Edin Dzeko (contract update page 370)

[Shaelumstash]

Re: Edin Dzeko legend

Whether there is a reason for it or not, it points out that people are not making a single game performance on that one game. So Sergio gets na better review without actually playing better.
How many times has he produced moments like his second goal on his debut. Far too few.

If people look on Dzeko in a negative manner it is because he has been poor in a high proportion of his games for City. If people look at Aguero in a positive manner it is because he has been good in a high proportion of his games for City. It's as simple as that. There's no agenda, everyone wants him to do well, but unfortunately when he starts he is consistently disappointing.

It may well be that there's a good reason some people have a negative view of his ability - he did have a difficult start to his time at City. I get that. But if you keep unfairly judging someone based on first impressions, they never have a chance to change that impression - it just reinforces the stereotype. So if Dzeko plays okay (certainly no worse than the other strikers), it's unfair to say he was shit. I suppose you could say that his average performance is still worse than Aguero's, but that's different from judging his performance in a single game.

Well he's been here nearly 2 years and I've not really seen any considerable improvement in the games that he starts. He's improved enormously off the bench though. I think it would be a bit far fetched for you to suggest I have a pre-conceived idea he's shit, but I somehow forget it when he comes off the bench.

 

[pudge]

Re: Edin Dzeko legend

Here's a fun activity for everyone to try - watch the game again and focus on Aguero. Convince yourself that he's shit. Tell yourself that he loses the ball almost every time he gets it and that most of the time he doesn't even bother challenging for high balls. Tell yourself he always dribbles into trouble instead of passing to open team-mates, and that his shooting is woeful. Now watch his every move with all of that in mind and let confirmation bias do the rest.

If you've completed this activity properly you'll now be convinced Aguero was dreadful last night because at one time or another (and on multiple occasions in some cases), he did all of those things. When each bad play happened, it would confirm all your preconceived notions of just how shit he is. Sure, he did some good things as well, but you know he's shit, so you don't let that ruin the story you already have worked out in your head. He probably just got lucky anyway.

Now try it for Tevez.

How about Dzeko? Ah, but most of the posters on this thread have already done this little activity for him, and even posted their results (see above. And probably below as well).

Here's a fun activity for you - Tell me, what is the topic of this thread?

It appears to have started out as a thread about how good Dzeko is, and has since devolved into a place to praise him wildly when he comes on and wins the game, and to slag him off mercilessly when he starts a game but doesn't score.

Most of his fans (a lot of Bosnians, apparently) view his performances with the knowledge that he is a great player, having seen him dominate the Budesliga for 2 years, and most of his detractors view his performances with the knowledge that he's complete dog-shit, having watched him struggle during his early days at City. As a consequence of these biases, the two groups watch Dzeko play in the same game and come away with wildly divergent views on his performance.

My aim was to try to explain how this situation has arisen and hence explain 90% of the content in this thread. And you were right, that was a fun activity.

It seems like I'll have to answer for you..

Dzeko is the topic.

Not Tevez, not Aguero, not any other player but Dzeko.

So can people stop knocking other players (irony?) simply to promote or deflect attention from another/the actual topic.

 

[NorCalBlue]

Re: Edin Dzeko legend

If people look on Dzeko in a negative manner it is because he has been poor in a high proportion of his games for City. If people look at Aguero in a positive manner it is because he has been good in a high proportion of his games for City. It's as simple as that. There's no agenda, everyone wants him to do well, but unfortunately when he starts he is consistently disappointing.

It may well be that there's a good reason some people have a negative view of his ability - he did have a difficult start to his time at City. I get that. But if you keep unfairly judging someone based on first impressions, they never have a chance to change that impression - it just reinforces the stereotype. So if Dzeko plays okay (certainly no worse than the other strikers), it's unfair to say he was shit. I suppose you could say that his average performance is still worse than Aguero's, but that's different from judging his performance in a single game.

Well he's been here nearly 2 years and I've not really seen any considerable improvement in the games that he starts. He's improved enormously off the bench though. I think it would be a bit far fetched for you to suggest I have a pre-conceived idea he's shit, but I somehow forget it when he comes off the bench.

He's certainly been more effective off the bench, but I haven't noticed any real difference in his work-rate, ball control, or any of the other things he gets criticized for, when he comes off the bench. The main difference seems to be that the way we play (and the way the opposition is playing) has been different when he's come on in the last 20 minutes. It may well be that Dzeko's most effective in this role, but if he started every game and then we brought on Aguero with 20 minutes to go, it may well be that Aguero scores a lot more goals in this role as well.

Don't get me wrong - I hold Aguero in very high regard, but like many top class strikers, he also frequently looks ineffective when starting games.

 

[cleavers]

Re: Edin Dzeko legend

Here's a fun activity for everyone to try - watch the game again and focus on Aguero. Convince yourself that he's shit. Tell yourself that he loses the ball almost every time he gets it and that most of the time he doesn't even bother challenging for high balls. Tell yourself he always dribbles into trouble instead of passing to open team-mates, and that his shooting is woeful. Now watch his every move with all of that in mind and let confirmation bias do the rest.

If you've completed this activity properly you'll now be convinced Aguero was dreadful last night because at one time or another (and on multiple occasions in some cases), he did all of those things. When each bad play happened, it would confirm all your preconceived notions of just how shit he is. Sure, he did some good things as well, but you know he's shit, so you don't let that ruin the story you already have worked out in your head. He probably just got lucky anyway.

Now try it for Tevez.

How about Dzeko? Ah, but most of the posters on this thread have already done this little activity for him, and even posted their results (see above. And probably below as well).

You should visit the Balotelli thread, its had 40 pages of "anti christ" since he last played (in probably one of his best games for us).

If you expect objective opinion, you're probably on the wrong thread.

By the way its Balo 470 v Dzeko 160 currently so Balo is the clear winner (of something).

 

[NorCalBlue]

Re: Edin Dzeko legend

Here's a fun activity for you - Tell me, what is the topic of this thread?

It appears to have started out as a thread about how good Dzeko is, and has since devolved into a place to praise him wildly when he comes on and wins the game, and to slag him off mercilessly when he starts a game but doesn't score.

Most of his fans (a lot of Bosnians, apparently) view his performances with the knowledge that he is a great player, having seen him dominate the Budesliga for 2 years, and most of his detractors view his performances with the knowledge that he's complete dog-shit, having watched him struggle during his early days at City. As a consequence of these biases, the two groups watch Dzeko play in the same game and come away with wildly divergent views on his performance.

My aim was to try to explain how this situation has arisen and hence explain 90% of the content in this thread. And you were right, that was a fun activity.

It seems like I'll have to answer for you..

Dzeko is the topic.

Not Tevez, not Aguero, not any other player but Dzeko.

So can people stop knocking other players (irony?) simply to promote or deflect attention from another/the actual topic.

"But m'lord, the way we judge other players is relevant in a discussion of how we judge Dzek..." "Silence in court! This evidence is inadmissible!"

Wow, you'd be a tough judge!

 

[pudge]

Re: Edin Dzeko legend

It appears to have started out as a thread about how good Dzeko is, and has since devolved into a place to praise him wildly when he comes on and wins the game, and to slag him off mercilessly when he starts a game but doesn't score.

Most of his fans (a lot of Bosnians, apparently) view his performances with the knowledge that he is a great player, having seen him dominate the Budesliga for 2 years, and most of his detractors view his performances with the knowledge that he's complete dog-shit, having watched him struggle during his early days at City. As a consequence of these biases, the two groups watch Dzeko play in the same game and come away with wildly divergent views on his performance.

My aim was to try to explain how this situation has arisen and hence explain 90% of the content in this thread. And you were right, that was a fun activity.

It seems like I'll have to answer for you..

Dzeko is the topic.

Not Tevez, not Aguero, not any other player but Dzeko.

So can people stop knocking other players (irony?) simply to promote or deflect attention from another/the actual topic.

"But m'lord, the way we judge other players is relevant in a discussion of how we judge Dzek..." "Silence in court! This evidence is inadmissible!"

Wow, you'd be a tough judge!

There's a post match discussion thread.

Also, there was a thread made about Tevez yesterday.

Dzeko thread - posts about Dzeko

Tevez thread - posts about Tevez

etc

 

[Shaelumstash]

Re: Edin Dzeko legend

It may well be that there's a good reason some people have a negative view of his ability - he did have a difficult start to his time at City. I get that. But if you keep unfairly judging someone based on first impressions, they never have a chance to change that impression - it just reinforces the stereotype. So if Dzeko plays okay (certainly no worse than the other strikers), it's unfair to say he was shit. I suppose you could say that his average performance is still worse than Aguero's, but that's different from judging his performance in a single game.

Well he's been here nearly 2 years and I've not really seen any considerable improvement in the games that he starts. He's improved enormously off the bench though. I think it would be a bit far fetched for you to suggest I have a pre-conceived idea he's shit, but I somehow forget it when he comes off the bench.

He's certainly been more effective off the bench, but I haven't noticed any real difference in his work-rate, ball control, or any of the other things he gets criticized for, when he comes off the bench. The main difference seems to be that the way we play (and the way the opposition is playing) has been different when he's come on in the last 20 minutes. It may well be that Dzeko's most effective in this role, but if he started every game and then we brought on Aguero with 20 minutes to go, it may well be that Aguero scores a lot more goals in this role as well.

Don't get me wrong - I hold Aguero in very high regard, but like many top class strikers, he also frequently looks ineffective when starting games.

I completely disagree. His touch and work rate are far better from the bench. He's an instinctive player, he's at his best when he has no time to think.

 

[Anonymous]

Re: Edin Dzeko legend

Hes perfectly suited to our style when we are in the 2nd half. When we attack, attack and attack at pace.

For the first 50/60 mins when we play possesion and short passing build up, then he's fairly useless unfortunately.

Its not his fault, its not mancinis fault. They both have styles but dzeko only fits half of mancinis (which is very succesful).

Dzeko is a top striker when playing in a certain attack plan, i just hope/wish he will be comfortable getting 30 mins every week.

I love the guy but starting him isnt playing to his strengths.

 

[TCIB]

Re: Edin Dzeko legend

Hes perfectly suited to our style when we are in the 2nd half. When we attack, attack and attack at pace.

For the first 50/60 mins when we play possesion and short passing build up, then he's fairly useless unfortunately.

Its not his fault, its not mancinis fault. They both have styles but dzeko only fits half of mancinis (which is very succesful).

Dzeko is a top striker when playing in a certain attack plan, i just hope/wish he will be comfortable getting 30 mins every week.

I love the guy but starting him isnt playing to his strengths.

Very much this ^^ i feel the same, shame he doesn't suit our tactics starting a match but he does the biz for us when he does come on.

 

[Anonymous]

Re: Edin Dzeko legend

Hes perfectly suited to our style when we are in the 2nd half. When we attack, attack and attack at pace.

For the first 50/60 mins when we play possesion and short passing build up, then he's fairly useless unfortunately.

Its not his fault, its not mancinis fault. They both have styles but dzeko only fits half of mancinis (which is very succesful).

Dzeko is a top striker when playing in a certain attack plan, i just hope/wish he will be comfortable getting 30 mins every week.

I love the guy but starting him isnt playing to his strengths.

Very much this ^^ i feel the same, shame he doesn't suit our tactics starting a match but he does the biz for us when he does come on.

Makes me feel sick thinking this but he'd score a bucket load for the rags if he played in their setup.