Assisted dying

Mr Kobayashi said:
The death pod seems to be the solution.

2024-07-17T105626Z_397335845_RC2XW8AJ2NI9_RTRMADP_3_SWISS-EUTHANASIA-MACHINE-1727178798.jpg
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The US nitrogen hypoxia execution of Kenneth Smith didn’t go too well did it?
 
I brought this up at work today and there were a few people on the fence, which surprised me. I guess if you've been fortunate to never see someone go through a painful illness you may not appreciate the need for change.

I like to be balanced and understand the counter arguments but I have read them and find them to be nonsensical. There was an interview with someone with terminal cancer who was pro-assisted dying and then someone with MND who was against it. And their reasoning was on the fact it changes conversations around death and dying and that wouldn't have a positive impact.

I didn't really get what they were saying...

We probably need to change the conversation. How many people die peacefully with family by their side? Like fuck they did. They were pumped full of drugs and didn't know what the fuck was going on and died due to the amount in their system. There was probably a lot of pain before they got the medication too. Otherwise they died in some amount of pain and it's just not acceptable socially to write "they died in fucking agony".
 
supercity88 said:
Well, yes there would have to be a process but considering the current situation regarding both medical and legal waiting times I can't see an easy fix to suddenly find the required professionals to make these decisions.

6 months isn't a long time. To deliver that prognosis is exceptionally difficult for starters, but then to find two separate professionals to confirm you can go ahead and then book a slot with a High Court judge - who may need to call witnesses...not happening.
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All very valid points.
 
denislawsbackheel said:
Yes.
Let me buy the necessary drugs.
If that’s enabling then so be it.
Change the law.
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That won’t happen mate. Will need the guardrails in place, 2 doctors, a judge, then a proper setting where drugs provided by medical staff - probably checking your consent again. That you administer it is probably sufficient- my only point is if a nurse / doctor doesn’t want to do it they should be protected by law to do that as a right - it won’t be a case that you won’t find someone who is prepared to do it so it won’t change your right to die, just allow medical staff to opt out up front then everyone knows where they are.

The alternatives is a free for all with the obvious risks that brings.

I don’t think this bill will necessarily help very many people in any case but it does change our relationship with the NHS and could be vulnerable to changes in the future.
 
metalblue said:
That won’t happen mate. Will need the guardrails in place, 2 doctors, a judge, then a proper setting where drugs provided by medical staff - probably checking your consent again. That you administer it is probably sufficient- my only point is if a nurse / doctor doesn’t want to do it they should be protected by law to do that as a right - it won’t be a case that you won’t find someone who is prepared to do it so it won’t change your right to die, just allow medical staff to opt out up front then everyone knows where they are.

The alternatives is a free for all with the obvious risks that brings.

I don’t think this bill will necessarily help very many people in any case but it does change our relationship with the NHS and could be vulnerable to changes in the future.
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I'd expect that there would be a core of staff who have agreed to do it - as you say, definitely something they shouldn't be forced into.

It's a complicated thing to get the bill right and provide protection for all involved. I don't think the timeframe they have for discussion is long enough really, but I don't know how else it can be done.
 
supercity88 said:
I brought this up at work today and there were a few people on the fence, which surprised me. I guess if you've been fortunate to never see someone go through a painful illness you may not appreciate the need for change.

I like to be balanced and understand the counter arguments but I have read them and find them to be nonsensical. There was an interview with someone with terminal cancer who was pro-assisted dying and then someone with MND who was against it. And their reasoning was on the fact it changes conversations around death and dying and that wouldn't have a positive impact.

I didn't really get what they were saying...

We probably need to change the conversation. How many people die peacefully with family by their side? Like fuck they did. They were pumped full of drugs and didn't know what the fuck was going on and died due to the amount in their system. There was probably a lot of pain before they got the medication too. Otherwise they died in some amount of pain and it's just not acceptable socially to write "they died in fucking agony".
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Many years ago a friend of mine had a heart attack, once in hospital the Doctors diagnosed he had Stage 4 lung cancer as well (he was a smoker).

So, a few weeks later he's back in hospital for his end of life care, another friend who he used to share a house with went to visit him, he was on morphine and "out of game". His housemate asked the Nurse if anything would happen if he released more morphine (it was on a drip), she said no one would bother so the dosage was increased to the max, he died the next day, no post mortem required. He did what most people want, put his friend out of any distress he may have been feeling and quickened up his death, that's how it should be but I doubt it's as easy as that these days.
 
metalblue said:
That won’t happen mate. Will need the guardrails in place, 2 doctors, a judge, then a proper setting where drugs provided by medical staff - probably checking your consent again. That you administer it is probably sufficient- my only point is if a nurse / doctor doesn’t want to do it they should be protected by law to do that as a right - it won’t be a case that you won’t find someone who is prepared to do it so it won’t change your right to die, just allow medical staff to opt out up front then everyone knows where they are.

The alternatives is a free for all with the obvious risks that brings.

I don’t think this bill will necessarily help very many people in any case but it does change our relationship with the NHS and could be vulnerable to changes in the future.
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This is the first step.
Sense will prevail eventually.
 
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