EU referendum

[Dave Ewing's Back 'eader]

What this debate needs is the release of proper information from the outers about how much coming out will cost for the new systems we would need to implement to fill the EU void. Only then can we calculate if the billions saved will be worth it. In addition, the inners need to say how what we have in regards to deals and systems we currently have are worth keeping and cannot be bettered by us going alone.

This debate is still shallow and based on personalities, nationalism, anecdotal thinking and we know best. There is little substance at the moment for us all to make a sound decision.

It is being run and organised in much the same way as the Scots Indy vote went. Start scaring people as to what Armageddon really means - all the money and institutions fleeing south if there were a Yes vote - and it worked. The idea of not knowing what might happen when we have to pay our own way and one side suggesting it's gonna be horrendous is what will drive the vote! It all depends how many people stick with the idea that the EU is a busted, corrupt notion that, in political terms, was never gonna succeed.

 

[YPhrunts]

What this debate needs is the release of proper information from the outers about how much coming out will cost for the new systems we would need to implement to fill the EU void. Only then can we calculate if the billions saved will be worth it. In addition, the inners need to say how what we have in regards to deals and systems we currently have are worth keeping and cannot be bettered by us going alone.

This debate is still shallow and based on personalities, nationalism, anecdotal thinking and we know best. There is little substance at the moment for us all to make a sound decision.

That will be difficult when our civil servants have been instructed to withhold information from one side of the debate. But I think there is enough out there to form a visceral opinion you just need to search it out and listen to what some of the interested parties are saying.

 

[Gelsons Dad]

It will cost no more to come out than it will to stay in. The truth is we don't need thousands of new agreements and reams of new legislation. For trade with the EU the legislation is in place, as it is for trade with the rest of the world. The EU subsidised industries will carry on being subsidised but directly from the UK rather than through the tortuous route via Brussels. Industries that previously were denied subsidy due to EU regulations may benefit as the government sees fit which could in some cases give them an advantage on the world stage. The city will not be bound by exclusively EU regulations and so will be free to offer a wider range for financial services which can only make it more competitive and finally and most importantly, the government of the day will no longer have the "it's an EU regulation" excuse and will therefore be more accountable to the electorate restoring democracy and sovereign powers to the nation and its population. Where they belong.

 

[Zuriblue]

It will cost no more to come out than it will to stay in. The truth is we don't need thousands of new agreements and reams of new legislation. For trade with the EU the legislation is in place, as it is for trade with the rest of the world. The EU subsidised industries will carry on being subsidised but directly from the UK rather than through the tortuous route via Brussels. Industries that previously were denied subsidy due to EU regulations may benefit as the government sees fit which could in some cases give them an advantage on the world stage. The city will not be bound by exclusively EU regulations and so will be free to offer a wider range for financial services which can only make it more competitive and finally and most importantly, the government of the day will no longer have the "it's an EU regulation" excuse and will therefore be more accountable to the electorate restoring democracy and sovereign powers to the nation and its population. Where they belong.

That is RAWK level delusion. The fact is that we have no idea what an out vote will lead to, the outers can't or won't say, preferring to whine "scaremongering!!" but the idea that a BREXIT will only have positive consequences is naive in the extreme.

 

[Gelsons Dad]

That is RAWK level delusion. The fact is that we have no idea what an out vote will lead to, the outers can't or won't say, preferring to whine "scaremongering!!" but the idea that a BREXIT will only have positive consequences is naive in the extreme.

Why not address the points made with a substantive rebuttal? It's easy to just offer broad and meaningless comment. look: "The fact is that we have no idea what an in vote will lead to". See, it's just as valid as your statement and equally meaningless.
The only certain positive in my post is the restoration of democracy and sovereignty. You may not see that as a positive but over a thousand years of British history does.

 

[denislawsbackheel]

What delusional nonsense.
We are in
We know the terms under which we are in
We know the future terms won't change by voting to stay in.

The outers cannot offer any info whatsoever and resort to infantile scaremongering.

 

[CityStu]

What delusional nonsense.
We are in
We know the terms under which we are in
We know the future terms won't change by voting to stay in.

The outers cannot offer any info whatsoever and resort to infantile scaremongering.

The terms change. We voted into a Common Market which has now turned into a political Union. Who is to say what the EU will do in the coming years and what say we will have in that? It's common knowledge that Turkey are on the doorstep so it's very possible that the EU will try and push into the Middle East and countries like Azerbaijan, Georgia and Syria.

You would be voting to stay in the EU on its current trajectory, not in its current state.

 

[PJMCC1UK]

Everyone should visit the war graves, a sober sober reminder of what a divided competing Europe did to humanity for many many centuries.

Absolutely. Those two world wars were started by empire expansionist movements. Funnily that is exactly what the EU is about. We continuously get told about trade agreements when what this is really about is far more power being given to far fewer people.
The rise in Nationalism is a result of this expansionism. I've never had a problem with trade agreements. Just the expansion, uncalled for and not actually what any country signed up to.

 

[PJMCC1UK]

What delusional nonsense.
We are in
We know the terms under which we are in
We know the future terms won't change by voting to stay in.

The outers cannot offer any info whatsoever and resort to infantile scaremongering.

Considering all the inners give us is scare stories about how we will fail and won't be able to trade etc I find this quite hypocritical.

 

[Gelsons Dad]

What delusional nonsense.
We are in
We know the terms under which we are in
We know the future terms won't change by voting to stay in.

The outers cannot offer any info whatsoever and resort to infantile scaremongering.

So would you like to tell me what the EU looks like this time next year after another summer of record breaking illegal immigration. Yet another round of Greek bailouts. Massive stress on the Euro due to EU national debt. A falling economic outlook for most of the EU.

That you think you have any idea how that will impact the EU shows the true state of delusion in this conversation.