Corruption in English football?

[BlueHammer85]

Not to win United trophies, that is a strawman, it's to keep them relevant ie maintain the top 6 status quo, which has now revved up to the top 2 or 3, and not completely down in mid-table ie 10th.

I'm not saying City have never had a dodgy decision, or even some of them. But it's the sheer frequency with which United get them, can't you see how soft these decisions are?

If you honestly can't see the ludicrous decisions that United get that other clubs don't I just don't know what to tell you. I don't know why you're mentioning Klopp or proof either - the whole idea of corruption is that it is clandestine and won't be able to be proved.

Man U are a top 6 side simply because they spend hundreds of millions on players... you really think they should finish about 10th if they didn't 'have refs onside'

 

[Messi38]

Man U are a top 6 side simply because they spend hundreds of millions on players... you really think they should finish about 10th if they didn't 'have refs onside'

Maybe 10th is a bit low but I could definitely see them finishing outside the top 6 with fair refereeing, yes. In previous seasons anyway.

Actually the correlation is between league position and wage bill, not transfer spend, you'd know that if you'd read Soccernomics.

And spending loads of money doesn't give a team a divine right to finish top 6, especially when they spend it on shite quite often (80 millions on Maguire, 50 millions on Wank Bissaka and 90m on Pogba for example).

 

[BlueHammer85]

Maybe 10th is a bit low but I could definitely see them finishing outside the top 6 with fair refereeing, yes. In previous seasons anyway.

Actually the correlation is between league position and wage bill, not transfer spend, you'd know that if you'd read Soccernomics.

And spending loads of money doesn't give a team a divine right to finish top 6, especially when they spend it on shite quite often (80 millions on Maguire, 50 millions on Wank Bissaka and 90m on Pogba for example).

exactly, that's the reason for them underperforming in recent seasons - they've bought sh*t and been poorly managed and in those seasons they have been around 6/7th

Fernandes seems to have been a very good signing and is impacting other players around him to be better, likes of Rashford and Martial, other teams are slipping up results - so would say that's a main reason they are doing well this season - they got no chance of winning the title though.

 

[Messi38]

For instance approximately this time last year they were in an utter mess in terms of league position. The media has tried to write it off as Fernandes galvanising them, but it hasn't been...they got a lot of help after Porject Restart and soared up the table.

And, by the way, the whole point about United is that even when they win games, they often play like shite. I've never seen a team get outplayed so often and win. Now, you can put this down to their superior attackers to most teams meaning they only need the of moment in a game, but the sheer amount of games they win when awarded a penalty at an important time is high.

 

[Messi38]

exactly, that's the reason for them underperforming in recent seasons - they've bought sh*t and been poorly managed and in those seasons they have been around 6/7th

Fernandes seems to have been a very good signing and is impacting other players around him to be better, likes of Rashford and Martial, other teams are slipping up results - so would say that's a main reason they are doing well this season - they got no chance of winning the title though.

Martial, who's been invisible most of the season? He's one of their most overrated purple patchy players.

Fernandes is a decent player but overrated. He's a moments player, even on Redcafe they were moaning about his shite performances. He goes through entire games being invisible and giving the ball away then pops up with a penalty or an assist. Now you can argue this is a valuable quality in a footballer (C Ronaldo is the same, utter wank for 89 mins of a game but gets on the scoresheet and weirdos who watch football via a spreadsheet rather than the eye test wank over it) but it's certainly nowhere near enough to single-handedly turn round the fortunes of a football club to the tune of like 4 or 5 of the upper places in a league table.

The best point you've made in this entire conversation is that other teams are as inconsistent as they are, and above that Liverpool and City haven't been amassing points at the same rate, so it's a case of United taking advantage of that rather than being much good themselves.

 

[Messi38]

But just to tie this up before I go out to an appointment - if you can't see the ridiculous decisions that United get, the comparatively shorter times decisions in their favour are checked etc, the way they generally get the benefit of the doubt on 50 50s, the way they go to ground so easily, then I don't know what to tell you.

Not only now, but it's been going on since Ferguson. I've been watching English football since the late 80s or early 90s and in all that time United have been the most favoured team by officials in the PL by a long way. A lot of it is to do with that classless **** of a bully Ferguson. Liverpool will be second to that but unlike a lot of City fans on here I don't think they're anywhere near as favoured as United.

 

[BlueHammer85]

The best point you've made in this entire conversation is that other teams are as inconsistent as they are, and above that Liverpool and City haven't been amassing points at the same rate, so it's a case of United taking advantage of that rather than being much good themselves.

totally agree, i think Man U have played well enough this season but they're scraping results a bit and capitalizing on other teams not being as good this year, that's all there is too it, yes they've had a few soft pens. but they'll be well behind yourselves and liverpool come end of the season.

 

[Messi38]

totally agree, i think Man U have played well enough this season but they're scraping results a bit and capitalizing on other teams not being as good this year, that's all there is too it, yes they've had a few soft pens. but they'll be well behind yourselves and liverpool come end of the season.

I'm not a City fan.

They generally haven't played well, in fact they have been poor in lots of games but got over the line. Most recent being Wolves and Villa. But you can add first 70 mins vs Leipzig at home, Soton away first half, Istanbul away, Chelsea and City where both teams played for a draw in both games, Arsenal where they lost, they actually played okay here but got done to them what they do to others, a smash and grab, Brighton, their shiteness in the last two CL games, their losses to palace and Spurs (which now apparently don't count on Redcafe cos they 'didn't have a pre season')West Ham away first half and more. In most of these games they got a deflection, or a VAR decision, or something else in their favour that is quite unsustainable. Like a few years ago when it was so obvious they were gonna tail off because De Gea being superman in every game was not sustainable. Hence Jose finishing second then being sacked for being halfway down the league the next season.

 

[Messi38]

Anyway,. no hard feelings Blue Hammer. I have seen you about when I was lurking and you seem a thoroughly nice fella. I just think you're maybe being too generous to them here. But I am not a fan of any English club so it doesn't directly affect me. I just hate United. It affects the guys on here though in terms of trophies potentially.

 

[Trevor Morley's Tache]

him saying Man Utd have had more penaltys than Liverpool in the last 5 years is a fact of corruption is it ?

'
Klopp's intention may have been to draw attention to some of the more dubious spot kicks awarded to Solskjaer's side which have rightly been called into question - like the one Bruno Fernandes won and converted against Aston Villa during Project Restart, despite the Portuguese appearing to initiate contact with Ezri Konsa.

But, as Klopp admitted after the defeat at St. Mary's, so too have Liverpool's players been criticised for going down easily, with the manager referencing Mane's last-minute penalty win against Leicester in the same season.

So while the data can say one thing, it may be a stretch too far to claim United have had an easy ride with referees compared to Liverpool over the last five years '


also, did you do know Man City have had more penalties awarded than Man Utd in the last 5 years.. how do you square that one ?

View attachment 7704View attachment 7705

And lets couple with this statistic, that made 0 sense the Rags should be getting that much pens.

1352 mode touches in the opposition penalty area.