How much will J.Navas improve the team over J.Milner?

green pennies said:
Navas' crossing is on another level completely. Pure class.

And this is coming from a big Milner fan. But while James could probably play any position on the pitch serviceably, ideally he's a central midfielder. Hard to compare him with an out and out pacey winger/crossing specialist like Navas.

He has played in central midfield away against united but I think he's equally as good in both positions. He plays on the right most of the time though because we have Yaya, Rodwell, Fernandinho and Barry in central midfield. Same thing with Navas as he has played on the left in the past and as a supporting striker.
 
I hate to say it, but come May 2014, we'll all be quite sick of Navas. He's hugely frustrating, and while he will provide the width that many City fans have craved for years, he's not a good enough, or intelligent enough player to provide a genuinely top class option out wide. He's so quick, but it's one thing being quick, and one thing knowing how to use it. He beats a man on the outside and delivers a cross a few times per game, but the number of times he'll brainlessly run himself into dead ends is heartbreaking. His delivery is ok, nothing to shout about, but I do expect him to pick up a fair few assists by virtue of his pace and fairly good delivery alone.

As we're all aware, we play a very distinct, compact game, focused on central areas. In turn, teams pack the central areas and leave space out wide. The belief amongst City fans is that Navas is going to hug the touchline while everyone else is central and we're suddenly going to have much more space in the middle because someone will have to mark Navas. Wrong. Full backs will leave him out there, there's no reason to mark him, by the time a ball is sprayed out wide to him the full back will have had time to split from the CBs, the CBs will have shuffled across, and the danger will be averted. There's a reason why in our system players don't hug the touchline, it's because it's ineffective to do so.

What was noticeable against Arsenal was that we were determined to get the ball wide, keep the ball wide and put more crosses into the box. Whether this was a Pellegrini tactic, or whether this was a product of having two static strikers in the box and fewer options centrally is yet to be seen; I'll never know what Pellegrini instructed the boys to do, but should this pattern of play continue throughout the season it'll be evident that it's a tactical ploy. In this instance, Navas' value to the side will be increased. However, once Aguero returns - and Jovetic is integrated into the side - I expect play to be focused through the central areas again.

What Milner brings to the side? Well he's more intelligent for starters, he'll use the ball much more effectively and will play the percentages game. Years ago Milner was the type who'd run aimlessly down the wing into cul-de-sacs, a la Navas, but he's taken a lot of that out of his game and developed well as a footballer. Milner is also better technically and will score more goals. I'd be quite happy to see Milner play on the right ahead of Navas at times this season, but Navas deserves the chance to prove himself. Milner proved himself last season, he was one of our best performers, imo the pressure's all on Navas. As I've said before, and a few have also highlighted here, Navas will provide us with much quicker counter attacks and transitions, which will be essential in the big European games.
 
If we want to play fast and incisive attacking football, Navas is a big step up. He beats his man, gets in better crosses, and is a more intelligent player.

But of course, Milner has some great qualities as a 'defensive winger'... so yeah, it depends entirely on the situation and game.

Would not surprise me to see Milner tried as a right wing-back in future when Micah inevitably gets injured again.
 
I'd like to see us start with Navas. Yes Milner provides better cover but I'm not too worried about Newcastle at home. If we were playing Swansea, rags, Chelsea, etc.. then Milner might be more prudent. The last 2 seasons when we haven't scored early the team has had issues with that and starts forcing things, guys start trying to do too much etc.. and we've had trouble scoring. I'd like to see us go with our most potent team, try and score early, gain confidence and set the tempo for the game. Then we can bring in Milner later to hold the lead if need be.
 
Chalk and cheese. Almost like comparing Hart with Agueroooooooo. My money is on Jesus as he's much more of a wild card but hopefully both will make a big contribution and command respect.
 
sir baconface said:
Chalk and cheese. Almost like comparing Hart with Agueroooooooo. My money is on Jesus as he's much more of a wild card but hopefully both will make a big contribution and command respect.

Dead right, Sir B! We attempt too many comparisons on this forum where the two being compared are not 'like'! Much will depend on who we are playing and what you want from an attacking set up. We have been desperately short of pace and trickery up front for a season and a half, and I am hoping that Navas can provide it AND the strikers can convert the trickery.

I think much of this season will depend on how clinical our strikers are. If we can emulate the scoring feats of the first half of 2011/12 season it will take a bloody good side to top us!
 
Not really, Navas and Milner are fighting for the same place in the side, the topic creator asked us whether we think Navas will improve on Milner, which leads us to discuss what qualities the players can bring to the side. Nothing wrong with discussing that, he's not asking for ratings out of 10 on individual attributes, we all know they're different players, we just have to debate how and why we think each player could have a possible impact next season.
 
Joburg Hero said:
I hate to say it, but come May 2014, we'll all be quite sick of Navas. He's hugely frustrating, and while he will provide the width that many City fans have craved for years, he's not a good enough, or intelligent enough player to provide a genuinely top class option out wide. He's so quick, but it's one thing being quick, and one thing knowing how to use it. He beats a man on the outside and delivers a cross a few times per game, but the number of times he'll brainlessly run himself into dead ends is heartbreaking. His delivery is ok, nothing to shout about, but I do expect him to pick up a fair few assists by virtue of his pace and fairly good delivery alone.

As we're all aware, we play a very distinct, compact game, focused on central areas. In turn, teams pack the central areas and leave space out wide. The belief amongst City fans is that Navas is going to hug the touchline while everyone else is central and we're suddenly going to have much more space in the middle because someone will have to mark Navas. Wrong. Full backs will leave him out there, there's no reason to mark him, by the time a ball is sprayed out wide to him the full back will have had time to split from the CBs, the CBs will have shuffled across, and the danger will be averted. There's a reason why in our system players don't hug the touchline, it's because it's ineffective to do so.

What was noticeable against Arsenal was that we were determined to get the ball wide, keep the ball wide and put more crosses into the box. Whether this was a Pellegrini tactic, or whether this was a product of having two static strikers in the box and fewer options centrally is yet to be seen; I'll never know what Pellegrini instructed the boys to do, but should this pattern of play continue throughout the season it'll be evident that it's a tactical ploy. In this instance, Navas' value to the side will be increased. However, once Aguero returns - and Jovetic is integrated into the side - I expect play to be focused through the central areas again.

What Milner brings to the side? Well he's more intelligent for starters, he'll use the ball much more effectively and will play the percentages game. Years ago Milner was the type who'd run aimlessly down the wing into cul-de-sacs, a la Navas, but he's taken a lot of that out of his game and developed well as a footballer. Milner is also better technically and will score more goals. I'd be quite happy to see Milner play on the right ahead of Navas at times this season, but Navas deserves the chance to prove himself. Milner proved himself last season, he was one of our best performers, imo the pressure's all on Navas. As I've said before, and a few have also highlighted here, Navas will provide us with much quicker counter attacks and transitions, which will be essential in the big European games.

Wow. Some fucking shit here. The guy who is literally the only option that Spain will use for width and always makes the Spain bench in big games and usually comes on is shit.

Idiocy.
 
andrewmswift said:
Joburg Hero said:
I hate to say it, but come May 2014, we'll all be quite sick of Navas. He's hugely frustrating, and while he will provide the width that many City fans have craved for years, he's not a good enough, or intelligent enough player to provide a genuinely top class option out wide. He's so quick, but it's one thing being quick, and one thing knowing how to use it. He beats a man on the outside and delivers a cross a few times per game, but the number of times he'll brainlessly run himself into dead ends is heartbreaking. His delivery is ok, nothing to shout about, but I do expect him to pick up a fair few assists by virtue of his pace and fairly good delivery alone.

As we're all aware, we play a very distinct, compact game, focused on central areas. In turn, teams pack the central areas and leave space out wide. The belief amongst City fans is that Navas is going to hug the touchline while everyone else is central and we're suddenly going to have much more space in the middle because someone will have to mark Navas. Wrong. Full backs will leave him out there, there's no reason to mark him, by the time a ball is sprayed out wide to him the full back will have had time to split from the CBs, the CBs will have shuffled across, and the danger will be averted. There's a reason why in our system players don't hug the touchline, it's because it's ineffective to do so.

What was noticeable against Arsenal was that we were determined to get the ball wide, keep the ball wide and put more crosses into the box. Whether this was a Pellegrini tactic, or whether this was a product of having two static strikers in the box and fewer options centrally is yet to be seen; I'll never know what Pellegrini instructed the boys to do, but should this pattern of play continue throughout the season it'll be evident that it's a tactical ploy. In this instance, Navas' value to the side will be increased. However, once Aguero returns - and Jovetic is integrated into the side - I expect play to be focused through the central areas again.

What Milner brings to the side? Well he's more intelligent for starters, he'll use the ball much more effectively and will play the percentages game. Years ago Milner was the type who'd run aimlessly down the wing into cul-de-sacs, a la Navas, but he's taken a lot of that out of his game and developed well as a footballer. Milner is also better technically and will score more goals. I'd be quite happy to see Milner play on the right ahead of Navas at times this season, but Navas deserves the chance to prove himself. Milner proved himself last season, he was one of our best performers, imo the pressure's all on Navas. As I've said before, and a few have also highlighted here, Navas will provide us with much quicker counter attacks and transitions, which will be essential in the big European games.

Wow. Some fucking shit here. The guy who is literally the only option that Spain will use for width and always makes the Spain bench in big games and usually comes on is shit.

Idiocy.
Pedro has been Spain's #1 wide man for years. I've provided a detailed opinion and backed it up. You've provided "well he comes on as a sub for Spain now and then". He's not shit, not sure where I said "shit" exactly, he's just a rich man's Aaron Lennon. Pace but no brain, dangerous yet frustrating. One day we'll be celebrating his effectiveness, the next we'll be wondering what he's done all game apart from lose the ball.
 

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