Keir Starmer

[The Light Was Yellow Sir]

I do not understand what you mean by this cultural left?

Marx's argument was that culture was used to preserve inequality (he got that right) , it is counter intuitive to think the left would want to preserve these inequalities that arise through Capitalism, because only by countering Capitalism with Socialist policies can inequalities be addressed. I would argue that the Blairite acceptance of neo-liberal economics drove Brexit far more than the left, because Labour at that time accepted Capitalism and refuted Socialism.

Cultural left as opposed to economic left. I suppose some people might call it ‘progressive’ or ‘liberal socialism’. That is the ideology which puts a strong emphasis on social issues such as race and gender, LGBT rights, the environment, safe spaces and trigger warnings, is pro-immigration and pro-EU. The long established economic left would be characterised as homing in on class, economic redistribution, unionisation, nationalised industries, more of the tax burden falling on those that could pay more and a host of long won workers rights. If the left concentrated on this economic element most of other things would follow, as they’re all essentially rooted in inequality.

 

[The perfect fumble]

Keir and Labour have employed a new team of advisors to help with how he and the party projects a certain 'image' to the public, since this picture was taken (June last year). More Union Jack flags and that sort of thing & they probably would have advised against that photo-op at the time, although it was right at the pinnacle of the George Floyd inspired #BLM movement, so he might of overruled them on principle, anyway. We will never know.

Mate, listen to yourself, photo-op right at the pinnacle of George Floyd, but maybe should've been advised against? Fuck me! You either believe it or you don't!

I'm not getting at you, believe me, you're probably right. Last year taking the knee was all the rage, now it's waving the union flag, that's what you get when politics is hollowed out.

Starmer is 90's New Labour, socially liberal, economically conservative, scrabbling around in a divided political landscape with few takers.

Blair and Cameron led us here, though the arseholes will never admit it.

Right now the New Labour right control the Labour Party but their constituency is shrinking, along with party membership. They're desperate for Gerard Coyne to win the Unite election, if he does they'll use that to change the mechanism for electing Labour's leader, giving more power to the PLP and narrow the odds for left wingers to get nominated.

If Labour loses the Batley and Spen by-election, that'll be two Labour held seat lost in the space of two months. Oppositions aren't supposed to lose these kind of by-elections, prior to Hartlepool it's happened only twice in fifty years!

This is existential stuff for Labour, a party the country doesn't want, with a leader they don't like, hemorrhaging members and with policies (where they exist at all) out of kilter with just about everybody.

Except John Bercow.

 

[jamesbond007]

Right now the New Labour right control the Labour Party but their constituency is shrinking, along with party membership. They're desperate for Gerard Coyne to win the Unite election, if he does they'll use that to change the mechanism for electing Labour's leader, giving more power to the PLP and narrow the odds for left wingers to get nominated.

If Labour loses the Batley and Spen by-election, that'll be two Labour held seat lost in the space of two months. Oppositions aren't supposed to lose these kind of by-elections, prior to Hartlepool it's happened only twice in fifty years!

This is existential stuff for Labour, a party the country doesn't want, with a leader they don't like, hemorrhaging members and with policies (where they exist at all) out of kilter with just about everybody.

Except John Bercow.

I didn't know about this Unite election, so thank you, I shall look out for that.

I agree with you on Batley and Spen, in fact I have just been talking to my Dad on the phone about this whole subject and we agree: Labour are in a very tricky situation. The Liberal Democrat result in the week was a big shock, but if it is an indication that the Tories have the red wall boxed off up here and the Lib Dems can get the ex-Labour 'remainer' votes down south, he is screwed. Wouldn't it be ironic that a person named after the founder of the Labour Party, could be the leader when it all comes to a withering end?

 

[The perfect fumble]

I didn't know about this Unite election, so thank you, I shall look out for that.

I agree with you on Batley and Spen, in fact I have just been talking to my Dad on the phone about this whole subject and we agree: Labour are in a very tricky situation. The Liberal Democrat result in the week was a big shock, but if it is an indication that the Tories have the red wall boxed off up here and the Lib Dems can get the ex-Labour 'remainer' votes down south, he is screwed. Wouldn't it be ironic that a person named after the founder of the Labour Party, could be the leader when it all comes to a withering end?

It even has a name...

Pasokification.

Where a centre left party dies replaced by nationalist left-wing and right-wing alternatives.

Starmer and his chums know that the first past the post system nips that in the bud, but then they thought Corbyn had no chance for the leadership in 2015 and Blair reckoned Scottish devolution would kill off the SNP, so these arseholes have form for getting it badly wrong.

Chin up though, they still have the Guardian.

​

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Sharks circling now, Labour has become a safe space for Monday club and Tory alumnus John Bercow - what odds on him to become the next leader of the 'left'.

 

[Postman Pep]

It even has a name...

Pasokification.

Where a centre left party dies replaced by nationalist left-wing and right-wing alternatives.

Starmer and his chums are betting that the first past the post system nips that in the bud, but then they thought Corbyn had no chance for the leadership in 2015 and Blair reckoned Scottish devolution would kill off the SNP, so these arseholes have form for getting it badly wrong.

Chin up though, they still have the Guardian.

​

Pasokeithication?

 

[The perfect fumble]

Pasokeithication?

Poor Keith, he keeps dumping on the left, but for all the shit and the lies he told to get elected, the left stubbornly refuse to leave and set up a new party!

Meanwhile at Party HQ....

 

[Citizen of Legoland]

It should be remembered that only THREE people have been elected as Labour PMs in history since the foundation of the party - the Tories have provided 8 since Labour's first victory under Clem Atlee - and yet many Labour members even ignore one of those (their most successful period too in terms of longevity) from their record despite history showing that their ability to actually form a government as one of the two major parties is so remarkably low that they almost don't exist. Their record is closer to the Libs/Lib Dems on zero than it is to the Tories.

You could even discount Atlee's win in 1945 as pretty much a direct result of the war. That leaves just Harold Wilson as a success, then, in all their existence.

That's one huge problem Starmer has got to solve. Good luck, mate.

 

[Rascal]

It should be remembered that only THREE people have been elected as Labour PMs in history since the foundation of the party - the Tories have provided 8 since Labour's first victory under Clem Atlee - and yet many Labour members even ignore one of those (their most successful period too in terms of longevity) from their record despite history showing that their ability to actually form a government as one of the two major parties is so remarkably low that they almost don't exist. Their record is closer to the Libs/Lib Dems on zero than it is to the Tories.

You could even discount Atlee's win in 1945 as pretty much a direct result of the war. That leaves just Harold Wilson as a success, then, in all their existence.

That's one huge problem Starmer has got to solve. Good luck, mate.

I am not being pedantic , but no PM is ever elected. The person who becomes PM is the First (Prime) Minister of the party elected to form a Government.

Dismissing Atlee, possibly the greatest and most influential of all Prime Ministers, as becoming PM only because of the war is a little strange, the Labour Party was elected because of a magnificent manifesto against a PM who is considered a War Hero.

And it is not three, its four you forgot Ramsey Macdonald, he was the first Labour PM not Atlee.

 

[Rascal]

Cultural left as opposed to economic left. I suppose some people might call it ‘progressive’ or ‘liberal socialism’. That is the ideology which puts a strong emphasis on social issues such as race and gender, LGBT rights, the environment, safe spaces and trigger warnings, is pro-immigration and pro-EU. The long established economic left would be characterised as homing in on class, economic redistribution, unionisation, nationalised industries, more of the tax burden falling on those that could pay more and a host of long won workers rights. If the left concentrated on this economic element most of other things would follow, as they’re all essentially rooted in inequality.

Fair enough, I do not see them as left wing, they are liberals, comfortable with the free market and capitalism and seek to use capitalism to promote social equality. The right wing of the Labour party is full of these people.