if it makes you feel good then fill your boots.
Pep has won as many league titles in 6 full seasons in England as Wenger managed in 22 full seasons and despite all the bollocks spouted about spending by the likes of Wenger, he hasn't got "unlimited funds" to spend.
Wenger also didn't have FFP regulations to worry about when he was spending Fiszmans' cash.

Wenger was happy enough to spend Fiszmans' money but threw his toys out of the pram when bigger fish with deeper pockets such as Abramovich and Mansour came along and upset the cosy little cartel set up by yourselves and the other entitled red shirts.

 

[Vienna_70]

Erm, I think you'll find that Wenger did sign Overmars, Wenger joined Arsenal in 1996 and Overmars signed in 1997.

Are you trying to say that Wenger didn't spend big?
If you are you are talking through your backside, he had more to spend than the majority of clubs at the time on transfer fees and wages.
Paying a player £100k per week back in 2001 was unprecedented back then in this country as was the case with Sol Campbell.
I suppose you think that all of those expensive imports he signed such as Overmars, Petit, Grimandi, Kanu etc. or the expensive signings he inherited such as Bergkamp and Platt who became integral parts of his team were really born in Islington and played for free?

The fee for Vieira was 3.5m by the way not 3m - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Vieira
This was still a big fee back in 1996 and certainly bigger than the majority of clubs he was competing against could afford at the time, especially for what you would class as a "reserve" at another club.

Wenger is a hypocrite, constantly bitching and moaning about City with his snide digs about "financial doping" yet conveniently forgets that Danny Fiszman bankrolled Arsenal in what would be the equivalent of £1.5 billion in today's money on transfer fees and wages.
Arsenal not for the first time in their history had someone come in and back them financially which is fine, but when the likes of Wenger and your entitled fanbase whine about others spending and try to imply that everything Wenger did was on a shoestring then it comes across as a tad hypocritical.

I love the way you cling on to this unbeaten in the league mantra, that 90 point season wouldn't have won the league in 5 of the 6 full seasons that Pep has been managing in the Premier League, but if it makes you feel good then fill your boots.
Pep has won as many league titles in 6 full seasons in England as Wenger managed in 22 full seasons and despite all the bollocks spouted about spending by the likes of Wenger, he hasn't got "unlimited funds" to spend.
Wenger also didn't have FFP regulations to worry about when he was spending Fiszmans' cash.

Wenger was happy enough to spend Fiszmans' money but threw his toys out of the pram when bigger fish with deeper pockets such as Abramovich and Mansour came along and upset the cosy little cartel set up by yourselves and the other entitled red shirts.

Very well put, mate.

An excellent post.

 

[TonyColemansbagofapples]

Especially Wenger being a hypocrite

 

[ali benarbia's studs]

first 8 games are tricky on their restart....2 of which i can see them winning. They need to invest to boost squad fast,imo.

 

[GunnerGer]

Erm, I think you'll find that Wenger did sign Overmars, Wenger joined Arsenal in 1996 and Overmars signed in 1997.

Are you trying to say that Wenger didn't spend big?
If you are you are talking through your backside, he had more to spend than the majority of clubs at the time on transfer fees and wages.
Paying a player £100k per week back in 2001 was unprecedented back then in this country as was the case with Sol Campbell.
I suppose you think that all of those expensive imports he signed such as Overmars, Petit, Grimandi, Kanu etc. or the expensive signings he inherited such as Bergkamp and Platt who became integral parts of his team were really born in Islington and played for free?

The fee for Vieira was 3.5m by the way not 3m - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Vieira
This was still a big fee back in 1996 and certainly bigger than the majority of clubs he was competing against could afford at the time, especially for what you would class as a "reserve" at another club.

Wenger is a hypocrite, constantly bitching and moaning about City with his snide digs about "financial doping" yet conveniently forgets that Danny Fiszman bankrolled Arsenal in what would be the equivalent of £1.5 billion in today's money on transfer fees and wages.
Arsenal not for the first time in their history had someone come in and back them financially which is fine, but when the likes of Wenger and your entitled fanbase whine about others spending and try to imply that everything Wenger did was on a shoestring then it comes across as a tad hypocritical.

I love the way you cling on to this unbeaten in the league mantra, that 90 point season wouldn't have won the league in 5 of the 6 full seasons that Pep has been managing in the Premier League, but if it makes you feel good then fill your boots.
Pep has won as many league titles in 6 full seasons in England as Wenger managed in 22 full seasons and despite all the bollocks spouted about spending by the likes of Wenger, he hasn't got "unlimited funds" to spend.
Wenger also didn't have FFP regulations to worry about when he was spending Fiszmans' cash.

Wenger was happy enough to spend Fiszmans' money but threw his toys out of the pram when bigger fish with deeper pockets such as Abramovich and Mansour came along and upset the cosy little cartel set up by yourselves and the other entitled red shirts.

I thought I'd do a bit of research for the first 5 years of Wengers reign and see what the spend was like in comparison his peers.

96/97. Net Gain of about £1.5M, outspent by most of the league in terms of Net Spend.

97/98. Net Spend of about £11M, outspent by Newcastle and Chelsea in terms of Net Spend

98/99 Net Spend of about £12M, outspent by Wimbledon, Man Utd, Blackburn, Everton, in terms of Net Spend

99/00 Net gain of about £13M which is best in the league.

00/01 Net Spend of about £5M, outspent by Leeds, Middlesbrough, Chelsea, Charlton, Sunderland, Man City, Spurs, Liverpool.

Just thought these figures were interesting in response to your post. I understand this doesn't include wages etc, and I fully admit Fiszman did bank roll the club.

And I also didn't like the moaning that came from the club and the support at the time, it was obvious it was just because their nose was put out of joint by first Chelsea and then City taking their place at the top table.

 

[Blueboy73]

I thought I'd do a bit of research for the first 5 years of Wengers reign and see what the spend was like in comparison his peers.

96/97. Net Gain of about £1.5M, outspent by most of the league in terms of Net Spend.

97/98. Net Spend of about £11M, outspent by Newcastle and Chelsea in terms of Net Spend

98/99 Net Spend of about £12M, outspent by Wimbledon, Man Utd, Blackburn, Everton, in terms of Net Spend

99/00 Net gain of about £13M which is best in the league.

00/01 Net Spend of about £5M, outspent by Leeds, Middlesbrough, Chelsea, Charlton, Sunderland, Man City, Spurs, Liverpool.

Just thought these figures were interesting in response to your post. I understand this doesn't include wages etc, and I fully admit Fiszman did bank roll the club.

And I also didn't like the moaning that came from the club and the support at the time, it was obvious it was just because their nose was put out of joint by first Chelsea and then City taking their place at the top table.

That's fair comment and a very balanced post.
It's just a shame so many of your fellow supporters either aren't aware of the investment Arsenal received at the time or refuse to acknowledge this whilst clinging to the mantra that City are outspending everyone year after year and have access to bottomless pots of money when the facts say differently.
After the huge leg up our friends from Trafford received following their flotation, the Premier league may have turned into the Bundesliga Without investment from the likes of Fiszman, Abramovich and Mansour.

 

[GunnerGer]

That's fair comment and a very balanced post.
It's just a shame so many of your fellow supporters either aren't aware of the investment Arsenal received at the time or refuse to acknowledge this whilst clinging to the mantra that City are outspending everyone year after year and have access to bottomless pots of money when the facts say differently.
After the huge leg up our friends from Trafford received following their flotation, the Premier league may have turned into the Bundesliga Without investment from the likes of Fiszman, Abramovich and Mansour.

It's also not lost on me the fact that David Dein was 1 of the driving factors for the formation of the Premier League, that he was chairman of the G14, formed to keep power to the traditional big guns, that he opened the door for Kronke, and when he was out trying to sell his stake to the highest bidder including meeting Khaldoon Al Mubarak before selling to Usmanov.

So suck it up and get on with it, trying to be the best you can be before passing judgment on others, which we just weren't doing.

 

[Blueboy73]

It's also not lost on me the fact that David Dein was 1 of the driving factors for the formation of the Premier League, that he was chairman of the G14, formed to keep power to the traditional big guns, that he opened the door for Kronke, and when he was out trying to sell his stake to the highest bidder including meeting Khaldoon Al Mubarak before selling to Usmanov.

So suck it up and get on with it, trying to be the best you can be before passing judgment on others, which we just weren't doing.

Many owners did and continue to do very well out of the formation and continued growth of the EPL.
Dein and Fiszman (before he passed) made a lot of money by selling on their stakes in Arsenal.
Edwards made a fortune out of floating our beloved neighbours on the stock exchange and Moores made a fortune selling Liverpool to Hicks and Gillette.
Mansour has got back a lot of his initial investment by selling a minority of his stake with the remainder of his holding worth many times more than he paid for and invested into it.
As far as I'm concerned, if someone with deep pockets wants to invest their money into a football club they've every right to and if it brings a bit of joy to the supporters then that's fair enough too.

Meanwhile Simple Simon Jordan has managed to lose a fortune at Palace and now makes a living spewing bile on a low rent radio station pretending to know what he's talking about with a washed up ex Sky Sports presenter.

 

[Goone0304]

Many owners did and continue to do very well out of the formation and continued growth of the EPL.
Dein and Fiszman (before he passed) made a lot of money by selling on their stakes in Arsenal.
Edwards made a fortune out of floating our beloved neighbours on the stock exchange and Moores made a fortune selling Liverpool to Hicks and Gillette.
Mansour has got back a lot of his initial investment by selling a minority of his stake with the remainder of his holding worth many times more than he paid for and invested into it.
As far as I'm concerned, if someone with deep pockets wants to invest their money into a football club they've every right to and if it brings a bit of joy to the supporters then that's fair enough too.

Meanwhile Simple Simon Jordan has managed to lose a fortune at Palace and now makes a living spewing bile on a low rent radio station pretending to know what he's talking about with a washed up ex Sky Sports presenter.

Its killing football at the grassroots level though. Its got to the stage where individual footballers now cost more than clubs in the championship. Sunderland were bought a few years back for 42m, granted they were in League One at the time. But thats mental that a one city club with a very nice stadium and a loyal following cost 42m.

We also see clubs getting into financial trouble simply trying to compete. They overreach because if they dont they get left out in the cold. We have top tier clubs buying up young talent left right and centre and loaning them back to the club they bought them off, therefore assuming all the upside potential of the players development. Just look at Chelsea, they have about 40 players out on loan. Every club should be allowed to make only three external loans from players that joined the club over 14 years of age. These loan farms are terrible.

This is why one day the ESL will happen. Because the game is for sale and for profit, and eventually the people who have bought the game will run in for thier own profit motive

The German model of the 50+1 rule is the way to go.