Should be nowhere near an acoustic guitar either.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
Laurence Fox launches political party
- Thread starter Ric
- Start date
Rascal
El Presidente
My right and your right are two different things mate.You’re normally right on lots of things, but on this you are wrong.
You have made some excellent post about how the middle class left have ruined the Labour Party. They are also the ones active in the rifts they are creating within society, that are being labelled Culture Wars.
My right is anything to the right of Socialism which includes Liberalism, it is the Social Liberals and the Social Conservatives who are engaged in these wars. The Social Conservatives wish to keep the status quo of capitalist hegemony, patriarchy and in some extreme cases white supremacy, the Social liberals seek a different world where the Social Conservative position is demolished. Social Conservatism believes in natural Law, in that it has a tendency towards habitual norms and fears sudden or excessive change. Change such as gay marriage is a moral quandary to Social Conservatives where as to the Social Liberals it is necessary to enact a change for the better of society. To a Social Conservative change is irrational, in that sense the right as in the Social Conservatives are the ones who started the culture wars because they fear change and fear diminishment of social standing.
I have stated that in my opinion the middle class left are mainly the Liberal left, to the Socialist left culture is not really an issue, class is the issue and it is the development of the collective working class rights over the capitalist class that is far more important than individual rights.
On a side note the whole palaver over Millwall fans booing BLM is not in my opinion an attack based on culture war, it is has been noticable over the last few days that the narrative changed and the attacks have become political in that they are now attacking the supposed fact that BLM are a Marxist organisation. This is not about discrediting antiracism, it is about discrediting Marxism by association and it is what the Social Conservatives specialise in, because as I stated Social Conservatives are scared to fucking death of change. See as a Socialist i am perturbed by the attacks on the political stance, the liberal left will be concerned about the booing as they see it as a racist attack. Now it is possible that some Millwall fans are racist, but what is concerning to me is the attack on the left and the Millwall fans as a whole being the useful idiots of the socially conservative capitalist class.
Rascal
El Presidente
Who are these radical leftists you speak of?Something the radical left are incapable of doing in their endless anti western antagonism.
And this anti western antagonism, what do you mean by that? Have you got an example perhaps?
Who are these radical leftists you speak of?
And this anti western antagonism, what do you mean by that? Have you got an example perhaps?
You know who I am talking about, we’ve been over it and you’ve even alluded to it in your response to Squirty.
The middle class social left, who you describe as focusing away from class and rather on race, gender, sex etc.
They say they’re liberal but they’re actually totally illiberal to other opinions and the causes are becoming more and more outlandish and laughable.
The anti West narrative is what we heard all summer, Britain’s a systematically racist society and the West is as a civilisation, now in 2020.
I think it’s a load of bollocks.
Alan Harper's Tash
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- 12 Dec 2010
- Messages
- 59,771
You know who I am talking about, we’ve been over it and you’ve even alluded to it in your response to Squirty.
The middle class social left, who you describe as focusing away from class and rather on race, gender, sex etc.
They say they’re liberal but they’re actually totally illiberal to other opinions and the causes are becoming more and more outlandish and laughable.
The anti West narrative is what we heard all summer, Britain’s a systematically racist society and the West is as a civilisation, now in 2020.
I think it’s a load of bollocks.
So it‘s not far leftists as they don’t really exist.
it‘s the people attacking who you suppose as doing alright in life and attaching a “far left” label to.
The anti West thing is also a complete fallacy. 99%+ of Brits aren’t anti-west. It’s another social media fallacy.
Using Palestine as a reason to be anti West is another social media short cut.
Britain doesn’t have to be a “racist” society to subconsciously advantage white over people of colour. That is what this movement is about.
Social media is all about discrediting anything that happens.
A BLM may have registered them as a Marxist political party. That doesn‘t mean that 99%+ of the BLM supporters go along with that. They merely want equality between white people and people of colour.
The rest is media bullshit trying to discredit both sides.
Rascal
El Presidente
Intolerant not illiberal. Illiberal is defined by a lack or denial of knowledge. Then you get in the realms of are they are intolerant of the intolerant and in that i have some sympathy. Why should we be tolerant of opinion that is motivated by bigotry, hate or prejudice.They say they’re liberal but they’re actually totally illiberal to other opinions and the causes are becoming more and more outlandish and laughable.
You may think it is a load of bollox, but then you are guilty of being intolerant towards those who do believe that the UK/west is systematically racist and you could be described as illiberal as you either lack knowledge or are denied knowledge about systematic racism.The anti West narrative is what we heard all summer, Britain’s a systematically racist society and the West is as a civilisation, now in 2020.
I think it’s a load of bollocks.
There are plenty of people such as the Archbishop of Canterbury who believe that the UK is institutionally racist, is the Archbishop therefore anti-west? Are you therefore being intolerant of the views of the Archbishop.
This is what the Social Conservatives do, they divide people along these lines and use culture to ferment division. They do this because they need to discredit people and certain ways of thinking in order to maintain the status quo as they are frightened of change and see change as a threat to their hegemony.
A classic example of Social Conservatism fermenting division is the use of the antisemitic trope cultural Marxism, its inference that the west is being infiltrated by cultural Marxism is pure culture war ideology.
The central idea of Cultural Marxism is to soften up and prepare Western Civilization for economic Marxism after a gradual attack on every institution of Western culture, including schools, literature, art, film, the Christian tradition, marriage, family, sexual morality. The attacks are usually framed in Marxist terms as a class struggle between oppressors and oppressed; the members of the latter class allegedly include women, minorities, homosexuals, and adherents of non-Western ideologies such as Islam. Cultural Marxism has been described as "the cultural branch of the Globalist elites. It is conspiracy bollox but obviously it works and if it works Social Conservatives will use it as a means of maintaining there hegemony and social standing. The anti western narrative is therefore fermented by the Social conservatives. They then use it to attack liberalism because Liberalism scares them.
They’re not far left, it’s why I used the term “radical” instead. The far left to me is those economically to the left of Rascal and I don’t mean them.So it‘s not far leftists as they don’t really exist.
it‘s the people attacking who you suppose as doing alright in life and attaching a “far left” label to.
The anti West thing is also a complete fallacy. 99%+ of Brits aren’t anti-west. It’s another social media fallacy.
Using Palestine as a reason to be anti West is another social media short cut.
Britain doesn’t have to be a “racist” society to subconsciously advantage white over people of colour. That is what this movement is about.
Social media is all about discrediting anything that happens.
A BLM may have registered them as a Marxist political party. That doesn‘t mean that 99%+ of the BLM supporters go along with that. They merely want equality between white people and people of colour.
The rest is media bullshit trying to discredit both sides.
They’re also not Marxists and I haven’t used that term at all. BLM were founded by two women who claimed to be but I seriously doubt they are.
That point on Britain now is what I’m disagreeing with. I don’t think Britain is subconsciously favouring white people, the data doesn’t show this.
You’re writing your own definitions now. By illiberal I mean this:Intolerant not illiberal. Illiberal is defined by a lack or denial of knowledge. Then you get in the realms of are they are intolerant of the intolerant and in that i have some sympathy. Why should we be tolerant of opinion that is motivated by bigotry, hate or prejudice.
You may think it is a load of bollox, but then you are guilty of being intolerant towards those who do believe that the UK/west is systematically racist and you could be described as illiberal as you either lack knowledge or are denied knowledge about systematic racism.
There are plenty of people such as the Archbishop of Canterbury who believe that the UK is institutionally racist, is the Archbishop therefore anti-west? Are you therefore being intolerant of the views of the Archbishop.
This is what the Social Conservatives do, they divide people along these lines and use culture to ferment division. They do this because they need to discredit people and certain ways of thinking in order to maintain the status quo as they are frightened of change and see change as a threat to their hegemony.
A classic example of Social Conservatism fermenting division is the use of the antisemitic trope cultural Marxism, its inference that the west is being infiltrated by cultural Marxism is pure culture war ideology.
The central idea of Cultural Marxism is to soften up and prepare Western Civilization for economic Marxism after a gradual attack on every institution of Western culture, including schools, literature, art, film, the Christian tradition, marriage, family, sexual morality. The attacks are usually framed in Marxist terms as a class struggle between oppressors and oppressed; the members of the latter class allegedly include women, minorities, homosexuals, and adherents of non-Western ideologies such as Islam. Cultural Marxism has been described as "the cultural branch of the Globalist elites. It is conspiracy bollox but obviously it works and if it works Social Conservatives will use it as a means of maintaining there hegemony and social standing. The anti western narrative is therefore fermented by the Social conservatives. They then use it to attack liberalism because Liberalism scares them.
And no, disagreeing doesn’t make you illiberal, I support the right for anyone to hold an opinion and I’d support them in not being de-platformed, fired or banned for saying what they think.adjective
- 1.
opposed to liberal principles; restricting freedom of thought or behaviour.
That is the difference between myself and these people engaging in severe identity politics, based on gender, race, sexuality etc. They are illiberal because they do not support that right for me. University campuses across the western world are facing a crisis at the moment with students trying to block speakers of certain political persuasions. Even people close to the centre are being blocked from speaking.
My views differ based on individual policy but yes, many of them are socially conservative, some liberal, and you know full well that I don’t use the term “culturally Marxist” nor do I get involved in conspiracies. I think we spoke earlier this year and went over this.
Liberalism doesn’t scare me so much as it doesn’t scare you, I just find the stronger flavours of it unappealing.
I certainly do. The man is a total buffoon and so out of his depth it’s actually a little tragic to see.I’ve no desire personally to “cancel him”, I just enjoy ridiculing him as he’s a fairly tragi-comic character. Surely we can all at least agree on that?
Fox leading a political party/movement is like McLaren dropping Hamilton and employing my Mrs as its leading driver.
Rascal
El Presidente
So you support hate speech. You support the law of the land being broken and you support opinions that are antisemitic or Islamophobic but are against anything that questions your identity.You’re writing your own definitions now. By illiberal I mean this:
And no, disagreeing doesn’t make you illiberal, I support the right for anyone to hold an opinion and I’d support them in not being de-platformed, fired or banned for saying what they think.
What rights do you want and what rights do you not have?That is the difference between myself and these people engaging in severe identity politics, based on gender, race, sexuality etc. They are illiberal because they do not support that right for me.
Cultural MarxismUniversity campuses across the western world are facing a crisis at the moment with students trying to block speakers of certain political persuasions. Even people close to the centre are being blocked from speaking.
Students have every right to block speakers if they so wish, they are expressing their right not to hear. Of course they could let the speakers turn up and simply not attend if they didn't want to hear, but being a student is as much as finding a way of expressing yourself as it is denying expression to others. Far too much is made of this as students have always done it, it is now an issue because Cultural Marxism
You may not use the term cultural Marxist, but that is one of the starting points for these culture wars.My views differ based on individual policy but yes, many of them are socially conservative, some liberal, and you know full well that I don’t use the term “culturally Marxist” nor do I get involved in conspiracies. I think we spoke earlier this year and went over this.
No politics scares me, i just think some political views are wrong, some are idiotic and some are the result of people being misled.Liberalism doesn’t scare me so much as it doesn’t scare you, I just find the stronger flavours of it unappealing.