Discuss Pellegrini (Pt 2)

[Lancet Fluke]

Jesus, I didn't think this forum could shock me given some of the utter bollocks that regularly gets posted on here but I am actually quite shocked by the antipathy towards Pellegrini from some posters. He seems a thoroughly decent guy with a very decent record given the level of resources he has generally had at his disposal. Like any manager who has just started, the jury is out, but can we at least see how he does before we decide he's a failure?

Why post something like that?

You've now made the thread look all untidy with that sensible post, please leave the thread ;-)

The most disappointing thing is that I can't help but come to the conclusion that last night's win has actually vexed some people.

 

[BobKowalski]

He seems a thoroughly decent guy with a very decent record given the level of resources he has generally had at his disposal...

Agreed. If you like 'decent'. I prefer 'good' or 'excellent' as 'decent' doesn't quite cut it for me. Which is fine. We all have different standards.

 

[Lancet Fluke]

He seems a thoroughly decent guy with a very decent record given the level of resources he has generally had at his disposal...

Agreed. If you like 'decent'. I prefer 'good' or 'excellent' as 'decent' doesn't quite cut it for me. Which is fine. We all have different standards.

Well that's mere semantics. Your idea of excellent may be my idea of decent anyway when it comes to judging a manager's achievements. For instance some people think Mancini's achievements at City were excellent, whereas I think they were just decent, given the resources he had available to him.
I'm sure there are plenty of Villarreal and Malaga fans who think Pellegrini's record with them was excellent.

 

[BobKowalski]

He seems a thoroughly decent guy with a very decent record given the level of resources he has generally had at his disposal...

Agreed. If you like 'decent'. I prefer 'good' or 'excellent' as 'decent' doesn't quite cut it for me. Which is fine. We all have different standards.

Well that's mere semantics. Your idea of excellent may be my idea of decent anyway when it comes to judging a manager's achievements. For instance some people think Mancini's achievements at City were excellent, whereas I think they were just decent, given the resources he had available to him.
I'm sure there are plenty of Villarreal and Malaga fans who think Pellegrini's record with them was excellent.

Ah. Well explains a lot. So what do you expect from Pellegrini this season given the resources he has available to him? For example what would be decent and what would be excellent?<br /><br />-- Wed Sep 18, 2013 5:34 pm --<br /><br />

I wonder what would provide closure on this issue?

My take on it is that Mancinie was a great manager for us, and will be forever remembered with fondness and kindness by the majority of City fans, but he has moved on and so should we, what is done is done and there is no going back.

Oh the fucking irony...

 

[SalfordCityBlue]

Thought we were much improved last night - good signs. Even the first half was better, we just needed the goal.

Still not fully firing, but we looked like we at least had a plan last night, and good to see Yaya playing further forward again. Kompany just brings such a level of calm and confidence to the side that he automatically seems to improve our performance level in all departments, just by being on the field. A true leader.

Feeling quietly confident for Sunday now...

 

[Lancet Fluke]

Agreed. If you like 'decent'. I prefer 'good' or 'excellent' as 'decent' doesn't quite cut it for me. Which is fine. We all have different standards.

Well that's mere semantics. Your idea of excellent may be my idea of decent anyway when it comes to judging a manager's achievements. For instance some people think Mancini's achievements at City were excellent, whereas I think they were just decent, given the resources he had available to him.
I'm sure there are plenty of Villarreal and Malaga fans who think Pellegrini's record with them was excellent.

Ah. Well explains a lot. So what do you expect from Pellegrini this season given the resources he has available to him? For example what would be decent and what would be excellent?

Well firstly, and this isn't a cop out, just common sense (imo) I'd say it isn't as simple as winning this or that, it is more complex than that in terms of this season. He has just joined a new club and so he needs to be given some time, just as Mancini needed to be given time when he first arrived. As I have said a number of times in this thread, it is easy to forget that after about 16 months, many people were not remotely impressed with Mancini but things suddenly clicked into place with that semi final win over united. I distinctly remember being at Anfield a few days before Wembley and I honestly feared for Mancini's future at the club after the match, top 4 looked very dodgy and the knives seemed to be well and truly out. Once Pellegrini has been given some time to manage the inevitable transition then I expect us to be genuine title challengers every season and I expect us to be able to win titles with some regularity. I also expect us to be competitive in Europe. I think that is the least we should expect with our resources, whoever is the manager. In terms of what I expect from this first season, well I would obviously hope that we can hit the ground running and win things immediately but I'm pragmatic enough to realise that this might not happen and that there could be some issues in transition. As long as by the end of the season there hasn't been anything truly catastrophic (like finishing outside the top 3/4 or not getting through the group stage of the CL) then as long as through the season there have been obvious signs of progression that suggest that next season will be a genuine title challenge then I would keep faith in Pellegrini. At this point though, I think it's way too early to say how we are going to do this season. It has been a mixed bag so far and clearly Pellegrini hasn't come in and instantly made everything brilliant, which is what we all hoped he could do (well most of us did). But I think we are seeing at Chelsea and united too that when you change manager it has to be given some time.

 

[moomba]

Expectations for me have got to be top 2, and in the title race until the end. Progression to the champions league knockouts and the latter stages of at least one of the cups.

Failure to meet those expectations wouldnt mean Pelle losing his job, but having expectations lower than that is a bit unambitious IMO.

 

[BobKowalski]

Well that's mere semantics. Your idea of excellent may be my idea of decent anyway when it comes to judging a manager's achievements. For instance some people think Mancini's achievements at City were excellent, whereas I think they were just decent, given the resources he had available to him.
I'm sure there are plenty of Villarreal and Malaga fans who think Pellegrini's record with them was excellent.

Ah. Well explains a lot. So what do you expect from Pellegrini this season given the resources he has available to him? For example what would be decent and what would be excellent?

Well firstly, and this isn't a cop out, just common sense (imo) I'd say it isn't as simple as winning this or that, it is more complex than that in terms of this season. He has just joined a new club and so he needs to be given some time, just as Mancini needed to be given time when he first arrived. As I have said a number of times in this thread, it is easy to forget that after about 16 months, many people were not remotely impressed with Mancini but things suddenly clicked into place with that semi final win over united. I distinctly remember being at Anfield a few days before Wembley and I honestly feared for Mancini's future at the club after the match, top 4 looked very dodgy and the knives seemed to be well and truly out. Once Pellegrini has been given some time to manage the inevitable transition then I expect us to be genuine title challengers every season and I expect us to be able to win titles with some regularity. I also expect us to be competitive in Europe. I think that is the least we should expect with our resources, whoever is the manager. In terms of what I expect from this first season, well I would obviously hope that we can hit the ground running and win things immediately but I'm pragmatic enough to realise that this might not happen and that there could be some issues in transition. As long as by the end of the season there hasn't been anything truly catastrophic (like finishing outside the top 3/4 or not getting through the group stage of the CL) then as long as through the season there have been obvious signs of progression that suggest that next season will be a genuine title challenge then I would keep faith in Pellegrini. At this point though, I think it's way too early to say how we are going to do this season. It has been a mixed bag so far and clearly Pellegrini hasn't come in and instantly made everything brilliant, which is what we all hoped he could do (well most of us did). But I think we are seeing at Chelsea and united too that when you change manager it has to be given some time.

Fair enough. You nearly lost me at 'this isn't a cop out' :) but it would be churlish of me not to acknowledge you put forward a reasonable point of view.

 

[3rdlanarkblue]

Once Mr Pellegrini has discovered the benefits of a few pints of Holts bitter on a Friday night he will quickly adjust to what is required by the football experts and occasional Man City fans who regularly post on here. How about we give the man a chance to get his suitcase unpacked. I can only make allowances for premature ejaculators but the rest please have a little patience.

 

[Metodscaeft DeadBlue]

What I really don't understand is the whole 'south american cups don't count' thing. IMO and from what I have seen of south america, it is just as competitive as prem. The English premier league isn't all its cracked up to be. Yes, the football can be quicker than most others. But have you ever seen for example Everton vs. Stoke? Or QPR vs. Wolves? Not the most exciting of encounters. You get that in every league. No disrespect to those teams though.

You get fast games, you get slow games. Premier league has just as many 'big' teams and others countries in their respective leagues.

Pellegrini won titles in a massively hostile environment. Derby games in south america are fiercely contested especially even when compared to Manchester derby. He has a man management style that is very rare in big teams. Possibly similar to Martinez who is destined to manage a big team.

What I'm trying to say after all this is that Pellegrini can not only take us to the next step because presently after last season that's equal to the rags. Pellegrini can take us two steps forward which is what we need. Given the squad, the new developments and the style the club are taking I do believe that Pellegrini is the perfect choice. Just as much as I believe Viera will be the perfect choice in 3-4 years after the current 'cycle'.