City & FFP | 2020/21 Accounts released | Revenues of £569.8m, £2.4m profit (p 2395)

[SteveinBeds]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Regarding PSG, their biggest problem has been their wage bill which has had to include the massive tax quota that France imposes on the rich earners.
If the owners had bought Monaco instead or perhaps decided that they would be based in Monaco would this have changed their FFP position?

Incidentally, what are the rules for allowing a Club into a League outside its National border?

Imagine the confusion if a Russian Club decided to base themselves in Cyprus where many of the Russian offshore profits are made because of advantageous tax rules.
Perhaps they currently must play their home games within their National boundary or perhaps I misunderstand the personal tax advantages of Monaco cf France.

Incidentally, what are the rules for allowing a Club into a League outside its National border?

Ask Cardiff and Swansea.

Or Rangers or Celtic...


only in their dreams.

And don't forget Berwick Rangers!

 

[JGL07]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Incidentally, what are the rules for allowing a Club into a League outside its National border?

Ask Cardiff and Swansea.

Or Rangers or Celtic...


only in their dreams.

And don't forget Berwick Rangers!

Not to mention Derry City.

 

[gymshoe]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

stretford rangers claim to play in a city in which they do not reside. Just saying.

 

[Blue Beard]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Seems to me like some City fans are still wondering what we have done wrong? FFP is the tip of a bigger iceberg !

Simple answer is we have done nothing wrong. Our investors saw an opportunity through City to achieve prominence of the Etihad brand.

They had all the cash in the world and could literally have chosen any club, but they chose our club.

If City supporters had deserted the club, they would not be interested. Our support when the chips were down had a massive effect on their decision to choose City and compete with our rag neighbours.

So big up City fans, we earned this investment.

FFP is the tip of an iceberg whereby the European establishment including English clubs are increasingly freezing City out of fair trade when it comes to buying and selling players. That is a worrying prospect now and moving forward. And I find it alarming that these clubs are more willing to trade with likes of Chelski Arse, Dipperspool and Rags than with ourselves
If this sounds like bollocks to you, ask why Mangala's price has doubled since January

It is Fernando who was out of contract not Mangala.

Correct and it's to promote Abu Dhabi itself not just Etihad.
As for the bolded part I have no idea what you're talking about, it just sounds like paranoid crap. Stop smoking weed, it's affecting your judgement.

I didn't bold anything, that was someone else's reply. Mangala's price has doubled. I don't do weed.
Paranoia comes from the fact that Eufa have harshly penalised us, under pressure from clubs like Arsenal. So why would it be any surprise if those same clubs made it difficult for City to trade players?

 

[dom]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Regarding PSG, their biggest problem has been their wage bill which has had to include the massive tax quota that France imposes on the rich earners.
If the owners had bought Monaco instead or perhaps decided that they would be based in Monaco would this have changed their FFP position?

Incidentally, what are the rules for allowing a Club into a League outside its National border?

Imagine the confusion if a Russian Club decided to base themselves in Cyprus where many of the Russian offshore profits are made because of advantageous tax rules.
Perhaps they currently must play their home games within their National boundary or perhaps I misunderstand the personal tax advantages of Monaco cf France.

Berwick Rangers in Scotland ?

 

[This and only this]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

I have a question that's been bothering me since the sanctions were announced. I've been following this thread on and off but haven't seen it asked yet so if it has my apologies.

Question: in terms of FFP calculations how are player plus cash deals assessed?

If, for instance, we were to buy player A for €10mil plus player B from our current squad would the sale be booked as €10mil or €10mil plus the market value of player B? If the latter, how would the market value be determined?

Hope the question is clear, I didn't want to use names as I'm not looking for an argument.

 

[bluechampion7891]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

I have a question that's been bothering me since the sanctions were announced. I've been following this thread on and off but haven't seen it asked yet so if it has my apologies.

Question: in terms of FFP calculations how are player plus cash deals assessed?

If, for instance, we were to buy player A for €10mil plus player B from our current squad would the sale be booked as €10mil or €10mil plus the market value of player B? If the latter, how would the market value be determined?

Hope the question is clear, I didn't want to use names as I'm not looking for an argument.

Good question. I've been wondering about other variable too.

1) Agent fees - counted as transfer expenditure? Should it fall within the net spend cap?
2) Signing bonus - counted within wage cap/net transfer spend or not?
3) Add ons - from an accounting perspective makes sense to count as expenditure, but for FFP purposes specifically net spend, would it count? e.g. We offer 10 million for player X upfront, 5 million if he makes 30 appearance and another 5 if we win the league. Would it then count as net 20 million spent towards FFP or 10 million?
4) Money made from other transfers not directly involving current City players. E.g Balotelli sell on clasue: would that money count towards our net spend? Or Gareth Barry money if he moves to Everton

 

[This and only this]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

I have a question that's been bothering me since the sanctions were announced. I've been following this thread on and off but haven't seen it asked yet so if it has my apologies.

Question: in terms of FFP calculations how are player plus cash deals assessed?

If, for instance, we were to buy player A for €10mil plus player B from our current squad would the sale be booked as €10mil or €10mil plus the market value of player B? If the latter, how would the market value be determined?

Hope the question is clear, I didn't want to use names as I'm not looking for an argument.

Good question. I've been wondering about other variable too.

1) Agent fees - counted as transfer expenditure? Should it fall within the net spend cap?
2) Signing bonus - counted within wage cap/net transfer spend or not?
3) Add ons - from an accounting perspective makes sense to count as expenditure, but for FFP purposes specifically net spend, would it count? e.g. We offer 10 million for player X upfront, 5 million if he makes 30 appearance and another 5 if we win the league. Would it then count as net 20 million spent towards FFP or 10 million?
4) Money made from other transfers not directly involving current City players. E.g Balotelli sell on clasue: would that money count towards our net spend? Or Gareth Barry money if he moves to Everton

Your questions 1,2, and 3 have been asked and answered almost ad anuseum already:

• 1. Answered here: http://forums.bluemoon-mcfc.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=300980&p=7884754&hilit=agent+fees#p7884754
  2. & 3. Are rolled together in a discussion/argument that starts here: http://forums.bluemoon-mcfc.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=300980&hilit=signing+bonus+ffp&start=9420
  4. Has also been answered a few times already. Have a search, you'll find it.

 

[John.des]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

We got 35m€ from the CL for 13-14 season. Not so huge given its the "holy grail". (Also not much more to the 29m from last season when we were horrible and finished behind Ajax.)

Juve: 44m (didnt get out of group, lol)
PSG about the same as winner Real Madrid, 55m.:D

Btw now they dont pay this prize money out for us? Does it have any effect on the business? Will it count at next FFP calculations as less income?

And another question. What they check next time? Only the account of 13-14 season? Does summer businesses belong to that still? I mean selling Sinclair for 2m, would that be an income for 14-15 or 13-14 season? New players coming in, will that count a wage rise for 13-14 or 14-15?

 

[I'm no cynic but...]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

We got 35m€ from the CL for 13-14 season. Not so huge given its the "holy grail". (Also not much more to the 29m from last season when we were horrible and finished behind Ajax.)

Juve: 44m (didnt get out of group, lol)
PSG about the same as winner Real Madrid, 55m.:D

Btw now they dont pay this prize money out for us? Does it have any effect on the business? Will it count at next FFP calculations as less income?

And another question. What they check next time? Only the account of 13-14 season? Does summer businesses belong to that still? I mean selling Sinclair for 2m, would that be an income for 14-15 or 13-14 season? New players coming in, will that count a wage rise for 13-14 or 14-15?

Using Sinclair isn't the best model for your questions. We'll be stuck with him until his contract runs out.