Is fascism back with us?

[Saddleworth2]

A kind of populist nationalism has certainly emerged, one that seems predicated on the claim of its representatives to have a direct and charismatic connection to 'the will of the people' and that frequently gets defined in narrowly ethnic terms that exclude large sections of the population.

Here I am not just thinking of the UK and characters like Farage, and also Johnson with his disparaging and inappropriate remarks about Salafi women that were clearly designed to attract support from the Tommy Robinson crowd, but also of the transformation of more traditional right-wing parties like the Swiss People's Party, the Austrian People's Party, as well as the greater prominence enjoyed by more radical ones like, say, Lega Nord, the French Front National, and Jobbik. Orban's Fidesz party in Hungary is another example, along with the rise of the alt-right movement/QAnon in the USA, Trump's divisive presidency, and the politics of characters like Putin, Bolsonaro, and Duterte.

One way to look at this development is in terms of denial (including denial of the fact of climate change).
In our post-fact society, the narrative would go something like this:

The need for facts in politics is predicated on a vision of a better future. They are required to underpin an aspiring politician’s vision, to demonstrate that it is achievable and will not collapse. But what happens when the notion that free markets can deliver prosperity collapses, as it did in 2008? What do you turn to when you start to realize that this project has only increased economic inequality globally?

When that future disappears, what is the point of facts? Why would you want them when they tell you that your children will be poorer than you, or that climate change will have maybe the last word? Why should you trust the purveyors of facts, namely, 'left-wing' academics or that cabal of scientists who work for the IPCC (or for SAGE if you are an anti-vaxxer)?

Here's a possible answer: you might turn to politicians who make a show of disparaging facts, who liberate us from any appeal to an evidence-based future. Instead, you turn to what Yale historian Tim Snyder has referred to as 'the politics of eternity', and Svetlana Boym as 'restorative nostalgia'.

If you are Putin, you get your troll farms and media to promote a nostalgic vision of a restored Russian empire. If you are Trump, it involves making America great again. Turkish and Hungarian media promote similar phantoms, and with us in the UK it's about marching brightly into a future in which we have taken back control of something or other, as part of a process of levelling up.

Of course, there's nothing wrong with getting a bit nostalgic now and again. It only becomes dangerous when it entails the striving to recover a lost past in a manner that substitutes an unreflective emotivism for critical thinking, and the denial of an unpalatable future.

For anyone interested in delving into all this more deeply, I would recommend the following books:

Here's Snyder explaining the contrast between the politics of eternity and the politics of inevitability. Been a while since I read his book but from what I recall, it's a good place to start.



Note that Snyder's thesis has attracted its fair share of criticism. This can usually be found by Googling for reviews of the above publication.

Interesting post mate.

 

[Saddleworth2]

Flags everywhere, calls for the national anthem to be played at schools/on the BBC

Patels new Borders Act, leaving the ECHR

People in dinghies

Older white men worrying about their waning influence,

The Mail.

Dinghies bringing in terrorists, Russians,

This is missing. The Catholic Church supported the Nazi's, The Catholic Church in Ireland gave its blessing to people who went and fought for Franco.

And given contracts that are ridiculous for Things like PPE

Been happening since the days of Thatcher. Destruction and/or restriction of Union power is anti democratic

Gove said " we have had enough of experts" Prof Whitty is dismissed as a crank.

See Patel.

We have possibly the most corrupt government in British history. Cronyism is rife, so rife that i think it was Hancocks pub landlord got a contract.

I wouldn't argue with the examples you quote. The question though is, although it demonstrates some fascist behaviours, is it a fascist government?

I think on balance not. Greedy, corrupt, incompetent, displaying moral turpitude, in love with power for power sake, elitist....but I really don't think they are fascists. Lets see the manner of Johnson's exit. Will it be accompanied by public violence. I really doubt it.

 

[Octavian]

Describe Western culture?

politically I’d say liberal democracy which has a bigger focus on the individual than the East and other parts of the world, who focus more on the collective.

From a non political point of view outside of language and stuff like that I love how we socialise in the west and I prefer our food, fashion, hobbies, working practices… I’d be absolutely fucking lost in the Middle East or China.

 

[Octavian]

I wouldn't argue with the examples you quote. The question though is, although it demonstrates some fascist behaviours, is it a fascist government?

I think on balance not. Greedy, corrupt, incompetent, displaying moral turpitude, in love with power for power sake, elitist....but I really don't think they are fascists. Lets see the manner of Johnson's exit. Will it be accompanied by public violence. I really doubt it.

They’re cunts but they’re not fascist cunts

 

[Rascal]

I wouldn't argue with the examples you quote. The question though is, although it demonstrates some fascist behaviours, is it a fascist government?

I think on balance not. Greedy, corrupt, incompetent, displaying moral turpitude, in love with power for power sake, elitist....but I really don't think they are fascists. Lets see the manner of Johnson's exit. Will it be accompanied by public violence. I really doubt it.

I said when Johnson came to power i feared the creep of fascism. We are not a fascist state, but everyday we creep a little closer.

 

[ZenHalfTimeCrock]

This is missing.

It isn't as a more global phenomenon.

Read it a while back. Unfortunately can't remember what was said in the chapter on the UK but from memory, I think the author of it wrote that the overall thesis of the book was less applicable in our case. Might dig out my copy a bit later to remind myself. But here's a synopsis:

'Western democracies are experiencing a new wave of right-wing populism that seeks to mobilise religion for its own ends. With chapters on the United States, Britain, France, Italy, Austria, the Netherlands, Poland and Israel, Saving the People asks how populist movements have used religion for their own ends and how church leaders react to them. The authors contend that religion is more about belonging than belief for populists, with religious identities and traditions being deployed to define who can and cannot be part of ‘the people’. This in turn helps many populists to claim that native Christian communities are being threatened by a creeping and highly aggressive process of Islamisation, with Muslims becoming a key ‘enemy of the people’. While Church elites generally condemn this instrumental use of religions, populists take little heed, presenting themselves as the true saviours of the people. The policy implications of this phenomenon are significant, which makes this book all the more timely and relevant to current debate.'

 

[Bazzmand Show]

Agreed. So there isn’t really too much difference between the extremes of left and right.

There is actually a political theory called the 'horseshoe' which states this exact thing. That the far left and far right actually start to closely resemble one another.

 

[Rascal]

It isn't as a more global phenomenon.

Read it a while back. Unfortunately can't remember what was said in the chapter on the UK but from memory, I think the author of it wrote that the overall thesis of the book was less applicable in the case of the UK. Might dig out my copy a bit later to remind myself. But here's a synopsis:

'Western democracies are experiencing a new wave of right-wing populism that seeks to mobilise religion for its own ends. With chapters on the United States, Britain, France, Italy, Austria, the Netherlands, Poland and Israel, Saving the People asks how populist movements have used religion for their own ends and how church leaders react to them. The authors contend that religion is more about belonging than belief for populists, with religious identities and traditions being deployed to define who can and cannot be part of ‘the people’. This in turn helps many populists to claim that native Christian communities are being threatened by a creeping and highly aggressive process of Islamisation, with Muslims becoming a key ‘enemy of the people’. While Church elites generally condemn this instrumental use of religions, populists take little heed, presenting themselves as the true saviours of the people. The policy implications of this phenomenon are significant, which makes this book all the more timely and relevant to current debate.'

I was tempted to use demonisation of Islam but was thinking in terms of Christianity and now after your post, i see why i should have used it.You often see in Populist language that Christians couldnt do this and that in a Muslim country, despite the fact their is an Archbishop of Lahore in Pakistan, Thanks for the post pal as ever, you are always enlightening,

 

[Saddleworth2]

They’re cunts but they’re not fascist cunts

As a government I tend to agree just now. There are one or two of them as individuals I would have doubts about though.

 

[metalblue]

Did you get that out of the Beano?

Happy new year to you mate!! Not seen you around, hope you keeping well

So which bits about communism aren’t accurate ?

is a form of far-left - check
authoritarian - check
dictatorial power - check
forcible suppression of opposition - check
strong regimentation of society and the economy - check

All very observable with the communist states that exist today. I know you’re probably sitting there saying but it’ll be different with a communist party in Britain… despite all evidence that political theory bower great it looks on paper is the first casualty when power is achieved.

If you think a communist regime in the UK (or anywhere else) would be all cuddly and democratic you’re living in cloud cuckoo land mate.