Belgian Fans (merged)

The war was something that we were all involved in from the start its not like the English popped in to chuck a handgranade after the event.

Apart from acknowledging change I don't think you understand the feeling of local fans on this subject. 'Tourists' which is what quite a few of the fans at arsenal were, supporting players rather than the team are accepted at HOME games as a necessary evil.
 
Now i am a local of the fair city of Ypres in Belgium. I wouldn't be surprized if that name rang a bell with a lot of people here, it was a flashpoint of the first world war, it was where John McCrae wrote "in Flanders fields, wherethe poppy's grow". And yes plenty of poppy fields here.

In recent years, Anglosaxon tourism to Ypres really has boomed, to the point that for the locals the changes are visible. To give a few example's, i for one like to play some snooker in the weekend, and i used to do this in a snooker bar in Ypres. But now there aint no snooker bar in Ypres anymore, the last one removed his table's so he could make room for taking in more English tourists, i know for i know the owner and asked him about it, and he was fairly honest in telling to me that pandering to the English tourists like that would allow him to go on pension a few years earlier, i can hardly blame him for his logical reasoning but it does mean that nowadays i have to drive 10 miles out of town to play some snooker.

You could also see it at the Menin gate. Like 10 years ago there were only a few dozen people present to watch it, and so the whole ceremony would only take a few minutes. Nowadays it's more like hundreds of people, and therefore the ceremony has become longer like half an hour and streets are being closed off for the tourists. It has been a bit of a traffic hassle that, Ypres is for a large part a walled around city with at the south and East side having only 2 gates giving entrance to the city, the medieval Rysel gate which only allows 1 file trafic and the somewhat broader Menin Gate. So i had to wait like almost half an hour a few times at the Menin gate as to be able to pass trough, in recent years the City has invested quite a bit in road infrastructure to make acces for both the locals and the tourists better, with our tax money, though Ypres city is fairly rich as it is.

If youre going to see a big cultural happening in Ypres as a local, don't expect to get a prefferential treatement. Traditional feasts like the "cat parade" nowadays has more tourists watching than locals and you'd have it difficult to get a front spot whereas 10 years ago that was fairly easy still. Practicly all our shops and bars nowadays pander to the English tourists, billboards are ever so more in English and all the shop personell speaks fluent English too. There ar plenty of Elder English who like to live out their pension in Ypres so they have been active on the housing market with the result that housing has doubled if not tripled in price over the last 10 years here.

Do we complain a lot? I wouldn't have noticed that yet. Some people sure make good money from all that tourism but thats more like 20% of the active poppulation here whereas the rest has no rea interrest in it. Should we wonder, do English people come here just to look at some dirt holding a cross with their family name on it, rather than to take time to look at our various stylish medieval monuments like say our medieval marketplace with Cloth Hall? Like do they even care about Ypres? Somehow i'm of the oppinion that the rest of ypres is also nice enough for English tourists to want to see it.

Mind you, plenty of Manchesterians in the ground here. Look up the Manchester regiment and their deeds around Ypres, they were here in strenght, were crucial in the denfense of the city and by that token you would not be surprized to know that the Menin gate has a good section of it's walls filled with Manchesterians.

I think the general feeling Amon the locals here is one of respect and consideration for sacrifices. It goes 2 ways i guess, English sacrificed a lot of blood here, nowadays were sacrificing half our city to pander to Enlgish tourism. Honestly i can understand some sentimets when it regards such things liek that point system, though maybe thats more something to question the teams management for, eitherway having foreign players who have lots of home fans tends to often be in the finiancial advantage of a team, gets you more money abroad in various ways. i mean i guess i could complain about the sacrifices i have to make out here for the English, but it would feel disrespectfull given what the English gave to this city.

The mother of all false equivalences.

Some interesting anecdotes though, albeit off topic.
 
This has been going on all season,I highlighted it at Old Trafford,when I had 12 row of seats each containing 25 seats,all full off overseas visitors.
Few if any had any alleigance to City.
It is quite clear that someone at City has authourised an amount of seats to be sold through an agency for every away game.
Who ever it is,must be a very senior figure,within the club
It would not have been done by someone in the ticket office.
At Arsenal there must have been another 3 or 4 hundred overseas supporters/tourists on top of the belgium contingent.
So lets all assume thats appropx 600 tickets add on the corporate jolly 200 and that alone is 25% of our allocation of 3200 gone
This is where all the away tickets are going out of our allocation.
Yes we might have a few points whores,and the supporters clubs might not allocate tickets,how we would all like-fairly
But at least those tickets are going to genuine Blues.
But to all you people,who blame the above, "Wake up "Its the money men at the top of the club,who are shafting us not loyal Blues
 
The mother of all false equivalences.

Some interesting anecdotes though, albeit off topic.

Well i really wondered where the border was between being willing to make a sacrifice versus being perhaps smallish about it. Not that i nessecary going to criticise you so much, you had some points, i think i used some anecdote's to tackle a few more egregious sentiments like the Belgian fans supposedly only comming to see their own players. For sure just as i can think English tourist looking at more things here than just their own hero's because there simply is more nice things to see here, so i would think Belgian fans like i surely don't mind looking at the beauty of some other players besides the Belgian players, i mean afterall if you spend the 100's of pounds to come across the pond and visit, you might aswell take youre time to look at it all.
For another parts it's also about presen identity. Ypres city just aint that local anymore, we got youre Queen passing by at regular intervals too, and in anecdotal comparison i woudl agre with the sentiment of many here that Manchester city just severy outgrew it's local status too. Take the good with the bad perhaps, like we kinda have to do out here, things change and perhaps that point system aint all that relevant anymore.
 
Now i am a local of the fair city of Ypres in Belgium. I wouldn't be surprized if that name rang a bell with a lot of people here, it was a flashpoint of the first world war, it was where John McCrae wrote "in Flanders fields, wherethe poppy's grow". And yes plenty of poppy fields here.

In recent years, Anglosaxon tourism to Ypres really has boomed, to the point that for the locals the changes are visible. To give a few example's, i for one like to play some snooker in the weekend, and i used to do this in a snooker bar in Ypres. But now there aint no snooker bar in Ypres anymore, the last one removed his table's so he could make room for taking in more English tourists, i know for i know the owner and asked him about it, and he was fairly honest in telling to me that pandering to the English tourists like that would allow him to go on pension a few years earlier, i can hardly blame him for his logical reasoning but it does mean that nowadays i have to drive 10 miles out of town to play some snooker.

You could also see it at the Menin gate. Like 10 years ago there were only a few dozen people present to watch it, and so the whole ceremony would only take a few minutes. Nowadays it's more like hundreds of people, and therefore the ceremony has become longer like half an hour and streets are being closed off for the tourists. It has been a bit of a traffic hassle that, Ypres is for a large part a walled around city with at the south and East side having only 2 gates giving entrance to the city, the medieval Rysel gate which only allows 1 file trafic and the somewhat broader Menin Gate. So i had to wait like almost half an hour a few times at the Menin gate as to be able to pass trough, in recent years the City has invested quite a bit in road infrastructure to make acces for both the locals and the tourists better, with our tax money, though Ypres city is fairly rich as it is.

If youre going to see a big cultural happening in Ypres as a local, don't expect to get a prefferential treatement. Traditional feasts like the "cat parade" nowadays has more tourists watching than locals and you'd have it difficult to get a front spot whereas 10 years ago that was fairly easy still. Practicly all our shops and bars nowadays pander to the English tourists, billboards are ever so more in English and all the shop personell speaks fluent English too. There ar plenty of Elder English who like to live out their pension in Ypres so they have been active on the housing market with the result that housing has doubled if not tripled in price over the last 10 years here.

Do we complain a lot? I wouldn't have noticed that yet. Some people sure make good money from all that tourism but thats more like 20% of the active poppulation here whereas the rest has no rea interrest in it. Should we wonder, do English people come here just to look at some dirt holding a cross with their family name on it, rather than to take time to look at our various stylish medieval monuments like say our medieval marketplace with Cloth Hall? Like do they even care about Ypres? Somehow i'm of the oppinion that the rest of ypres is also nice enough for English tourists to want to see it.

Mind you, plenty of Manchesterians in the ground here. Look up the Manchester regiment and their deeds around Ypres, they were here in strenght, were crucial in the denfense of the city and by that token you would not be surprized to know that the Menin gate has a good section of it's walls filled with Manchesterians.

I think the general feeling Amon the locals here is one of respect and consideration for sacrifices. It goes 2 ways i guess, English sacrificed a lot of blood here, nowadays were sacrificing half our city to pander to Enlgish tourism. Honestly i can understand some sentimets when it regards such things liek that point system, though maybe thats more something to question the teams management for, eitherway having foreign players who have lots of home fans tends to often be in the finiancial advantage of a team, gets you more money abroad in various ways. i mean i guess i could complain about the sacrifices i have to make out here for the English, but it would feel disrespectfull given what the English gave to this city.

I enjoyed reading your post FlemishDuck and it is a big shame about your snooker club closing down.

Most City fans welcome the Belgium Blues and I have shared many drinks with your fellow Belgians at City away games. Nationality doesn't really come into it though. Our Club claim to reward long serving fans with priority for away games and in some cases cheaper tickets. That happens to a certain extent but equally our Club are using money they are supposed to invest in our Away fans (as agreed with the League) to increase the profit margin on sales to Corporates and Tourists.

I look forward to meeting more Belgium Blues at the Etihad and at away games but there needs to be fairer distribution of tickets. For example, this season we have increased the number of Corporate seats at the Etihad and these spectators now get priority for away tickets this diluting how many tickets are available on the basis of loyalty.
 
Well i really wondered where the border was between being willing to make a sacrifice versus being perhaps smallish about it. Not that i nessecary going to criticise you so much, you had some points, i think i used some anecdote's to tackle a few more egregious sentiments like the Belgian fans supposedly only comming to see their own players. For sure just as i can think English tourist looking at more things here than just their own hero's because there simply is more nice things to see here, so i would think Belgian fans like i surely don't mind looking at the beauty of some other players besides the Belgian players, i mean afterall if you spend the 100's of pounds to come across the pond and visit, you might aswell take youre time to look at it all.
For another parts it's also about presen identity. Ypres city just aint that local anymore, we got youre Queen passing by at regular intervals too, and in anecdotal comparison i woudl agre with the sentiment of many here that Manchester city just severy outgrew it's local status too. Take the good with the bad perhaps, like we kinda have to do out here, things change and perhaps that point system aint all that relevant anymore.

Thing is mate, it should be. It's very wrong if the club view as not relevant.
 
Fucking foreigners coming in her taking our jobs, our women and now our football teams. Its bad enough they make up most of the team and now they want to sit in our end and support us aswell?

Exactly!! They also have the audacity to take over OUR club and inject billions of their own money into it and the community!!

Seriously though I went to the monchengladbach away game and met loads of blues there and everyone was really nice and no one gave a toss how I got an away ticket.
Of course it's a bit different if it's 200 tickets but still
 
Well i really wondered where the border was between being willing to make a sacrifice versus being perhaps smallish about it. Not that i nessecary going to criticise you so much, you had some points, i think i used some anecdote's to tackle a few more egregious sentiments like the Belgian fans supposedly only comming to see their own players. For sure just as i can think English tourist looking at more things here than just their own hero's because there simply is more nice things to see here, so i would think Belgian fans like i surely don't mind looking at the beauty of some other players besides the Belgian players, i mean afterall if you spend the 100's of pounds to come across the pond and visit, you might aswell take youre time to look at it all.
For another parts it's also about presen identity. Ypres city just aint that local anymore, we got youre Queen passing by at regular intervals too, and in anecdotal comparison i woudl agre with the sentiment of many here that Manchester city just severy outgrew it's local status too. Take the good with the bad perhaps, like we kinda have to do out here, things change and perhaps that point system aint all that relevant anymore.

Again, the mother of all false equivalences, you're just reiterating it.

The day the club entirely bins off what's left of the points system due to wanting to accommodate new fans whose only interest in City is due to us being a highly successful club and/or a desire to accommodate even more corporates, is the day real divisions open up among our support.

If that ever happens it would be a complete disaster, not least for said new fans. There will be a lot of hostility swimming about should that ever happen, and while it should be directed at the club, not those who just want to watch City, it'd be an inevitability if the longstanding core support was shat on to such a great extent.

I don't think you quite grasp the fundamentals of this issue, frankly mate.
 

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top
  AdBlock Detected
Bluemoon relies on advertising to pay our hosting fees. Please support the site by disabling your ad blocking software to help keep the forum sustainable. Thanks.