It's off fury v haye.

[NipHolmes]

Fundamentally boxing suffers from the following, if solved it'd give boxing a boost if health

One boxing organisation instead of 6+ per division.
Fight ranking system and compulsory defenses.
Less power to TV companies.
Promoters not allowed to be managers of boxer, conflicts of interest and hold fighter back. Kimmel Kessler didn't fight for 2 years due to promotional problems!
Less divisions in lower weight categories.

 

[oman0115]

Great choice of argument, the biggest star in boxing :/

Why not compare Andre Ward is one of boxings best P4P fighters yet can't even sell out a home town arena. Chad Dawson and Tim Bradley are no different.

-- Wed Jun 26, 2013 4:39 pm --

If boxing is doing so well why did ITV pull out? Why did Sky sacrifice half the budget to F1 instead of investing money into F1. Why did Frank Maloney go bankrupt? Why did Frank Warren do the same and open a new company to start again and even one for his son Francis?

There have been plenty of boxers through out history who've suffered the same fate as Andre Ward. Lennox Lewis even in his early career struggled to sell venues & PPV, Froch up until recently wasn't mainstream. Marketed correctly Ward would be a star but he isn't. Maloney & Warren may have murky dealings, but how do you explain Golden Boy's or Matchrooms success? I think you're picking the finer points and missing the bigger picture.

Goldenboy is down to ODLH being Beckham of boxing. To their credit they make good fights but they burn fighters out quickly. Jacobs v Pirog, Ortiz v Maidana and Khan v Garcia when he needed building after Peterson loss for example. Very few of their fighters have prolonged success and end up burned out quickly.

Matchroom came up with the bastardised boxing concept of Prizefighter and they've been fortunate with it's success. They also came in with good fights but their frequency has tailed off somewhat because they too suffered with burn out. Also they have monopolised the Sky tv dates so are helped out by that. Few people will pay for Boxnation, ESPN, Premier Sports and Primetime and will just stick to what's on Sky Sports.

I hardly cherrypicked examples, both are world champs and in the top 10 p4p list. Ward won the super 6 and KO'ed Chad Dawson who dropped down a division to make the fight but was considered the best LHW in the world by many.

You've hardly come up with anything there other than trying to give reasons to undermine GB & Matchroom. I pay for Boxnation lots of hardcore fans do, it's for hardcore boxing fans not mainstream. Yet to see any evidence to support the notion boxing is dying.

 

[NipHolmes]

There have been plenty of boxers through out history who've suffered the same fate as Andre Ward. Lennox Lewis even in his early career struggled to sell venues & PPV, Froch up until recently wasn't mainstream. Marketed correctly Ward would be a star but he isn't. Maloney & Warren may have murky dealings, but how do you explain Golden Boy's or Matchrooms success? I think you're picking the finer points and missing the bigger picture.

Goldenboy is down to ODLH being Beckham of boxing. To their credit they make good fights but they burn fighters out quickly. Jacobs v Pirog, Ortiz v Maidana and Khan v Garcia when he needed building after Peterson loss for example. Very few of their fighters have prolonged success and end up burned out quickly.

Matchroom came up with the bastardised boxing concept of Prizefighter and they've been fortunate with it's success. They also came in with good fights but their frequency has tailed off somewhat because they too suffered with burn out. Also they have monopolised the Sky tv dates so are helped out by that. Few people will pay for Boxnation, ESPN, Premier Sports and Primetime and will just stick to what's on Sky Sports.

I hardly cherrypicked examples, both are world champs and in the top 10 p4p list. Ward won the super 6 and KO'ed Chad Dawson who dropped down a division to make the fight but was considered the best LHW in the world by many.

You've hardly come up with anything there other than trying to give reasons to undermine GB & Matchroom. I pay for Boxnation lots of hardcore fans do, it's for hardcore boxing fans not mainstream. Yet to see any evidence to support the notion boxing is dying.

No, I've pointed out good reasons, nothing to undermine nothing. Stated their failings and also boxings failings in my other post.

You've hit the nail on the the head yourself with the hardcore remark. I'm a hardcore too but it's the mainstream casuals that count. That's why unpopular but ultra talented fighters are left in the 'who needs em club'.

 

[argyle]

I don't think anyone is claiming boxing is in a particular boom period but the aligation was that boxing is dying out. And the fella quite rightly said there is little evidence of this. Boxing has survived pretty much under the same rules for 150 years and there's been plenty of swings in popularity in that time. I'm quite confident it will continue to survive for a good while yet.

I've no beef with MMA. Not really my cup of tea but that's neither here nor there. If it does turn out to be more than a passing fad, fair enough but it has a long, long way to go to match the popularity of boxing. Certainly in this country.

Oh yeah I agree that MMA in this country hasn't taken off. In the States, Canada and Brazil it by and large smokes boxing, besides the Mayweather and Pacquiao fights etc of course.

I haven't said boxing is dying, I think it's going through a significant dip. It really should be doing much better than it is.

In any case back on topic, is the Fury v Haye fight off completely?<br /><br />-- Wed Jun 26, 2013 6:27 pm --<br /><br />

Fundamentally boxing suffers from the following, if solved it'd give boxing a boost if health

One boxing organisation instead of 6+ per division.
Fight ranking system and compulsory defenses.
Less power to TV companies.
Promoters not allowed to be managers of boxer, conflicts of interest and hold fighter back. Kimmel Kessler didn't fight for 2 years due to promotional problems!
Less divisions in lower weight categories.

Agree with all of this, especially compulsory defenses and promoters not being allowed to be managers.

 

[Corky]

Of course it would be better with one main sanctioning body, but I would welcome more weight divisions at the top end to make it more competitive.

Get rid of cruiser as a name, leave light heavy as it is, intermediate heavy 13st 7lb, Heavy 15st 0lb and Super Heavy above 15st.

This would mean a decent 6 ' 3" heavyweight doesn't give away 3st against a giant, and the gaps above light heavy would be 14lbs, 21lbs then no limit, instead of just 25lbs then no limit.

 

[Never Mind The Pollocks]

Fury just tweeted:


'Tyson Fury ‏@Tyson_Fury 2m
Listen up pussy. Sign the contract. So we can get down to real business in the ring. 50/50 agreed 6 week ago! Lets fight & now mr jungle.'

 

[Trollsmoan]

Fury just tweeted:


'Tyson Fury ‏@Tyson_Fury 2m
Listen up pussy. Sign the contract. So we can get down to real business in the ring. 50/50 agreed 6 week ago! Lets fight & now mr jungle.'

Let's hope so, I know most of it's for show but nothing like a bit of bad blood to spice things up!...Haye will still win though!

 

[conormcfc]

Attendances and TV/PPV money are down significantly.

Mayweather/Alvarez later this year is expected to break PPV records.

Great choice of argument, the biggest star in boxing :/

Why not compare Andre Ward is one of boxings best P4P fighters yet can't even sell out a home town arena. Chad Dawson and Tim Bradley are no different.

-- Wed Jun 26, 2013 4:39 pm --

If boxing is doing so well why did ITV pull out? Why did Sky sacrifice half the budget to F1 instead of investing money into F1. Why did Frank Maloney go bankrupt? Why did Frank Warren do the same and open a new company to start again and even one for his son Francis?

He said PPV sales were down and I mentioned that the PPV record has a very good chance of being broken later this year. Considering we're in the age of free streaming I think it's a very good choice of argument. Record numbers of people want to watch Boxing in 2013. There have been bigger fights in the past that won't sell as much.

There have been loads of top p4p guys like Andre Ward in the past that couldn't sell out a phonebox, there was never a period where every single top fighter was a draw. Doesn't mean the sport is waning in popularity because certain fighters don't have pulling power.

Just look at this forum. 5 pages generated for 2 good-not-great domestic fighters possibly fighting later on in the year, which won't even be for a title. Then there's a thread about this Saturday's UFC event on the first page, a card in which arguably the greatest MMA fighter of all time is fighting on. 3 pages of discussion thus far.

Boxing is fine.

 

[bluemc1]

Of course it would be better with one main sanctioning body, but I would welcome more weight divisions at the top end to make it more competitive.

Get rid of cruiser as a name, leave light heavy as it is, intermediate heavy 13st 7lb, Heavy 15st 0lb and Super Heavy above 15st.

This would mean a decent 6 ' 3" heavyweight doesn't give away 3st against a giant, and the gaps above light heavy would be 14lbs, 21lbs then no limit, instead of just 25lbs then no limit.

i always felt Herbie Hibe had that problem, Hide V Haye now id like to see that fight, dont blink,

 

[Blue Til Death]

Its a sad indication of how boxing is these days when a lump like fury tries to dictate those ridiculous terms to an ex world champion at two weights.
All it says is, I do not fancy fighting you because you will beat me, fury is an ok boxer at a nationwide level but even in these talent barren times, he's still nowhere near today's upper eschelon of mediocrity.
He should stick to fighting bums for a while then semi retirement watching people being sick on the waltza's.....Lennox Lewis must be laughing into his beer!!!!