Discussion: Manuel Pellegrini 2015/16

[Citizen of Legoland]

I normally have a fair bit of respect for your posts, but there's some right guff in that lot, starting with the opening gambit about our starting line up having had enough quality to effectively absolve the manager of blame. Well, winning football matches isn't simply a question of having better players than your opponents, but also about their deployment, their attitude, their discipline and their ability to impose the prescribed game plan whilst negating the strengths of the opposition. As a case in point, Leicester City are top of the league.
The analogy with the Crystal Palace vs Liverpool game is laughable. Firstly Palace were the away team. Secondly Palace are a counterattacking team. Thirdly Palace's starting line up at Klanfield was awash with power, physicality and pace. Fourthly they sat deep with 9 men behind the ball and then blitzed downfield whenever the opportunity presented itself. Fifthly, labelling Liverpool a midtable team is disingenuous in the extreme given what their new manager inherited and given his proven ability to motivate new charges. The same 'mid table' team ran us ragged at Anfield only 7 months ago, and Klopp's Dortmund gave us the mother of all footballing lessons in the CL 3 years ago. That should have been enough alone for Pellegrini to take heed, and the idea that we shouldn't have been concerned was arrogant and naive in equal measure; QED.

City meanwhile defended high up the pitch, had two slightly built lightweights out wide, and two immobile central midfielders, who turned over possession and then lacked the legs to get back and cover as a red shirted swarm descended on our 36 year old centre half. Our set up was Klippety's wettest dream. The players didn't help, but in 2015, Barca twice, Liverpool twice, the rags, Spurs, Juventus, the Arse, Monchengladbach (until he gave Ya Ya the hook) and Seville at the Etihad (albeit that we somehow ended up winning the game), have all taught us the same lesson to varying degrees. If I hadn't watched Ya Ya Toure standing on the halfway line in the Allianz, whilst Jerome Boateng virtually walked the ball up to the edge of the City penalty area again and again and again, I might have been more prepared to put the boot into the players (and there's no denying they weren't partly culpable), but sadly I did watch it, and I am therefore more inclined to question the wisdom of the man, who keeps sending his team out with seemingly no regard for how he might combat what the opposition might do

+1

I'm all for giving managers time to instill their philosophies and can handle defeats better than most, but Manuel - it's not working!

 

[Phil1]

That post is so fucking good it's like poetry! Absolutely bang on, superb mate. Agree with every word.

It's as good as the one he was replying to was bad.

 

[GazM]

That post is so fucking good it's like poetry! Absolutely bang on, superb mate. Agree with every word.

True. MP has the same arrogant traits as Wenger. If we can see the obvious flaws in the way the team is set up & the way they play why can't he ?

 

[Marvin]

True. MP has the same arrogant traits as Wenger. If we can see the obvious flaws in the way the team is set up & the way they play why can't he ?

Be reasonable, he doesn't have many choices at the moment.

He has to play Demichelis, and in the absence of Silva and Nasri, we need someone to feed the forwards hence Toure has to start.

When Kompany, Silva, Mangala are back it will be n entirely different team - one that can defend one on one, and attack at will.

At the moment we can't attack for fear of exposing Demichelis, and we can't just sit deep and defend the penalty box, because against the best teams, they will usually score if you do that. Really difficult. We need a break like we had at Sevilla, when everyone was at their best, and we got the benefit of an early goal.

 

[BillyShears]

I still like the idea of de Boer but I have not played close attention to how he is doing at the moment; other than having Ajax on top of the league.

There's a number of options, I think Emery has been mentioned in dispatches and I rate him and like the fact that he is apparently obsessive about detailed preparation.

Low has also been mentioned and he would be interesting.

Closer to home, also mentioned, there's Pinocchio or Koeman but can't see the former leaving Spurs at the end of the season.

I just want Pep though and not too interested in other options until he is not an option.

Sorry mate, I missed this yesterday.

I'm fully down with the idea of De Boer as well. Think he ticks a lot of boxes for Soriano and Txiki in terms of the characteristics he has as a coach. Has done very well at Ajax and I think he'd be an interesting appointment.

Koeman i'm a bit skeptical about - his record before going to Southampton isn't great, and quite frankly prior to watching his Southampton side play i'd never seen one of his teams not stink the place out.

We've missed the boat with Pochetino just as we missed the boat with Klopp so we have to forget about them IMO.

The wild card really is Viera. When I talked to Graham Hunter he seemed very adamant that Txiki wants Viera to manage the first team at City. It also ties into him choosing to go to NYCFC. I'm not sure Pat would be going to manage in the MLS unless he knew he had a major chance after that at the big job back in Manchester.

I also think that as the dust settles on Saturday tonight's match takes on some serious significance for MP. If he wins he can think his team selection on Saturday was justified, as we will have won our CL group for the first time since getting into the competition. Although we will have done so at the expense of 3 points on Saturday, within the wider context it's not the end of the world as there's only 2 points between us and the top spot.

Personally I'm coming round to the idea that he's been told to prioritise winning the group this season, so as angry as I was after Saturday and as poor a performance as it was, I suspect the higher ups will not give it a second thought if we win tonight. Especially with the way the league has panned out where no one has run away with things. We could still step up a gear between now and the end of the year and open up a gap.

 

[mancity1]

Be reasonable, he doesn't have many choices at the moment.

He has to play Demichelis, and in the absence of Silva and Nasri, we need someone to feed the forwards hence Toure has to start.

When Kompany, Silva, Mangala are back it will be n entirely different team - one that can defend one on one, and attack at will.

At the moment we can't attack for fear of exposing Demichelis, and we can't just sit deep and defend the penalty box, because against the best teams, they will usually score if you do that. Really difficult. We need a break like we had at Sevilla, when everyone was at their best, and we got the benefit of an early goal.

We did ok at exposing our back four who in truth looked like they were playing on quick sand in any case without attacking on Saturday.

I think your assessment about Demichelis being the weak link in a set up without Silva and Kompany is a bit simplistic.

We have 14 senior players available and Sagna who I am not certain will start if Clichy is fit to play from the outset could play as a central defender or he could get adventurous and play three at the back.

As for not being able to attack , many a side in fact our side has shown in the past you can keep possession in the opposition half and stay solid in the back.

It all depends on who actually turns up to play and commit themselves to the game and whether MP turns up as well because neither did last Saturday and in my opinion some of the criticism that with Ferny and Oti in the side ahead of Demi and Yaya etc it would have all different is very speculative at best.

My criticism of MP was more of the fact he has no plan to shore up the defensive side of our game when we are pressed in our half or he cannot communicate the message effectively to the players.

Its not rocket science and we have the personnel without VK who we cannot depend on any more with his crocked calf's anyway to make it difficult for opposition sides certainly the quality of Liverpool and Spurs to create clear cut chances.

Three times in a relatively short period of time we have conceded 4 goals which is not what champions elect do.

 

[flb]

Sorry mate, I missed this yesterday.

I'm fully down with the idea of De Boer as well. Think he ticks a lot of boxes for Soriano and Txiki in terms of the characteristics he has as a coach. Has done very well at Ajax and I think he'd be an interesting appointment.

Koeman i'm a bit skeptical about - his record before going to Southampton isn't great, and quite frankly prior to watching his Southampton side play i'd never seen one of his teams not stink the place out.

We've missed the boat with Pochetino just as we missed the boat with Klopp so we have to forget about them IMO.

The wild card really is Viera. When I talked to Graham Hunter he seemed very adamant that Txiki wants Viera to manage the first team at City. It also ties into him choosing to go to NYCFC. I'm not sure Pat would be going to manage in the MLS unless he knew he had a major chance after that at the big job back in Manchester.

I also think that as the dust settles on Saturday tonight's match takes on some serious significance for MP. If he wins he can think his team selection on Saturday was justified, as we will have won our CL group for the first time since getting into the competition. Although we will have done so at the expense of 3 points on Saturday, within the wider context it's not the end of the world as there's only 2 points between us and the top spot.

Personally I'm coming round to the idea that he's been told to prioritise winning the group this season, so as angry as I was after Saturday and as poor a performance as it was, I suspect the higher ups will not give it a second thought if we win tonight. Especially with the way the league has panned out where no one has run away with things. We could still step up a gear between now and the end of the year and open up a gap.

Its all well and good if the decision was made higher up to top our CL group but the hierarchy didn't make him play two in the middle and that rubbish CB pairing. As you say mate we are going round in circles now with this so lets see what happens in the next 7 days which are pivotal to our season.This club should be topping the CL group we are in so for me I don't see it as some super dooper achievement that should have us all creaming ourselves about.As a whole we have played fucking average in the competiton so far.

 

[Phil1]

The idea of us ending up with De Boer or Vieira whilst Utd get Pep doesn't fill me with too much optimism. It'd be another chance missed to get the top of the tree in managerial terms and would be the third appointment on the trot where we've failed to persuade the best of the best.
I appreciate that others will feel different and welcome the likes of those two, but for me, once Pellegrini goes we have to employ the kind of big name manager who will take us further on.
I guess we'll all have to wait and see what happens.

 

[mancity1]

Sorry mate, I missed this yesterday.

I'm fully down with the idea of De Boer as well. Think he ticks a lot of boxes for Soriano and Txiki in terms of the characteristics he has as a coach. Has done very well at Ajax and I think he'd be an interesting appointment.

Koeman i'm a bit skeptical about - his record before going to Southampton isn't great, and quite frankly prior to watching his Southampton side play i'd never seen one of his teams not stink the place out.

We've missed the boat with Pochetino just as we missed the boat with Klopp so we have to forget about them IMO.

The wild card really is Viera. When I talked to Graham Hunter he seemed very adamant that Txiki wants Viera to manage the first team at City. It also ties into him choosing to go to NYCFC. I'm not sure Pat would be going to manage in the MLS unless he knew he had a major chance after that at the big job back in Manchester.

I also think that as the dust settles on Saturday tonight's match takes on some serious significance for MP. If he wins he can think his team selection on Saturday was justified, as we will have won our CL group for the first time since getting into the competition. Although we will have done so at the expense of 3 points on Saturday, within the wider context it's not the end of the world as there's only 2 points between us and the top spot.

Personally I'm coming round to the idea that he's been told to prioritise winning the group this season, so as angry as I was after Saturday and as poor a performance as it was, I suspect the higher ups will not give it a second thought if we win tonight. Especially with the way the league has panned out where no one has run away with things. We could still step up a gear between now and the end of the year and open up a gap.

We could have done both mind you if we had turned up Billy , even with that starting line up.

Those with the thought that compromise one game with the thought of the next game in mind or visa versa forget one simple fact that doing so does not increase your chances of success one jot and poor form is not always easy to turn around at the drop of a hat especially against a seasoned campaigner like Juve.

Maybe the embarrassment of Saturday if nothing else and some personal pride if our under performing side might instil some fight in some of the players we shall see but why doe's it need a rollicking and a poor run like 11 points from our last 8 games to wake the players up from yet another unnecessary and uncalled for slumber.

 

[Keepingthefaithsince1976]

If theres any rich blues on here there's a chance to meet Manuel at a City dinner and ask him some of the above questions.

Yeah, because there the kind of questions he'll answer at a fans Q&A.
It's actually one of the things I like about him, the fact he gives nothing away. I appreciate that as fans we want to know the ins and outs of what's going on, but knowing whatever's said will get twisted anyway it's best he keeps shctum![/QUOTE]

He's a very clever astute sort of guy. I'm sure he'd answer that if Raheem keeps working hard, he will continue improving.