General Election June 8th

[worsleyweb]

Looking forward to the debate tonight. Hope May impresses obviously and gains some ground.

 

[worsleyweb]

yes, it is quite amazing with Brexit, terrorism, the aging population problem, the NHS, zero hour contracts, the gig economy, the rent / homer owner balance, the homeless and all the other issues under discussion, some tit in the government though bringing back Fox hunting was an important vote winner. Sadly, there will be some bellends that vote for them.

Some bellends?

 

[Vic]

The repercussions of raising the minimum wage by such a massive percentage would be wide ranging.
It's very easy to throw out supposed goodies like this, but the vast majority of the wealth created comes
from the myriad small businesses like yours. Labour always views business as some exploitative entity, run by
grasping bastards that can well afford to pay for any amount of public spending, I'm sure your intention to avoid
employing people would be mirrored throughout the country, with catastrophic results.

Massive? Osborne wanted it at £9/hour by 2020. Corbyn says £10. And some would-be employers on here think their inability / unwillingness to pay an extra £2k a year should be decisive in the general election. I've had one guy telling me it would mean other workers would want more (the old differential argument). What? Pay more for skills at a time of skill shortage (to be made worse if we do reduce immigration)? How outrageous!

The word you're accusing him him of misspelling has a silent 'p' at the beginning, not a hard 'f' as you have proposed in your spelling.

Hence, I shall let you figure out whom spelt what correctly.

Spell checker might be a good idea to embellish your 'battle'.

Anyway, carry on as you were.

There's a good chap...

Er, "who spelt what" surely?

 

[Ancient Citizen]

Massive? Osborne wanted it at £9/hour by 2020. Corbyn says £10. And some would-be employers on here think their inability / unwillingness to pay an extra £2k a year should be decisive in the general election. I've had one guy telling me it would mean other workers would want more (the old differential argument). What? Pay more for skills at a time of skill shortage (to be made worse if we do reduce immigration)? How outrageous!

The current minimum wage is, I believe £7,50ph, Corbyn wants it raising to £10, I'll leave you to work out the
percentage increase that represents. You can bang on about skills shortages, immigration, differentials and other
lofty idealistic reasons why it should be implemented, but, in typical socialist fashion, the facts are ignored.
The poster on here has a small business, he wants to employ staff, but wouldn't if this was implemented, because his business can't afford it. This scenario would be repeated in hundreds of thousands of small businesses around the country, with catastrophic consequences for employment and the economy.

 

[cibaman]

Boris Johnson is Foreign Secretary. Diane Abbott is Shadow Home Secretary.

Do we get the politicians we deserve?

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

Boris Johnson is Foreign Secretary. Diane Abbott is Shadow Home Secretary.

Do we get the politicians we deserve?

They are both equally appalling, but in very different ways.

 

[Chippy_boy]

What I am saying is this. Vote Tory and within 3 years Primary Care will be provided by Virgin / Compass / BMI / Spire.

What I'm saying is that is absolute, complete nonsense. There is absolutely ZERO chance of that happening in 3 years, or indeed the next parliament.

The relationship between those providers and secondary NHS services (hospitals) will deteriorate. An appointment with your GP will cost you money.

More scaremongering nonsense, although personally I think some appointments (like when people don't turn up for any good reason) should be chargeable. I can't see it though and there's no indication that it will happen.

Your GP will be employed by a company whose whole reason for existance is to make a profit. That profit has to come from somewhere, and that is our pockets. Our tax/NI won't go down. If you are happy with that then fine. Please don't tell me I have been misled, because I spent 35 years in the NHS, I have close relationships with lots of senior people in the NHS and I think I know what I am talking about.

You're either misled, or being disingenuous. It's one or the other. And by the way profit can come from places other than price increases. It can come from "not being shit". But again there's no way what you suggest is happening, 35 years in the NHS or not, you're just wrong.

 

[Cheesy]

Massive? Osborne wanted it at £9/hour by 2020. Corbyn says £10. And some would-be employers on here think their inability / unwillingness to pay an extra £2k a year should be decisive in the general election.

I suspect that may be aimed at me.

Under the Tories I would have to pay an extra £2000 a year to an employee by the year 2020. Under Labour plans that would be £4500. You obviously have no fucking clue how much that extra £2500 could affect a small business like mine.

I provide services to other small business owners and they all say the same thing. Now, some of them will still employ extra people of course, but they all say they will have to carefully consider whether they do or not.

How would you react if you were told you had to pay an extra £2500 a year in tax? Lucky you if you could afford that. As I said earlier, I've earned approx £10K a year for the last 3 years. Can you not see how damaging that extra £2500 would be?

Finally, I have never said this is the decisive reason I'll be voting Tory in the election. I don't agree with everything in their manifesto but I do agree with far more than in the Labour one.

 

[SWP's back]

No socialism is called communism by capitalists to keep the sheep following and living in fear.

No. Communism is called Communism when it is Communism.

Are you living in fear? Are you a sheep? Are you just a patronising twonk?

 

[Chippy_boy]

I suspect that may be aimed at me.

Under the Tories I would have to pay an extra £2000 a year to an employee by the year 2020. Under Labour plans that would be £4500. You obviously have no fucking clue how much that extra £2500 could affect a small business like mine.

I provide services to other small business owners and they all say the same thing. Now, some of them will still employ extra people of course, but they all say they will have to carefully consider whether they do or not.

How would you react if you were told you had to pay an extra £2500 a year in tax?

Finally, I have never said this is the decisive reason I'll be voting Tory in the election. I don't agree with everything in their manifesto but I do agree with far more than in the Labour one.

It's Labour all over mate. Dangle the sweeties in front of what they hope are a gullible electorate, and sod the consequences. I'm surprised they aren't offering free electric cars for everyone and a free foreign holiday every year.

 

[Vic]

The current minimum wage is, I believe £7,50ph, Corbyn wants it raising to £10, I'll leave you to work out the
percentage increase that represents. You can bang on about skills shortages, immigration, differentials and other
lofty idealistic reasons why it should be implemented, but, in typical socialist fashion, the facts are ignored.
The poster on here has a small business, he wants to employ staff, but wouldn't if this was implemented, because his business can't afford it. This scenario would be repeated in hundreds of thousands of small businesses around the country, with catastrophic consequences for employment and the economy.

33.333333r% I'll be generous and assume you knew that and were being sarky rather than mathematically challenged. But extrapolating a couple of posts on bluemoon into Project Fear (same as with minimum wage in the first place) is simply ridiculous.

 

[jay_mcfc]

The current minimum wage is, I believe £7,50ph, Corbyn wants it raising to £10, I'll leave you to work out the
percentage increase that represents. You can bang on about skills shortages, immigration, differentials and other
lofty idealistic reasons why it should be implemented, but, in typical socialist fashion, the facts are ignored.
The poster on here has a small business, he wants to employ staff, but wouldn't if this was implemented, because his business can't afford it. This scenario would be repeated in hundreds of thousands of small businesses around the country, with catastrophic consequences for employment and the economy.

That would leave someone who worked 40 hours per week and extra £5200 better off per year pre tax, so let's say £3500-4000 post tax and NI. Do you think they stash that money under the mattress to save for a rainy day?

 

[urban genie]

Boris Johnson is Foreign Secretary. Diane Abbott is Shadow Home Secretary.

Do we get the politicians we deserve?

Tbf it would be hard to pick any decent ones on both side.

Fallon, green, hammond & rudd are shocking

Burgon, long-bailey & rayner can mess uo in interviews, but are only 2 years into the job so still green.


Labour have better options as home sec, unfortunately those other option are mainly the mard arses who threw their toys out because they didn't get the leader they wanted.
Imagine if the twats like benn, chuka, cooper, and even milliband had acted like responsible party members and let themselves be available and loyal, this tory shambles would be dead in the water.

 

[Vic]

I suspect that may be aimed at me.

Under the Tories I would have to pay an extra £2000 a year to an employee by the year 2020. Under Labour plans that would be £4500. You obviously have no fucking clue how much that extra £2500 could affect a small business like mine.

I provide services to other small business owners and they all say the same thing. Now, some of them will still employ extra people of course, but they all say they will have to carefully consider whether they do or not.

How would you react if you were told you had to pay an extra £2500 a year in tax? Lucky you if you could afford that. As I said earlier, I've earned approx £10K a year for the last 3 years. Can you not see how damaging that extra £2500 would be?

Finally, I have never said this is the decisive reason I'll be voting Tory in the election. I don't agree with everything in their manifesto but I do agree with far more than in the Labour one.

Well, get a proper job!

Seriously, I wasn't doubting your circumstances, and I know how many SMEs fail. I'm not sure what that says about "private enterprise" and supply/demand for whatever you're trying to sell. All I'm saying is that Corbyn proposes an 11.11% increase on what Osborne proposed and it's somehow as if Stalin was standing.

 

[Ricster]

No. Communism is called Communism when it is Communism.

Are you living in fear? Are you a sheep? Are you just a patronising twonk?

If you're going to name call..........again. (Let's be honest not the first time youve done it on this board and I understand the mods now let you and your clique away with it.)
At least use an adult name and risk your bluemoon future instead of using a word from one of your children or their classmates.
And now, yes, you can call me patronising :)
I'm actually very impressed it took you 421 pages to find a reason to insult. It never usually stopped you before.
Yep patronising again :)
Much love xxx

 

[Ifwecouldjust.......]

Massive? Osborne wanted it at £9/hour by 2020. Corbyn says £10. And some would-be employers on here think their inability / unwillingness to pay an extra £2k a year should be decisive in the general election. I've had one guy telling me it would mean other workers would want more (the old differential argument). What? Pay more for skills at a time of skill shortage (to be made worse if we do reduce immigration)? How outrageous!


Er, "who spelt what" surely?

And were exactly in the UK can you afford to feed yourself and your family , travel to work and buy / rent a house on this 'Living Wage'?

 

[SWP's back]

If you're going to name call..........again. (Let's be honest not the first time youve done it on this board and I understand the mods now let you and your clique away with it.)
At least use an adult name and risk your bluemoon future instead of using a word from one of your children or their classmates.
And now, yes, you can call me patronising :)
I'm actually very impressed it took you 421 pages to find a reason to insult. It never usually stopped you before.
Yep patronising again :)
Much love xxx

How are the sheep in fear?

Is the fact you're not in fear because you are super brave?

Do you still think communism is a synonym of socialism and you don't see or understand what differentiates the two?

Given the mild toy throwing it's a good job I kept it to twonk.

 

[Ricster]

How are the sheep in fear?

Is the fact you're not in fear because you are super brave?

Do you still think communism is a synonym of socialism and you don't see or understand what differentiates the two?

Given the mild toy throwing it's a good job I kept it to twonk.

Haha.

I'm not super brave just won't live in fear and probably helps that I don't spend any time in front of the media.

As for you commy question, go further back and you will see it wasn't me who thought it was a synonym nor did I ever say it was.

Keep clutching

 

[urban genie]

The current minimum wage is, I believe £7,50ph, Corbyn wants it raising to £10, I'll leave you to work out the
percentage increase that represents. You can bang on about skills shortages, immigration, differentials and other
lofty idealistic reasons why it should be implemented, but, in typical socialist fashion, the facts are ignored.
The poster on here has a small business, he wants to employ staff, but wouldn't if this was implemented, because his business can't afford it. This scenario would be repeated in hundreds of thousands of small businesses around the country, with catastrophic consequences for employment and the economy.

Many cities , us, newcastle, edingborough, birmingham etc have their own living wages that are set locally and a lot of businesses adopt them (Manchesters is £8.70 at present)

Londons living wage is £9.75 and again many businesses use this instead of the minimiun wage.

This £10 is to come in 2020 where the living wage outside london is projected to be £8.75-£9 an hr anyway.

Also part of the pledge is to help any small business that may struggle when this initially is introduced through the new regional, natiaonal investment banks amd crack down on large companies takong tge piss with late payments.

Low wage is always gonna be a problem, on all sides employer and employee both good or bad for some, but better pay, should reduce the need to pay out some welfare and increase consumer spending, hopefully in the small businesses affected.

 

[Chippy_boy]

Haha.

I'm not super brave just won't live in fear and probably helps that I don't spend any time in front of the media.

As for you commy question, go further back and you will see it wasn't me who thought it was a synonym nor did I ever say it was.

Keep clutching

Moot point you two.

Corbyn is a communist anyway. He's in favour of a return to clause iv, which means he wants "common ownership of the means of production, distribution and exchange".

As opposed to communism's, "methods of production are owned and controlled by all its members"

Spot the difference? No, neither can I. He knows communism is a dirty word in western politics so he hides in the Labour party, but he's as left as left can be under the skin. Little wonder the party is riddled with Trotskyists.

What people fail to consider is that the Labour Party's manifesto is almost certainly watered down to what Corbyn and McDonnell think might possibly be popular. But God help all of us if they actually got in. They would show their true left colours then, and I think that's very red indeed.