Kyle Walker

[bluenova]

IIRC We’ve conceded the fewest goals from counter attacks in the PL every single season he’s been at the club.

It looks like that's not the case.

We were number 1 in one season, but the others we were between 8th and 13th place.

Given that we've been the number 1 or 2 in terms of goals conceded, it does appear that we concede a much higher percentage from counters than almost everyone else.

 

[SebastianBlue]

Pep can coach his way around players leaving, but people shouldn’t mistake that for it not causing us problems.

We lost games and missed out on titles in the 2 years we had no proper striker. We win the CL semi vs. real last year with a proper striker.

We lost the league the season after Silva left.


Pep can make a very good team despite players leaving or us missing transfer targets, that doesn’t mean we aren’t worse off because of it.

Causing problems that need to be solved? Sure. And not something I was arguing was not the case. Of course players leaving present challenges that need to be overcome. And Pep has almost always managed to do that.

But City being (ultimately) worse off? There is very little evidence of that being the case under Pep.

Not to mention we don’t know if he is being replaced with an equally athletic, pacey player (Walker was never the best defender), which are much more common than players like Ake or Dias.

We’ve failed to win the league twice under him; once in his first year (not applicable to our debate), once in his fourth year (first COVID season, with our full team, so also not really applicable; Silva leaving wasn’t the reason we lost the league that season). We have won every other season. And we have competed in the CL, crashing out in ways not really related to this debate.

And I think your assessment is very simplistic, given each time we have lost an important player, Pep has tweaked the way we play to mitigate the loss. Assuming that losing Walker will mean we will become more susceptible to counters (even given there is evidence of that not being the case last season when Walker wasn’t playing) is shortsighted analysis.

As I said elsewhere, Pep is the only irreplaceable element of our current team.

I think people are succumbing to Chicken Little syndrome here.

Edit: I just noticed you edited your post substantially whilst I was typing up my response. To be clear, I don’t agree we lost the semi against Madrid because we didn’t have a proper striker. Nor did we lose the COVID hit season because Silva left (we had basically the same amount of possession, pass accuracy, and passes, and actually more goals the season after Silva left; we concede 10 more than the previous year, which was not because Silva left).

 

[Tricky_Trev]

Pep can coach his way around players leaving, but people shouldn’t mistake that for it not causing us problems.

We lost games and missed out on titles in the 2 years we had no proper striker. We win the CL semi vs. real last year with a proper striker.

We lost the league the season after Silva left.


Pep can make a very good team despite players leaving or us missing transfer targets, that doesn’t mean we aren’t worse off because of it.

But to be balanced, you’d also have to consider whether keeping a player that considers his City chapter to be over, would also be making us worse. It’s unlikely, after a treble and three-peat, and a summer where Walker’s seemingly made it clear he wants a new challenge, that he’d have anywhere near the hunger to produce at the level he has been. He’s also been guilty this season of making the ‘bad faces’ that Pep hates. That’s going to be an even bigger issue if he stays without the desire to go again, as he’ll find himself playing much less.

It’s just normal after such extreme success that some of those that have been here the longest mentally check out of the club. The Champions League was the final piece for quite a few of them. Winning it as part of a treble just closes the chapter even more emphatically.

 

[SebastianBlue]

I suppose my point is it will still be the no.1 tactic against us, with or without Kyle, purely down to the our high line and press. I'd be amazed if Pep doesn't have a plan to keep it relatively low once Kyle goes.

I think people are succumbing to both Chicken Little syndrome and very simplistic analysis/forecast that is not reflective of reality.

Most of the consternation is based on the assumption that Pep has no plan to replace Walker, either like-for-like or with different tactics using the same or different players.

And data doesn’t really support that we have been worse off when other major players have left, so that argument doesn’t make much sense, either.

 

[bluenova]

I suppose my point is it will still be the no.1 tactic against us, with or without Kyle, purely down to the our high line and press. I'd be amazed if Pep doesn't have a plan to keep it relatively low once Kyle goes.

I'd suggest that the latest system we've been using is more secure - we've rarely been relying on raw pace to deal with counters.

 

[ShaunMCFC]

All the best to him, top player and he’s deserved to go when he wants to.

 

[Bald fraud]

You hear a lot of ex players say they wish they had the football brain they had when they retired when they were younger. But obviously with age your legs go. Walker seems to be getting better and faster with age it’s frightening. I still think he can do a job for us he’s been brilliant this season

 

[Gone for a Burton]

He’ll be missed if he goes.

His pace,physicality and experience is very rare.

However, a decent fee £30 M, may be better now than nowt next year depending on who replaces him in the squad.

 

[BringBackSwales]

Be very sad to see Kyle leave, especially to the German rags. Doesn’t make sense to me, unless part ex for Kimmich

 

[SebastianBlue]

But to be balanced, you’d also have to consider whether keeping a player that considers his City chapter to be over, would also be making us worse. It’s unlikely, after a treble and three-peat, and a summer where Walker’s seemingly made it clear he wants a new challenge, that he’d have anywhere near the hunger to produce at the level he has been. He’s also been guilty this season of making the ‘bad faces’ that Pep hates. That’s going to be an even bigger issue if he stays without the desire to go again, as he’ll find himself playing much less.

It’s just normal after such extreme success that some of those that have been here the longest mentally check out of the club. The Champions League was the final piece for quite a few of them. Winning it as part of a treble just closes the chapter even more emphatically.

Also a great point.

Were there challenges created by Cancelo leaving in January? Absolutely.

Did it turn out to be one of the turning points of our season? Also, absolutely.

Pep made some changes, and we went on to when the CL, which the major players that have left us in the last few years never managed to do.

A lot of the arguments being made in the thread for why the sky is falling because Walker is leaving don’t make much sense when out under the light of reality.