Gender Neutral language

[geoff clipp]

It say in the OP, he asked for a male colleagues thoughts and a female colleagues feelings.

Like I said, I'd be interested to know the whole story, context and background. I'm backing out of this thread now though as it didn't take long for the usual people to start misconstruing my points, snidey childish memes to appear and the same fragile characters that always populate these threads to start panicking about completely over the top hypothetical situations. The inconsistency on here amongst many on here when it comes to freedom of speech and freedom of expression is completely ridiculous, I need to probably stay out of these threads in future.

 

[Gelsons Dad]

It say in the OP, he asked for a male colleagues thoughts and a female colleagues feelings.

But I've frequently been asked my feelings on subjects in meetings. Never once did I feel demeaned.
Thoughts and feelings are often synonymous.
She could simply have responded with "Well my thoughts are......" rather than reading her own interpretation into someone else's words.

 

[carlosthejackal]

If he called them all cunts is that gender neutral enough?

Seems fair enough to me

 

[andyhinch]

Yes I do see a problem with compelled speech. I don't think at any point in this thread have i said people should be forced to do or say anything. My initial point was it would be quite good to actually have the full details of the story (my main concern being it's the kind of people seize upon these days without the full facts.)

My point main point is I really don't understand why people have such a massive problem with basic manners. If somebody asks to be referred to in a certain way, or is saying "actually, it makes me feel really shit when i'm addressed like that but nobody has ever asked me about it before", then i don't get why people feel so threatened at being asked to have a think about it. We're not compelled or forced by law to address all kinds of people in all kinds of ways, but we pretty much all do what we're asked out of common courtesy and have done for generations. Some people seem hell bent on not extending that courtesy to any other groups, indeed some people want to be seen to be forced to do so so that they have something to whinge about.

The thing is I don't think people go out trying to be antagonist but how to address someone doesn't tend to be upmost in my mind and I really couldn't give a monkey's how people address me, if your polite that should be more than enough, maybe a quick word afterwards if your a bit sensitive, but I'll reserve my right to call anyone in a meeting a dickhead regardless of gender if they're being one.

 

[SWP's back]

Like I said, I'd be interested to know the whole story, context and background. I'm backing out of this thread now though as it didn't take long for the usual people to start misconstruing my points, snidey childish memes to appear and the same fragile characters that always populate these threads to start panicking about completely over the top hypothetical situations. The inconsistency on here amongst many on here when it comes to freedom of speech and freedom of expression is completely ridiculous, I need to probably stay out of these threads in future.

Not sure why my answer garnered that reaction.

Asking a male for his thoughts and a female for her feelings regarding the same situation has got nothing to do with gender specific pronouns.

 

[Gelsons Dad]

The thing is I don't think people go out trying to be antagonist but how to address someone doesn't tend to be upmost in my mind and I really couldn't give a monkey's how people address me, if your polite that should be more than enough, maybe a quick word afterwards if your a bit sensitive, but I'll reserve my right to call anyone in a meeting a dickhead regardless of gender if they're being one.

Is the correct answer.
Anything else is allowing someone else to subvert your character. Which is considerably worse than using a word in the context to which it has been associated for considerable time but suddenly is considered inappropriate because feelings.

 

[Scottyboi]

Is the correct answer.
Anything else is allowing someone else to subvert your character. Which is considerably worse than using a word in the context to which it has been associated for considerable time but suddenly is considered inappropriate because feelings.

It is people with too much time on their hands seriously. What an existence!

 

[Ghandi's Flip Flops]

Yes I do see a problem with compelled speech. I don't think at any point in this thread have i said people should be forced to do or say anything. My initial point was it would be quite good to actually have the full details of the story (my main concern being it's the kind of people seize upon these days without the full facts.)

My point main point is I really don't understand why people have such a massive problem with basic manners. If somebody asks to be referred to in a certain way, or is saying "actually, it makes me feel really shit when i'm addressed like that but nobody has ever asked me about it before", then i don't get why people feel so threatened at being asked to have a think about it. We're not compelled or forced by law to address all kinds of people in all kinds of ways, but we pretty much all do what we're asked out of common courtesy and have done for generations. Some people seem hell bent on not extending that courtesy to any other groups, indeed some people want to be seen to be forced to do so so that they have something to whinge about.

Most people don't have a problem with basic manners etc, but the courtesy needs to extend both ways. The issue is to do with respect and not being compelled to actually use certain words. The other issue is people using it to gain power over others, or abusing it for nefarious means.

You only need to look at what happened in the US regarding the 'bathroom bill' and what happened with the Target stores. Target basically made a statement that their customers could use whatever bathroom/toilet/changing room they 'identified' with.
This led to a loads of hairy arsed blokes with mobile phones using womens facilities, and security being unable to stop them through fear of contravening their rights.

In essence, to accomodate people who identified as non-binary (which is probably less than 1% of the population), they introduced policy & laws which possibly put other groups like women & children at more risk.

 

[inchy14]

The thing is I don't think people go out trying to be antagonist but how to address someone doesn't tend to be upmost in my mind and I really couldn't give a monkey's how people address me, if your polite that should be more than enough, maybe a quick word afterwards if your a bit sensitive, but I'll reserve my right to call anyone in a meeting a dickhead regardless of gender if they're being one.

Don’t care less either unless they’re actually being rude. Love, darling, dear etc aren’t an issue to me and I’d guess most people. Seem some are just looking to be offended.

 

[andyhinch]

Is the correct answer.
Anything else is allowing someone else to subvert your character. Which is considerably worse than using a word in the context to which it has been associated for considerable time but suddenly is considered inappropriate because feelings.

Exactly people want to be who they are without letting the other person express themselves, where the fuck does it end ? Just be yourself be nice if you can, call them a **** when they deserve it, I'm fucking glad I've retired ;-)