Attacks in Paris

[mat]

We need to ask ISIS to please not be so naughty again, and maybe offer them a cuddle?

A struggle cuddle?

 

[Utter bobbins]

ha ha - thought you were going to say both.

The ISIS threat seems directly linked to Syria though - district in Beirut is loyal to Hazbollah who are supporting Assad and they get a suicide bombing - the Russians bomb in Syria and their airliner gets downed - the French bomb Syria and Friday night happens. We are not active in Syria.

Think we are pretty close to the top of the list we are active in Iraq and Mosul is one of their strongholds which is being hit by the coalition which we are part of

 

[coleridge]

You say it is the bleeding obvious but your refusal to think there could be other ways or conspiracy theories if you don't like them will always drive you down the same path. Long before the Gulf War, maybe they should not have been given western guns and training.

I don't have a path. Merely a life time of learning and experience. I believe that both governments and hierarchical theologies are seminally oppressive. My only theory is that I want to live as a free person with a free mind.
If you want to understand the world, start with the logic that everything is business. Then understand that the top four war mongerers are also the top four arms manufacturers and traders, in descending order, the US, UK, France and Russia. Then, my friend, everything should become obvious to someone of your undoubted intellect.

 

[bluethrunthru]

I don't have a path. Merely a life time of learning and experience. I believe that both governments and hierarchical theologies are seminally oppressive. My only theory is that I want to live as a free person with a free mind.
If you want to understand the world, start with the logic that everything is business. Then understand that the top four war mongerers are also the top four arms manufacturers and traders, in descending order, the US, UK, France and Russia. Then, my friend, everything should become obvious to someone of your undoubted intellect.

And we might as well sell / give them arms coz if we don't somebody else will?

Fucking depressing excuse that isn't it?

 

[Blue Smarties]

Facebook user is arrested for posting message PRAISING Paris attacks and Jihadi John and claiming Manchester will be next


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...cks-Jihadi-John-claiming-Manchester-next.html

I live down the road from here so I've managed to stalk this bellends Facebook profile. I recognise him from high school, he used to be a bit of a tit if I remember rightly. United fan.

@squirtyflower, these valleys don't breed too many Oxford graduates, do they?

Edit: typos. On phone.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

Then, my friend, everything should become obvious to someone of your undoubted intellect.

You are such a flirt.

 

[Bluemanc100]

Brilliant - I promote to to Chief of Staff HM Forces - please implement your plan without delay - should be easy peasy reading that.

The French will dole out their own punishment to appease the population and seek revenge for what has happened in France over the last year... the say they are "at war"

What do you suggest we do, let the French crack on with this on their own? Sit back and do nothing? You can take the piss but what are your thoughts on the way forward? Turn the other cheek perhaps?

 

[squirtyflower]

Facebook user is arrested for posting message PRAISING Paris attacks and Jihadi John and claiming Manchester will be next


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...cks-Jihadi-John-claiming-Manchester-next.html

I live down the road from here so I've managed to stalk this bellends Facebook profile. I recognise him from high school, he used to be a bit of a tit if I remember rightly. United fan.

@squirtyflower, these valleys don't breed too many Oxford graduates, do they?

Edit: typos. On phone.

Cambridge my friend, Cambridge

 

[George Hannah]

Nail on the head here KTL. I remember saying to my (recently departed RIP) Father in Law, himself a devout Methodist, that IMO Britain would be a secular society by 2025 - he was outraged. I believe there is a real sense of disengagement from religion in the world today and many who state their allegiance don't really know why, or have 100% genuine belief, perhaps it's more to do with collective identity and belonging to a pack?
Humans show human instincts, namely a basic Maslow type of attitude, part of which means a need to belong to a society and in have traits in common with others, tribalism at it's most basic.
I found it fascinating and revealing how, when leaving the stadium in Paris last night the people broke into a spontaneous rendition of their National anthem, all very heart warming and brilliant sound bite material for our insatiable media, but why?
Us v them is the most powerful and dangerous thinking in the world today, especially when we don't know who is us and who is them

Indeed, modern Britain is increasingly post Christian. Not wishing to derail the thread but for those who haven't seen it here is a BBC programme from earlier this year which discusses, among other things, the Wahhabist concept of God as a command and control patriarch directing them to destroy the infidel.

 

[bluethrunthru]

The French will dole out their own punishment to appease the population and seek revenge for what has happened in France over the last year... the say they are "at war"

What do you suggest we do, let the French crack on with this on their own? Sit back and do nothing? You can take the piss but what are your thoughts on the way forward? Turn the other cheek perhaps?

I'd say firstly don't join in the bombing - its doing nothing. Two do join in the quest to find negotiated solutions involving Assad, the Russians, the Saudis all to isolate ISIS. At the same time don't cut troop levels don't cut Police levels. Proper scrutiny of people coming and going from the UK. Any suggestion anybody has been to anywhere where they could have been jihadi trained ( Syria, Libya, East Africa ) you don't get back in - on the next plane back to where you came from. Dialogue with UK Muslim communities - try not to emulate the French model of race relations. Thats for starters off the top of my head - half an hour I am sure I'd have some more ideas. Just because somebody doesn't follow your views to the letter doesn't make them a soft touch mate.

 

[Utter bobbins]

I'd say firstly don't join in the bombing - its doing nothing. Two do join in the quest to find negotiated solutions involving Assad, the Russians, the Saudis all to isolate ISIS. At the same time don't cut troop levels don't cut Police levels. Proper scrutiny of people coming and going from the UK. Any suggestion anybody has been to anywhere where they could have been jihadi trained ( Syria, Libya, East Africa ) you don't get back in - on the next plane back to where you came from. Dialogue with UK Muslim communities - try not to emulate the French model of race relations. Thats for starters off the top of my head - half an hour I am sure I'd have some more ideas. Just because somebody doesn't follow your views to the letter doesn't make them a soft touch mate.

We are bombing Isis we are recruiting 1900 more security staff we will be doing the diplomacy bit

 

[bluethrunthru]

We are bombing Isis we are recruiting 1900 more security staff we will be doing the diplomacy bit

I think you'll find Cameron says he is recruiting 1900 spooks for MI5 and MI6 - the truth is somewhat different. Redundancies and being deferred - posts that were being lost are being kept open but unfilled and temporary staff are having their contracts extended by 3 months. The actual number of NEW FTE will be minimal Thats not recruiting any more "security staff". Anyway new spooks recruited this week will be months in training before any tangible results will come from it.

 

[Utter bobbins]

I think you'll find Cameron says he is recruiting 1900 spooks for MI5 and MI6 - the truth is somewhat different. Redundancies and being deferred - posts that were being lost are being kept open but unfilled and temporary staff are having their contracts extended by 3 months. The actual number of NEW FTE will be minimal Thats not recruiting any more "security staff". Anyway new spooks recruited this week will be months in training before any tangible results will come from it.

You do like your digs at Cameron on most threads Intel is the way to prevent terrorism

 

[bluethrunthru]

You do like your digs at Cameron on most threads Intel is the way to prevent terrorism

I just don't like politicians lying or being economical with the truth - Bliar did the same with his dodgy dossier and I have derided that too. If you think that there will be 1900 brand new spies in MI5 and M16 any time soon and that these will prevent any terrorist atrocity in the UK then I hope you are right. I doubt it on either count . But I hope you are on the second one.

 

[Utter bobbins]

I just don't like politicians lying or being economical with the truth - Bliar did the same with his dodgy dossier and I have derided that too. If you think that there will be 1900 brand new spies in MI5 and M16 any time soon and that these will prevent any terrorist atrocity in the UK then I hope you are right. I doubt it on either count . But I hope you are on the second one.

Could you point me in the direction of a politician that doesn't lie, I despise them with a passion and if wasn't for politics and religion think the world would be a happier place

 

[EalingBlue2]

Clearly you seem a little confused; I never said all Muslims were ISIS what I said was ISIS are fighting Jihad as per the Koran and That same Koran does not give them the option of entering Negotiation with Infidels Infidels either convert to Islam or are to be killed

My original point was ISIS are not interested in negotiating

What is ISIS? Is it the leadership who direct and benefit from the terror who I am sure act very much in their on interests? Is it the brainwashed soldiers of death who reign murder upon us for the approval of their masters or some kind of eternal imaginary reward? Is it people forced to bend to ISIS view or die on the ground in Iraq.

I suspect the brainwashed suicidal murdering idiots in the middle can't be stopped and need to be eliminated. I suspect the group forced to bend need to be liberated to take their revenge on the people who have been murdering them. I suspect the caliph and his friends do this for power, for psychotic reasons and like the power hungry cowards they are once defeat faces them I'll like rats do whatever they can to survive. As to negotiating with some of the leadership if it was that or die in defeated humiliation they probably would negotiate but frankly I don't think we should, the caliph should die on his knees in a bunker humiliated like Hitler or others who were prepared to sacrifice unlimited humanity for their own ends.

In some ways I doubt the Caliph and his allies even believe in Allah and the Koran it is just a tool of power to control other people who do believe. I doubt Stalin really believed in communism either , they act as paranoid haters and murderers trying to grab power and glory in a vacuum which is why they hide and direct other people to kill innocents

It is also time that governments stop playing to ISIS tune and talking about how strong they are. Any disaffected loon can get a gun and kill unarmed civilians it is the ultimate sign of weakness to a group who cannot stand toe to toe up to their enemies, who cannot fight Kurdish men and women handicapped turkey and who are losing ground across the world.

If we started portraying this weakness and cowardice and stopped hyping them up as if we have 600000 German troops marching on the french and Belgian coast to invade they might not be getting such money, media and might be struggling for recruits wanting to bask in their glory. If we stared calling them child murderers and killers of women than Islamic martyrs we might start to archive the same things too.

Why don't we ? Because the truth is many do hate Islam, many do fear Islam and people who are different and it suits many of those people to paint ISIS as representing refugees, Muslims and immigrants in general, because their cowardly gear ridden politics is frightened of everything. These fear lingers share much in common with ISIS and many of the same goals but battle away behind their laptops or mobiles like some kind of wizards of hate masquerading like Oz himself.

 

[bluethrunthru]

Could you point me in the direction of a politician that doesn't lie, I despise them with a passion and if wasn't for politics and religion think the world would be a happier place

As long as we can keep The Thick of It and Father Ted though

 

[TCIB]

As long as we can keep The Thick of It and Father Ted though

Careful now !

 

[EalingBlue2]

Could you point me in the direction of a politician that doesn't lie, I despise them with a passion and if wasn't for politics and religion think the world would be a happier place

No it wouldn't families would be murdering other families for their cave and we would be dying of diseases we have cited for centuries - human nature in the absence of politics and religion would still be fighting for resources

 

[EalingBlue2]

There we have it, the first member of BM saying lets negotiate! Buffoon.

I don't think we can negotiate now but at some point when ISIS is decapitated we will have to negotiate with someone. No conflict in history has been solved without some talking even if it is not with the leadership.