Keir Starmer

[Ban-jani]

The short (and exceptionally tongue-in-cheek) version? Far-left Communists are anti-capitalist, they see Jews around the world as supporting Capitalism, cite conspiracy theories that they "own all the banks and money", and a number of people possessing these views and conpiracies have infiltrated the party and under Corbyn's Labour, they became more emboldened in voicing them online.



It turns out that a number of Labour Party members/advocates still believe in old, outdated and antisemitic conspiracy tropes about "the Jews running the world" or "the Jews are responsible for every social tragedy" or "the Jews are the cause of all wars". Yes, these are actual conspiracies that go back hundreds of years, so it's not a recent thing, namely the one I underlined. "The Jews are secretly orchestrating a race war to stay rich!" You know, that sort of ignorance.

Peake's idiotic attempt to connect George Floyd's murder to 'Israel Secret Service' tactics, indicating that Israel was in some way responsible and therefore is a reprehensible community, is a prime example of this tone deaf attitude that has surfaced about "Jews being responsible for every national social tragedy in history". RLB supporting the article, and thus the comments and then failing to apologise after being called out on it, is an example of an attitude that has plagued recent Labour MP's.

There's a long standing narrative within the more extremist, far-left, anti-capitalist elements that Jewish banks, businesses and employers are continuing supporting capitalist regimes across the world, so they are considered by some as "the enemy within". In the last few years this element has become more vocal and a lot of sources keep pointing back to Labour members, be they fringe or connected to the party itself. The defence is always "we're not critical of Jews, we're critical of Israeli govt!" as a cop out, but the fact is that Peake mentioning the 'Israeli Secret Services' was not a critique of the Israeli govt. It was an example of a belief in a conspiracy theory that Israel has helped train the US in a tactic solely designed to incite a racial divide in the US.

Bang on.

Look at the mural Corbyn openly supported.

It’s straight out of the Joseph Goebbels school of propaganda.

 

[twosips]

Cheers all, really useful. Appreciated. I guess I'm a little baffled because I've literally voted labour all my life, as have most of my friends and family, and I don't think I've had one sincere, long conversation with any of them about Israel/Palestine. It's obviously been vaguely topical at times, so I know roughly about it, but any convo around that has genuinely moved on within a minute or two. It's never felt like a subject that's anywhere near the top of the agenda for your average labour voter, if that makes sense? I can't say I hold any notable opinion about anyone Jewish at all, cos why would I? Never crossed my mind to. It just doesn't seem to affect my life (well, knowingly at least) at all - not that I don't care, but you know what I mean. Hence my confusion as to why its such a big deal for many. Those points make sense though, so thank you.

 

[Metal Biker]

Bang on.

Look at the mural Corbyn openly supported.

It’s straight out of the Joseph Goebbels school of propaganda.

Ah yes, the mural depiciting "Illuminati Jews all with stereotypical big noses, backdropped against oil cooling towers spewing toxic clouds, sitting around the Monopoly board, resting on the heaving backs of oppressed Black, Brown and White people, because all they love is money".

Far-right/far-left; both anti-semitic, but for entirely different reasons.

 

[Ban-jani]

Cheers all, really useful. Appreciated. I guess I'm a little baffled because I've literally voted labour all my life, as have most of my friends and family, and I don't think I've had one sincere, long conversation with any of them about Israel/Palestine. It's obviously been vaguely topical at times, so I know roughly about it, but any convo around that has genuinely moved on within a minute or two. It's never felt like a subject that's anywhere near the top of the agenda for your average labour voter, if that makes sense? I can't say I hold any notable opinion about anyone Jewish at all, cos why would I? Never crossed my mind to. It just doesn't seem to affect my life (well, knowingly at least) at all. Hence my confusion as to why its such a big deal for many. Those points make sense though, so thank you.

It’s part of the problem as to why they got battered in December.

The average working class northern bloke just wants to get on and do alright. A lot are patriotic and won’t ever support fringe groups.

Labour electing Corbyn actually allowed some traditional and decent socialists back in but unfortunately many aren’t like that and are oddballs, obsessed with identity politics and Israel.

I’m from a traditional Labour seat and the Tories won in December. I know for a fact pro nouns and the Palestine conflict aren’t on the lips of people but wanting Brexit was.

 

[Ban-jani]

Ah yes, the mural depiciting "Illuminati Jews all with stereotypical big noses, backdropped against oil cooling towers spewing toxic clouds, sitting around the Monopoly board, resting on the heaving backs of oppressed Black, Brown and White people, because all they love is money".

Far-right/far-left; both anti-semitic, but for entirely different reasons.

I would argue for very similar reasons actually mate, the Nazis thought the Jews were controlling the banks too.

PB will be able to give a very good insight but I don’t want to go around tagging him every time antisemitism comes up on the board.

 

[Metal Biker]

Cheers all, really useful. Appreciated. I guess I'm a little baffled because I've literally voted labour all my life, as have most of my friends and family, and I don't think I've had one sincere, long conversation with any of them about Israel/Palestine. It's obviously been vaguely topical at times, so I know roughly about it, but any convo around that has genuinely moved on within a minute or two. It's never felt like a subject that's anywhere near the top of the agenda for your average labour voter, if that makes sense? I can't say I hold any notable opinion about anyone Jewish at all, cos why would I? Never crossed my mind to. It just doesn't seem to affect my life (well, knowingly at least) at all. Hence my confusion as to why its such a big deal for many. Those points make sense though, so thank you.

Some in Labour seem to think you do care deeply about the Israeli/Palestinian conflict, to the point it overshadows all other political concerns. Naturally, nobody is supportive of the violence or the conduct of the Israeli govt. but i'd hazard a guess you're not in the camp to suggest that Israel has "no right to exist", which some recent Labour advocates in recent years have stated on twitter (and been subsequently banned) It became so bad that even stating that Israel has a right to exist was seen as an unpopular opinion.

What this more extreme far-left element group that infiltrated Labour brought to the discussion was the idea that "people having more money than they need is a bad thing. And typically, which communities tend to have the most money? Who has positions of authority in banking and business? Who is therefore keeping people oppressed worldwide?"

 

[Metal Biker]

I would argue for very similar reasons actually mate, the Nazis thought the Jews were controlling the banks too.

PB will be able to give a very good insight but I don’t want to go around tagging him every time antisemitism comes up on the board.

Is my semi-Jewish heritage not good enough for ya? Huh!? ;)

 

[Gareth Barry Conlon]

Cheers all, really useful. Appreciated. I guess I'm a little baffled because I've literally voted labour all my life, as have most of my friends and family, and I don't think I've had one sincere, long conversation with any of them about Israel/Palestine. It's obviously been vaguely topical at times, so I know roughly about it, but any convo around that has genuinely moved on within a minute or two. It's never felt like a subject that's anywhere near the top of the agenda for your average labour voter, if that makes sense? I can't say I hold any notable opinion about anyone Jewish at all, cos why would I? Never crossed my mind to. It just doesn't seem to affect my life (well, knowingly at least) at all. Hence my confusion as to why its such a big deal for many. Those points make sense though, so thank you.

Sadly the above is a fair reflection. The only thing I would add is that this is fringe wacky stuff and originates in soviet propaganda through the cold war years. Where Hitler stopped the Russians picked up the baton and mixed in the repression of socialism and secret networks undermining the will of the people. A toxic mix that lives on in far left web chat rooms and conspiracy theory.

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/arts-letters/articles/soviet-anti-semitic-cartoons

 

[MillionMilesAway]

Cheers all, really useful. Appreciated. I guess I'm a little baffled because I've literally voted labour all my life, as have most of my friends and family, and I don't think I've had one sincere, long conversation with any of them about Israel/Palestine. It's obviously been vaguely topical at times, so I know roughly about it, but any convo around that has genuinely moved on within a minute or two. It's never felt like a subject that's anywhere near the top of the agenda for your average labour voter, if that makes sense? I can't say I hold any notable opinion about anyone Jewish at all, cos why would I? Never crossed my mind to. It just doesn't seem to affect my life (well, knowingly at least) at all - not that I don't care, but you know what I mean. Hence my confusion as to why its such a big deal for many. Those points make sense though, so thank you.

You might also wait for a politically-left view on what happened. It might match in part, but may offer different ideology.

 

[Chris in London]

See bob you work on a different level to me and most people who may vote labour but don’t (or the conned)
We’re only arsed about people down at our level and whether things are fair and how things can be improved in our lives
We leave it to people like you to deal with the high level high finance issues dogging the nation.
We just want food drink family and football
People like you are too busy blaming Tory’s and don’t actually try to persuade people why to vote labour.
We’re all thick and easily conned.....
Maybe your views just don’t relate to us

What was your opinion on the Blair government?