Discussion: Txiki Begiristain (2014/15)

[Damocles]

Net spend £109million.
Number of signings who are now nailed on starter's: Zero.
Number of signings that have improved the starting 11: zero.
£109million - glad it's not my money.

Fernandinho, Navas and Demichelis aren't nailed on starters?

The manager doesn't think so.

I guess I got confused by the 95 games they've played between them this year and the fact that by minutes played they are in our top 11 players

 

[mancity1]

Fernandinho, Navas and Demichelis aren't nailed on starters?

The manager doesn't think so.

I guess I got confused by the 95 games they've played between them this year and the fact that by minutes played they are in our top 11 players

In terms of minutes played and rotation if you want to call it that I think MP has stayed loyal and maybe that's a fault at times for obvious reasons to as many players as possible.

He certianly has given the above three as many opportunities as possible.

Only Hart, yaya , Silva, VK and Kun if availalble are starters as such and he will rotate some of them when demand of time in his mind says they should be rested.

There is no doubt he dropped VK probably because of what took place in the dressing room at Anfield plus his poor form.

I though it was a mistake to bring him back against Burnley and as it turned out it was.

Now he probably has to play him on Wednesday in a game that will probably seal his fate sooner rather than later and it will be interesting to see how VK plays.

You will never keep 22 players all who think they should start happy and interestingly we have played our best football or at least got some of our best results this season when we have had players on the sidelines for a number of reasons.

We seem to want to create a situation of pressure on ourselves before we respond almost like we want to intentionally orchestrate it.

Whether the bulk of the players have lost faith in MP only they can truly tell you and they won't but they have done enough this year to get him into the difficult situation in terms of his tenure that he finds himself in right now.

Weird but if you look as it over the journey since 2011/12 it has a ring to it.

 

[Jimfv1]

I think Txiki has done OK especially in moving players on a getting value for those we needed to go. Where he has struggled is in signing squad players for high fees who haven't improved the first team at all. The squad has improved but not the first team. I think we can cut him some slack in that we have had to comply with FFP and been much less competitive in the market than we could have been. The fact we have missed out on the likes of Costa, Fabregas, Matic and similar players who have come to the Premier league and been successes makes us fans feel a little short changed by the club we support. I was gutted when Hazard joined Chelsea (which was pre Txiki joining us) and we signed the likes of Scott Sinclair and Jack Rodwell.

I think this summer is very important for Txiki's reputation with our fans and the fact the first team squad needs an overhaul. I hope we change the coach first and consult with the new manager over which players we need and make sure they have the right mentality and speed of play to improve our first team. We need some top British players as well as a couple of good European ones, with at least one star name joining.

 

[dancity19]

Net spend £109million.
Number of signings who are now nailed on starter's: Zero.
Number of signings that have improved the starting 11: zero.
£109million - glad it's not my money.

Fernandinho, Navas and Demichelis aren't nailed on starters?

Do you think every player bought is bought for the purpose of replacing a current player in our best first XI?

You keep repeating this point about the job of a DOF being to improve the squad, and not just the first XI. This is, of course, true; most importantly, however, is to improve the first XI where necessary and absolutely ensure we have the right players going forward to improve.

So now Mangala and Fernando may be decent enough squad players (well not Fernando actually) but were they only bought as squad players? Fernando was sold to us as an absolute upgrade on garcia and ready to fit straight into the team as a top quality DM.
Therefore, neither of those buys have achieved what they were bought for- by this definition they have been poor buys. I like mangala, but he hasn't achieved what he was bought for yet.
Dinho is far and away the best player he's bought- he is top class. You could argue either way for anyone else. A DOF has to identify where we actually need to freshen up the first XI and make the proper signings, and in no way has he done this. 5/6 mil on caballero????

Regarding your point on guaranteed starters. Fernandinho should be. Demicheles form
Wise should be- our best CB- but in a way, had txiki done his job correctly, he shouldn't be- if you know what I mean...? Navas- hit and miss.

 

[Damocles]

Fernando wasn't sold to us as anything by City. The press invent these types of things and not the Director of Football.

Fernando replaced Rodwell. Their fees were almost exactly the same, and the previous year we had an on fire Yaya Toure and Fernandinho in a straight two man midfield. I cannot possibly imagine that anybody expected us to spend £12m on a midfielder who would replace either Yaya Toure or a guy who had just spent £30m on and had a wonderful season.

Again, people aren't really getting this bit - a Director of Football doesn't buy a bunch of players and then tell the manager what to do with them. They identify gaps in the squad and fill them. The rest is up to the manager. Rodwell leaving was a gap for somebody and we had £12m in the budget to fill it

Think of that part a DoF's job closer to how the traditionalists think of a Chief Scout but with the ability to buy players. It isn't the Chief Scout's fault that Mangala isn't playing well - he's obviously a good player and he is getting games so is obviously thought to be of the required quality from the manager so he has done his job. The Chief Scout can't tell the manager that she should be playing Fernando in a 3 man midfield either or that his left back needs to work on his tracking.

The Director of Football role model across European clubs is more complicated than that, but if we're going to oversimplify for the sake of the argument we can at least bother to oversimplify what their actual job entails.

 

[Manchester_lalala]

Fernando wasn't sold to us as anything by City. The press invent these types of things and not the Director of Football.

Fernando replaced Rodwell. Their fees were almost exactly the same, and the previous year we had an on fire Yaya Toure and Fernandinho in a straight two man midfield. I cannot possibly imagine that anybody expected us to spend £12m on a midfielder who would replace either Yaya Toure or a guy who had just spent £30m on and had a wonderful season.

Again, people aren't really getting this bit - a Director of Football doesn't buy a bunch of players and then tell the manager what to do with them. They identify gaps in the squad and fill them. The rest is up to the manager. Rodwell leaving was a gap for somebody and we had £12m in the budget to fill it

Think of that part a DoF's job closer to how the traditionalists think of a Chief Scout but with the ability to buy players. It isn't the Chief Scout's fault that Mangala isn't playing well - he's obviously a good player and he is getting games so is obviously thought to be of the required quality from the manager so he has done his job. The Chief Scout can't tell the manager that she should be playing Fernando in a 3 man midfield either or that his left back needs to work on his tracking.

The Director of Football role model across European clubs is more complicated than that, but if we're going to oversimplify for the sake of the argument we can at least bother to oversimplify what their actual job entails.

This is pretty much spot on. In my opinion, he's done an okay job. I will wait till the end of this summer to make a judgement on him. He defintley needs to prove his worth with the budget weve got in the next window.

 

[whp.blue]

Fernando wasn't sold to us as anything by City. The press invent these types of things and not the Director of Football.

Fernando replaced Rodwell. Their fees were almost exactly the same, and the previous year we had an on fire Yaya Toure and Fernandinho in a straight two man midfield. I cannot possibly imagine that anybody expected us to spend £12m on a midfielder who would replace either Yaya Toure or a guy who had just spent £30m on and had a wonderful season.

Again, people aren't really getting this bit - a Director of Football doesn't buy a bunch of players and then tell the manager what to do with them. They identify gaps in the squad and fill them. The rest is up to the manager. Rodwell leaving was a gap for somebody and we had £12m in the budget to fill it

Think of that part a DoF's job closer to how the traditionalists think of a Chief Scout but with the ability to buy players. It isn't the Chief Scout's fault that Mangala isn't playing well - he's obviously a good player and he is getting games so is obviously thought to be of the required quality from the manager so he has done his job. The Chief Scout can't tell the manager that she should be playing Fernando in a 3 man midfield either or that his left back needs to work on his tracking.

The Director of Football role model across European clubs is more complicated than that, but if we're going to oversimplify for the sake of the argument we can at least bother to oversimplify what their actual job entails.

That is exactly how I see the Dof role as well and with those guidelines and ffp restrictions I think he has done a good job

We now need to address the full backs and with a much improved left back in the summer mangala will seem like a bargain buy in the coming years

 

[dancity19]

Fernando wasn't sold to us as anything by City. The press invent these types of things and not the Director of Football.

Fernando replaced Rodwell. Their fees were almost exactly the same, and the previous year we had an on fire Yaya Toure and Fernandinho in a straight two man midfield. I cannot possibly imagine that anybody expected us to spend £12m on a midfielder who would replace either Yaya Toure or a guy who had just spent £30m on and had a wonderful season.

Again, people aren't really getting this bit - a Director of Football doesn't buy a bunch of players and then tell the manager what to do with them. They identify gaps in the squad and fill them. The rest is up to the manager. Rodwell leaving was a gap for somebody and we had £12m in the budget to fill it

Think of that part a DoF's job closer to how the traditionalists think of a Chief Scout but with the ability to buy players. It isn't the Chief Scout's fault that Mangala isn't playing well - he's obviously a good player and he is getting games so is obviously thought to be of the required quality from the manager so he has done his job. The Chief Scout can't tell the manager that she should be playing Fernando in a 3 man midfield either or that his left back needs to work on his tracking.

The Director of Football role model across European clubs is more complicated than that, but if we're going to oversimplify for the sake of the argument we can at least bother to oversimplify what their actual job entails.

Well you can argue he was to replace Rodwell if you want that to fit your narrative. If he was fine, improvement. We are, however, yet to fill the void of a quality defensive midfielder - that is his job. I didn't once say we needed to replace Yaya or Dinho. I think Dinho was a fantastic buy.

Right - surely in order to effectively to fulfill his job, he needs to work closely with the manager to ensure they are on the same page. Get a manager with a playing style that compliements the players you buy, and vice versa. So no, he can't tell the manager what to do, but they do need to be on the same page. Is it his responsibility to sound out, and pick the manager - his, or Khaldoon's? Genuine question.

 

[philiph20]

Soriano has done well but Begiristain is a fraud and a charlatan, if he is in effect the chief scout i'd sooner bring back Harry Godwin and Ken Barnes and both have been dead for years.

 

[blueparrot]

Soriano has done well but Begiristain is a fraud and a charlatan, if he is in effect the chief scout i'd sooner bring back Harry Godwin and Ken Barnes and both have been dead for years.

A fraud and a charlatan, so much so all the very intelligent successful people from the owner and chairman down are fooled and only a handful of bluemoon posters can see through it.