Discuss Pellegrini (Pt 2)

[mancity1]

I say it because if he qualifies us from the group stages of the CL and at least qualifies us again via a top 4 spot he will keep his job. I get the feeling he is very much a man keeping a seat warm and he is not a long term appointee anyway and because of this, we wont be in such a hurry to get rid until the new man is ready to take over.

Would i be happy with that? No I wouldn't be fucking happy and would be happy for him to get the boot for underachieving just as i was with Bob.

Hope that clarifies my stance for you.

3 years is a long time in football mate, if its Pep we are talking about, that's a long time to keep a seat warm.

Agreed. That said, he royally fucks up this season and he deserves to get the boot and with that i will have no issue.

The constant going forward though is Ferran and Txiki and that is not going to change no matter how much some may want it to due to them blaming them for Bobs demise.

Ferran is transforming the club off the field and Txiki is the DoF, a position the club has made clear is the future.

First team coaches will come and go but the constants/structures will remain.

-- Tue Sep 17, 2013 11:09 am --

I say it because if he qualifies us from the group stages of the CL and at least qualifies us again via a top 4 spot he will keep his job. I get the feeling he is very much a man keeping a seat warm and he is not a long term appointee anyway and because of this, we wont be in such a hurry to get rid until the new man is ready to take over.

Would i be happy with that? No I wouldn't be fucking happy and would be happy for him to get the boot for underachieving just as i was with Bob.

Hope that clarifies my stance for you.

Yeah but no :P

I'd be astonished, even if he got us to the semi's, if fourth was acceptable. Third is massively better than fourth because you can't do your summer business on the basis of money that you might win if you progress through your play off. Third has to be absolute fucking rock bottom. Anyway. they won't settle for that. We just have too many good players. Even our second eleven, if you removed the pressure of all other competitions, should finish third at the least.

And... gawd alive Bob was only keeping the seat warm for Mou, now this guy is keeping the seat warm for the invisible man... One day, hopefully, one day, we will get a proper manager. Then, and only then, can we let the real arguments and bickering begin!

Just answered this.

We dont want or need a manager anymore, we want a first team coach.

Ferran and Txiki are in charge.

The structure may or may not be fluid but the people in the roles are.

Ferran and Txiki have a lot more to lose than MP if he bombs and they get rid of him before his two years are up.

Yes they are transforming the club to the world as the owners would like to be seen but you have to remember the buck stops with them in terms of the appointments they make in regards to the manager and to a large extent the playing group.

100 mill of additional investment as some have said does not go well if you fall down the pecking order in the league.

We got all our targets early our club was lauded for it but if the early bird can't find the worm because he is too far underground it matters little.

Roman just sacks everybody he can and while his mo is perhaps slightly different to ours in terms of patience and slowly slowly he has got everything he wanted now so he can go even more gung ho should he want.

The owners have placed a big burden on the Barca duo to get it right both on and off the field but in the end the football face of it is what happens on matchdays.

The owners know it and they understand the fans desire and passion for success when you have the receipe for it namely money and prestige and way of achieving your goals off the pitch largely unseen and unappreciated by the fans.

Sometimes you shoot the messenger in this case the manager and as Reginald penned you shoot the piano player and you have not tune to dance to.

In the end you have to go behind the song and in this case I come up with Ferran and Txiki and I know the owners know they are only as good as the appointments they make.

They will not be a constant by any stretch especially if continually fail to meet are on field objectives.

 

[Anonymous]

Maybe its just sour grapes, something he cant hide given his almost constant referrals to Mancini?

Best to back out of the thread slowly mate ... you've hit a raw nerve ... it's gonna end in tears ;)

 

[mancity1]

SHB- I am sure during the summer you said, though you were a Mancini inner, that you thought pellegrini was a great appointment and how you were looking forward to this season. You now seem determined for him to fail.

Secondly, I bet every time Mancini drew at stoke, you used the tough away game excuse.

The fact is, this has not been the start anyone expected. Very underwhelming. But 4 games have gone and that is way too early to judge.

This whole thread has just turned into a bit of a point scoring between Mancini inners and outers. Just like last season. But everyone has to get over it. Pellegrini didn't sack Mancini. Dave and billy didn't sack Mancini. I

To early to judge in your opinion. I am entitled to mine and will stick to it.
He has won fuck all in Spain-a 2 team league.
He has changed nothing-and he has had a whole pre season to endorse his ways on the team.
I want him toi fail-Yeah course I do you idiot-That is why I keep taking leave,spending my hard earned just to score cheap points.Get real
It's a forum and it's about opinions-I have mine.Most don't agree but if he is a huge success I will say I was wrong. If he is not then I won't say I told you so.Yes I admired Mancini but he had his faults but it's about now and I have seen nowt that fills me with any confidence-4 games or not!

You obviously don't want city to fail. But I think part of you would be satisfied in a perverse way if pellegrini fails as it would be revenge for the Mancini sacking. Anyway, that's not the point. You seemed so behind pellegrini in the summer???

I am not filled with confidence at the moment, it has been a very poor start, like I said, no one can deny that! But after 4 games it is a little rash, I think, to claim he isn't up to it. Give it 10 games, if we haven't improved then I think a lot of questions will be asked. It's been a poor start, but we have only played 4 games!

Big difference between wanting to fail and afraid to fail.

You still end up failing more often than not but nobody wants MP to fail in fact he seems like quite a decent guy all being said.

Its just think at this stage he may fail and until he proves otherwise that feeling will pervade with this people but in some ways they want him to have more success than the ones who think he will " get things right" when you scrub away the rhetoric from both camps.

 

[BobKowalski]

3 years is a long time in football mate, if its Pep we are talking about, that's a long time to keep a seat warm.

Agreed. That said, he royally fucks up this season and he deserves to get the boot and with that i will have no issue.

The constant going forward though is Ferran and Txiki and that is not going to change no matter how much some may want it to due to them blaming them for Bobs demise.

Ferran is transforming the club off the field and Txiki is the DoF, a position the club has made clear is the future.

First team coaches will come and go but the constants/structures will remain.

-- Tue Sep 17, 2013 11:09 am --

Yeah but no :P

I'd be astonished, even if he got us to the semi's, if fourth was acceptable. Third is massively better than fourth because you can't do your summer business on the basis of money that you might win if you progress through your play off. Third has to be absolute fucking rock bottom. Anyway. they won't settle for that. We just have too many good players. Even our second eleven, if you removed the pressure of all other competitions, should finish third at the least.

And... gawd alive Bob was only keeping the seat warm for Mou, now this guy is keeping the seat warm for the invisible man... One day, hopefully, one day, we will get a proper manager. Then, and only then, can we let the real arguments and bickering begin!

Just answered this.

We dont want or need a manager anymore, we want a first team coach.

Ferran and Txiki are in charge.

The structure may or may not be fluid but the people in the roles are.

Ferran and Txiki have a lot more to lose than MP if he bombs and they get rid of him before his two years are up.

Yes they are transforming the club to the world as the owners would like to be seen but you have to remember the buck stops with them in terms of the appointments they make in regards to the manager and to a large extent the playing group.

100 mill of additional investment as some have said does not go well if you fall down the pecking order in the league.

We got all our targets early our club was lauded for it but if the early bird can't find the worm because he is too far underground it matters little.

Roman just sacks everybody he can and while his mo is perhaps slightly different to ours in terms of patience and slowly slowly he has got everything he wanted now so he can go even more gung ho should he want.

The owners have placed a big burden on the Barca duo to get it right both on and off the field but in the end the football face of it is what happens on matchdays.

The owners know it and they understand the fans desire and passion for success when you have the receipe for it namely money and prestige and way of achieving your goals off the pitch largely unseen and unappreciated by the fans.

Sometimes you shoot the messenger in this case the manager and as Reginald penned you shoot the piano player and you have not tune to dance to.

In the end you have to go behind the song and in this case I come up with Ferran and Txiki and I know the owners know they are only as good as the appointments they make.

They will not be a constant by any stretch especially if continually fail to meet are on field objectives.

But equally you do have to have continuity behind the scenes. If you setting out a blueprint that broadly everyone signs off on then you need to give the executive overseeing the plan time and room to bring it to fruition. The failure or otherwise of the manager will reflect on the executive but you cannot tie it to the fate of the manager (or the coach) because their roles are very different and over a different timescale. You judge the executive on how they are doing as a whole in accordance with the job they are tasked with. Appointing a head coach is just one of those tasks albeit a very public one and for us as fans the most important.

 

[mancity1]

he has a harem of bodies and is wise enough to back the right horse enough times to achieve most of waht he sets out to do.

mate that is the best mixed metaphor I have heard in a long time... what is he doing with horses in his harem and what exactly is he setting out to do to them?

The horse represents the gamble even though in their culture betting on horses is a no no I believe they still are involved in the richest horse race in the world.

The harem is a symbol of the choice of many for instant pleasure without total fulfilment.

Cryptic I know but if you replace the horse with the DOF and the harem with all their major business contacts it may I stress may make some sense (LOL).

I harp on it later when I put Ferran and Txiki's tenure directly linked to the success of their appointments both on a off the field and the harem could be construed as the pool of players available that can be bought to a club through the lure of the dollar alone.

Just on that I don't necessarily correlate greed alone with an inability to work your socks off for the success of the club.

Some of the greediest players ever were the best ever produced.

 

[blueinsa]

he has a harem of bodies and is wise enough to back the right horse enough times to achieve most of waht he sets out to do.

mate that is the best mixed metaphor I have heard in a long time... what is he doing with horses in his harem and what exactly is he setting out to do to them?

The horse represents the gamble even though in their culture betting on horses is a no no I believe they still are involved in the richest horse race in the world.

The harem is a symbol of the choice of many for instant pleasure without total fulfilment.

Cryptic I know but if you replace the horse with the DOF and the harem with all their major business contacts it may I stress may make some sense (LOL).

I harp on it later when I put Ferran and Txiki's tenure directly linked to the success of their appointments both on a off the field and the harem could be construed as the pool of players available that can be bought to a club through the lure of the dollar alone.

Just on that I don't necessarily correlate greed alone with an inability to work your socks off for the success of the club.

Some of the greediest players ever were the best ever produced.

 

[Paul Lake's Left Knee]

Agreed. That said, he royally fucks up this season and he deserves to get the boot and with that i will have no issue.

The constant going forward though is Ferran and Txiki and that is not going to change no matter how much some may want it to due to them blaming them for Bobs demise.

Ferran is transforming the club off the field and Txiki is the DoF, a position the club has made clear is the future.

First team coaches will come and go but the constants/structures will remain.

-- Tue Sep 17, 2013 11:09 am --



Just answered this.

We dont want or need a manager anymore, we want a first team coach.

Ferran and Txiki are in charge.

The structure may or may not be fluid but the people in the roles are.

Ferran and Txiki have a lot more to lose than MP if he bombs and they get rid of him before his two years are up.

Yes they are transforming the club to the world as the owners would like to be seen but you have to remember the buck stops with them in terms of the appointments they make in regards to the manager and to a large extent the playing group.

100 mill of additional investment as some have said does not go well if you fall down the pecking order in the league.

We got all our targets early our club was lauded for it but if the early bird can't find the worm because he is too far underground it matters little.

Roman just sacks everybody he can and while his mo is perhaps slightly different to ours in terms of patience and slowly slowly he has got everything he wanted now so he can go even more gung ho should he want.

The owners have placed a big burden on the Barca duo to get it right both on and off the field but in the end the football face of it is what happens on matchdays.

The owners know it and they understand the fans desire and passion for success when you have the receipe for it namely money and prestige and way of achieving your goals off the pitch largely unseen and unappreciated by the fans.

Sometimes you shoot the messenger in this case the manager and as Reginald penned you shoot the piano player and you have not tune to dance to.

In the end you have to go behind the song and in this case I come up with Ferran and Txiki and I know the owners know they are only as good as the appointments they make.

They will not be a constant by any stretch especially if continually fail to meet are on field objectives.

But equally you do have to have continuity behind the scenes. If you setting out a blueprint that broadly everyone signs off on then you need to give the executive overseeing the plan time and room to bring it to fruition. The failure or otherwise of the manager will reflect on the executive but you cannot tie it to the fate of the manager (or the coach) because their roles are very different and over a different timescale. You judge the executive on how they are doing as a whole in accordance with the job they are tasked with. Appointing a head coach is just one of those tasks albeit a very public one and for us as fans the most important.

What do you know with your Bertie level, you are lucky that you are allowed to read this thread, let alone comment.

Apart from that good management speak, in the above, very David Brent or Brendan Bodgers. I think you could have mentioned low hanging fruit, best practice, synergy, strategic fit, win-win and other such business wank words.

 

[mancity1]

Personally I think we should separate the Ferran/Txiki arguments from the Pellegrini debate.

Irrespective of how we fare under Pellegrini the manager or head coach is a short term affair on a 3 year cycle. Ferran and Txiki are charged with ensuring the financial and football well being of the club for the next decade and longer. Two totally separate and distinct job descriptions. The idea that Pellers failing will impact on F&T that they leave is a non starter. Ideally it would have been preferable if Mancini could have overseen the first team for a couple of more years but as we will know the reality of Mancini deferring to F&T was a pipe dream (albeit a pleasent one for a while) and Sheikh Mansour with his eye on the long term was only ever going to back F&T when push came to shove. The fact that Sheikh Mansour backed F&T over a title winning manager should tell you enough of the importance of F&T.

Pellegrini is here because F&T know him plus he was available, won't kick up a stink when, say, Barry is moved on and won't start calling out players in public and upsetting everyone (the poor lambs). In short he is a safe pair of hands. Much like Hodgson was described when he went to Liverpool. My own view is that Pellers won't cut it but has an excellent chance to get us out of the group stages of the CL and if he finishes top 3 the board will be viewing that as a success. What grates is the PR bollocks that soft soaped Pellers arrival "I bring you sexy football" and the majority of the media telling me he is an upgrade (just like Hodgson to Liverpool) and what an outstanding success he has been. This is frankly insulting and assumes I cannot read a CV. The next person to tell me getting a record points total to finish 2nd, or doing anything to finish fucking 2nd, I will hunt down and kill. I assume doing this does not breach the T&C of the site due to extenuating circumstances.

I support what F&T are trying to do. I get why Pellers is here. I do not get a hard on that he did 'wonders at Villareal' any more than I got a hard on that Hughes did 'wonders at Blackburn'. I do think we have a squad that can win the PL and will be pissed if we don't because the powers that be sacrificed the short term for the long term even if I acknowledge (begrudgingly) that it may be the correct course of action.

Finally a word for F&T. Next time you want a safe pair of hands employ Rafa. Yes he's a bit awkward and he won't be promising anything stupid like 'I bring you sexy football' but he will win stuff and the football will actually be pretty good. Fact.

All good stuff BK but Directors of football and CEO's and in fact all positions at a club have their targets and tenures as well.

I don't think the owners believe that any shortcomings on the pitch will completely absolve the people in these positions of any responsibility.

Those who appoint people in positions of responsibility both in the playing staff and the management of those players that continually fall short have to be made accountable for their choices.

In most business if you keep on hiring duds you quickly obtain the tag as the dud who hires duds and up the food chain it goes.

Most owners won't sack themselves they will get bought out or pass on the responsibility to their next of kin if they want to hang on to what they have but they are not afraid to get rid of a director of football or someone of simliar stature in the corporate structure if they fall short themselves.

At the very least they will give them another title and absolve them of their most important duties.

As far as football is concerned the most important job next to the hiring of the receptionist (LOL) is the appointment of the manager the interaction between those responsible for the transfer in and out of players and the manager and the fiscal responsibility attached to same therein.

Speaking of which where is Brian Marwood these days?

 

[BobKowalski]

The structure may or may not be fluid but the people in the roles are.

Ferran and Txiki have a lot more to lose than MP if he bombs and they get rid of him before his two years are up.

Yes they are transforming the club to the world as the owners would like to be seen but you have to remember the buck stops with them in terms of the appointments they make in regards to the manager and to a large extent the playing group.

100 mill of additional investment as some have said does not go well if you fall down the pecking order in the league.

We got all our targets early our club was lauded for it but if the early bird can't find the worm because he is too far underground it matters little.

Roman just sacks everybody he can and while his mo is perhaps slightly different to ours in terms of patience and slowly slowly he has got everything he wanted now so he can go even more gung ho should he want.

The owners have placed a big burden on the Barca duo to get it right both on and off the field but in the end the football face of it is what happens on matchdays.

The owners know it and they understand the fans desire and passion for success when you have the receipe for it namely money and prestige and way of achieving your goals off the pitch largely unseen and unappreciated by the fans.

Sometimes you shoot the messenger in this case the manager and as Reginald penned you shoot the piano player and you have not tune to dance to.

In the end you have to go behind the song and in this case I come up with Ferran and Txiki and I know the owners know they are only as good as the appointments they make.

They will not be a constant by any stretch especially if continually fail to meet are on field objectives.

But equally you do have to have continuity behind the scenes. If you setting out a blueprint that broadly everyone signs off on then you need to give the executive overseeing the plan time and room to bring it to fruition. The failure or otherwise of the manager will reflect on the executive but you cannot tie it to the fate of the manager (or the coach) because their roles are very different and over a different timescale. You judge the executive on how they are doing as a whole in accordance with the job they are tasked with. Appointing a head coach is just one of those tasks albeit a very public one and for us as fans the most important.

What do you know with your Bertie level, you are lucky that you are allowed to read this thread, let alone comment.

Apart from that good management speak, in the above, very David Brent or Brendan Bodgers. I think you could have mentioned low hanging fruit, best practice, synergy, strategic fit, win-win and other such business wank words.

Personally I thought the post was worth a few Bertie points especially as I deleted the words 'synergy', proactive' and the phrase 'harmonious interface with all facets of the operation to achieve a vibrant unity that maximises output at all levels'...

...which i have just made up and will now use on a match day thread. Fucking blow their minds with that little gem

 

[mancity1]

mate that is the best mixed metaphor I have heard in a long time... what is he doing with horses in his harem and what exactly is he setting out to do to them?

And while you're at it can you please translate this for me?

Either he will or won't and if so their is light abound and it will blind us for the better.

If you have singled out Garcia for that signpost and his is carrying a torch without a battery then fair enough but it could have been worded a tad better.

Thats the most acute case of brentitus I've seen for sometime.

Again one wanted a bob each way , yes he thought it would work out but at the moment I see no light at the end of the tunnel he was stating in the same sentence , an oxymoron almost if you like but he put in the name of Garcia so maybe although I doubt it he was referring exclusively to the believe he has no faith in Garcia alone as opposed to the rest of the team.

Kappish?