not my fault!
Well-Known Member
sam221985 said:
I'll go for £0 + a loan player or freebie
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Lescott [Merged]
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I'll go for £0 + a loan player or freebie
bizzbo
Well-Known Member
everton have been engaging in double-talk since this whole affair began. there are no comments from city that could be construed as being an 'inducement to break his contract'. hughes nearly fell foul of this when he said Terry may be looking for a new challenge, but this doesnt amount to an incitement to break contract, it's speculation. the worse you can say was is that it was inappropriate comment, potentially unhelpful to the other club. there is a world of difference between talking out of turn about someone else's player and actually offering them an inducement to leave.
as far as I can make out, what would comprise 'an inducement' is a grey area. bidding for another teams player obviously tells the player you are interested in their services, but it is standard practise. Moyes appears to have hinted that city's repeated bids amounted to an illegal approach, but this suggestion is undermined by Everton's failure to informe city clearly and unequivocally that the player was not for sale. I've repeatedly challenged Everton fans to show me any evidence of such a statement, and all they come up with are the same somewhat vague statements from Moyes, 'we are not looking to sell any of our players'. So Lescott's keenness to leave cannot in itself be interpreted as a sign that any illegal inducement had been offered to him, as city's interest in him was declared in the normal way.
The only precedent for action being take over an illegal approach for a player involved face to face meetings by senior club officials and a contracted player (Ashley Cole). This suggests that the FA are aware that whilst severe breaches must be punished, the letter of the law could be held to outlaw many practises that are considered essential, and normal, by most clubs, and also in the interest of players. Players are restricted beyond the usual Employment Law, and the FA must be careful not to restrict their ability to ply their trade and maximise their career, or they risk a legal challenge to their authority, of the type that brought about the Bosman Ruling. The transfer market is a useful tool in balancing the interests of the clubs and the individual players. Any alternate system would be far less considerate towards the clubs.
As the FA's governance exists to protect all clubs and players, it seems reasonable to assume that they they will not punish an specific example of an action that has upset an individual club, but could be seen as 'normal', within the bounds of 'fairness', as in the vast majority of cases it is part of a system that works in the interest of clubs and players.
So the line appears to be drawn at direct contact between contracted players and officials from other clubs, any attempt to offer specific terms, any attempt to directly encourage the player to break his contract. The law does not, and cannot, include any and all activity that includes clubs indirectly 'sounding out' contracted players, or expressing their interest in them, as to do so, it would have to outlaw any club from bidding for a contracted player.
as far as I can make out, what would comprise 'an inducement' is a grey area. bidding for another teams player obviously tells the player you are interested in their services, but it is standard practise. Moyes appears to have hinted that city's repeated bids amounted to an illegal approach, but this suggestion is undermined by Everton's failure to informe city clearly and unequivocally that the player was not for sale. I've repeatedly challenged Everton fans to show me any evidence of such a statement, and all they come up with are the same somewhat vague statements from Moyes, 'we are not looking to sell any of our players'. So Lescott's keenness to leave cannot in itself be interpreted as a sign that any illegal inducement had been offered to him, as city's interest in him was declared in the normal way.
The only precedent for action being take over an illegal approach for a player involved face to face meetings by senior club officials and a contracted player (Ashley Cole). This suggests that the FA are aware that whilst severe breaches must be punished, the letter of the law could be held to outlaw many practises that are considered essential, and normal, by most clubs, and also in the interest of players. Players are restricted beyond the usual Employment Law, and the FA must be careful not to restrict their ability to ply their trade and maximise their career, or they risk a legal challenge to their authority, of the type that brought about the Bosman Ruling. The transfer market is a useful tool in balancing the interests of the clubs and the individual players. Any alternate system would be far less considerate towards the clubs.
As the FA's governance exists to protect all clubs and players, it seems reasonable to assume that they they will not punish an specific example of an action that has upset an individual club, but could be seen as 'normal', within the bounds of 'fairness', as in the vast majority of cases it is part of a system that works in the interest of clubs and players.
So the line appears to be drawn at direct contact between contracted players and officials from other clubs, any attempt to offer specific terms, any attempt to directly encourage the player to break his contract. The law does not, and cannot, include any and all activity that includes clubs indirectly 'sounding out' contracted players, or expressing their interest in them, as to do so, it would have to outlaw any club from bidding for a contracted player.
OJ Blue said:OJ Blue said:Let me just clarify.
I originally heard about this transfer happening around 2 months ago, the original source was an Everton friend who knows a staff member at their training ground.
The second time I got wind of this was from a different friend, who is mates with a former Everton player (now plying his trade elsehwere).
The third and final source is from a friend who knows a former City Captain, which is where this latest info from, I wouldn't post anything unless there was more than reasonable chance of it coming true.
ITK or whatever people want to claim is a load of bollox, I'm a City fan wanting the best for our club and passing on what I believe to be genuine information. I get snippets now and then that is all.
So all in all 2 good City sources and one half decent Everton say its happening, and I for one believe it.
Why don't you just fuck off, you know nothing prick!
WTF???????
leewill31 said:OJ Blue said:Why don't you just fuck off, you know nothing prick!
WTF???????
lmaoo i was just laughing at this ,,, is the dude talking to himself:|?????
Cobwebcat
Well-Known Member
lee-mcfc said:leewill31 said:WTF???????
lmaoo i was just laughing at this ,,, is the dude talking to himself:|?????
Now that's funny. Don't beat yourself up!
Bridge25 said:Had a call before the game today from a very reliable source that Lescott WAS at the stadium prior to the game AND had signed but it will not be announced until at least after the Everton game tomorrow!
I have no reason to doubt the source as she has always be 100% reliable with info in the past...we shall wait and see!!!
Get in lol... told you she was reliable, I had no reason to doubt her at all!
Of course Moyes doesn't want his best players to go especially in positions where is has little cover.
We have given him the opportunity to spend the money he has now at most likely well above what they would have valued him themselves in a pre Dubai market.
I hope Lescott proves he was worth the money and knuckles down quickly and put the past behind him.
We have given him the opportunity to spend the money he has now at most likely well above what they would have valued him themselves in a pre Dubai market.
I hope Lescott proves he was worth the money and knuckles down quickly and put the past behind him.
Farmer Blue
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- 76
Hopefully it's the last we'll hear of DSOB's fables.
mancboy123
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- Joined
- 24 Oct 2007
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See what alot of people everton fans mostly is that it isnt just about having the money to buy the player its about being able to pay the requisite wages to the player which unfortunately everton just cannot offer
mancity dan
Well-Known Member
I'm sure it will be. Will be glad when Lescott has finally signed on the dotted line
CTID
CTID
avoidconfusion
Well-Known Member
OJ Blue said:OJ Blue said:Let me just clarify.
I originally heard about this transfer happening around 2 months ago, the original source was an Everton friend who knows a staff member at their training ground.
The second time I got wind of this was from a different friend, who is mates with a former Everton player (now plying his trade elsehwere).
The third and final source is from a friend who knows a former City Captain, which is where this latest info from, I wouldn't post anything unless there was more than reasonable chance of it coming true.
ITK or whatever people want to claim is a load of bollox, I'm a City fan wanting the best for our club and passing on what I believe to be genuine information. I get snippets now and then that is all.
So all in all 2 good City sources and one half decent Everton say its happening, and I for one believe it.
Why don't you just fuck off, you know nothing prick!
Forgot to log on with your other account?
sam221985
Well-Known Member
avoidconfusion said:OJ Blue said:Why don't you just fuck off, you know nothing prick!
Forgot to log on with your other account?
think it was more a case of him ironically drawing attention to the fact he was actually right.
surprised it's gone over so many heads :-s
Farmer Blue said:Hopefully it's the last we'll hear of DSOB's fables.
I am hoping so...
mancity dan said:I'm sure it will be. Will be glad when Lescott has finally signed on the dotted line
CTID
It's matter of hours until he's confirmed as a City player.
Neil McNab
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- 3,371
Looks like Golum is going for Shawcross who I mentioned as target for City, they will get a better defender there IMO.
sam221985
Well-Known Member
Neil McNab said:Looks like Golum is going for Shawcross who I mentioned as target for City, they will get a better defender there IMO.
Shawcross better than Lescott? Eh?!
Maybe in the future but certainly not now.
Aussie!
Well-Known Member
There are two sides to every story but, somewhere in the middle of the saga involving Everton, Lescott and Manchester City, is an indictment of what has happened to football with the huge sums of money now involved in the game.
There is no loyalty in football anywhere now. The issue is not restricted to Lescott. It is easy for me to talk about loyalty having spent 14 years at Liverpool, but if somebody had offered to more than double my money when I was 26, then I would have taken it.
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It is human nature and 99.9 per cent of people would make the same choice. It is OK saying, 'We love the Blues,' or 'We love the Reds,' but money talks and, as soon as City made their first move for Lescott, it was all over for Everton.
The fact is that Lescott can set himself up for life with one contract at Manchester City. He might just have signed a new deal at Everton last year, but contracts don't give clubs any protection nowadays. They totally favour the player.
Everton are considering reporting City to the Football Association over their pursuit of Lescott, but if the FA take action against City, then every transfer will have to come under scrutiny. I
t is illegal to tap a player up, but the reality is that player tapping has happened since time began. If player A knows that club B are interested, then that's all it takes and Lescott only needed to know of City's interest and the sums of money involved to turn his head. If the managers were in different positions would Moyes not go about strengthening his squad like Mark Hughes has done at City?
Moyes now admits that he shouldn't have selected Lescott for the Arsenal game last week, which Everton lost 6-1. Back in the old days, if a player told a manager that he wasn't right mentally, then it would be a case of 'stuff him,' but those days are gone and there is no point keeping players who want to be somewhere else.
The player becomes unhappy, he develops a bad attitude and it seeps into the dressing-room because you can be certain that his team-mates will be talking about it. So when you lose 6-1, you look for reasons why and, when you get one bad result followed by another, you start on the slippery slope.
Moyes has done well to get the price he has for Lescott, but I feel sorry for Everton because they will struggle to find somebody as good as him in the final week of the transfer window. You look around at the possibilities and there are a lot of 'maybes' out there. Even Matthew Upson would be a maybe in my opinion.
You can't get a Vidic, Ferdinand, Carragher or Terry for the money that Everton will receive for Lescott. And even if you could, they probably wouldn't want to go to Everton because they will find it hard to finish fifth again this season, especially the way that Spurs and City are shaping up.
But the problem for Moyes is that the supporters will regard fifth as the norm and they will be wanting to better that. Moyes has done an incredible job, but if Everton end up ninth this season, nobody will be blaming Lescott because it will have been nine months since he left. They will blame the manager but, when you consider the job he has done that would be totally unfair.
Everton have just been victims of the modern system in football and individuals aren't to blame. We are too far down the line to change it because the money involved is so huge, but it is great for those who are riding the gravy train.
There is no loyalty in football anywhere now. The issue is not restricted to Lescott. It is easy for me to talk about loyalty having spent 14 years at Liverpool, but if somebody had offered to more than double my money when I was 26, then I would have taken it.
Related Articles
*
Hughes praises City's new resolve
*
Lescott faces City medical
*
Everton have Moutinho bid rejected by Sporting Lisbon
*
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*
Phil Neville signs new deal with Everton
*
Premier League Transfer Talk
It is human nature and 99.9 per cent of people would make the same choice. It is OK saying, 'We love the Blues,' or 'We love the Reds,' but money talks and, as soon as City made their first move for Lescott, it was all over for Everton.
The fact is that Lescott can set himself up for life with one contract at Manchester City. He might just have signed a new deal at Everton last year, but contracts don't give clubs any protection nowadays. They totally favour the player.
Everton are considering reporting City to the Football Association over their pursuit of Lescott, but if the FA take action against City, then every transfer will have to come under scrutiny. I
t is illegal to tap a player up, but the reality is that player tapping has happened since time began. If player A knows that club B are interested, then that's all it takes and Lescott only needed to know of City's interest and the sums of money involved to turn his head. If the managers were in different positions would Moyes not go about strengthening his squad like Mark Hughes has done at City?
Moyes now admits that he shouldn't have selected Lescott for the Arsenal game last week, which Everton lost 6-1. Back in the old days, if a player told a manager that he wasn't right mentally, then it would be a case of 'stuff him,' but those days are gone and there is no point keeping players who want to be somewhere else.
The player becomes unhappy, he develops a bad attitude and it seeps into the dressing-room because you can be certain that his team-mates will be talking about it. So when you lose 6-1, you look for reasons why and, when you get one bad result followed by another, you start on the slippery slope.
Moyes has done well to get the price he has for Lescott, but I feel sorry for Everton because they will struggle to find somebody as good as him in the final week of the transfer window. You look around at the possibilities and there are a lot of 'maybes' out there. Even Matthew Upson would be a maybe in my opinion.
You can't get a Vidic, Ferdinand, Carragher or Terry for the money that Everton will receive for Lescott. And even if you could, they probably wouldn't want to go to Everton because they will find it hard to finish fifth again this season, especially the way that Spurs and City are shaping up.
But the problem for Moyes is that the supporters will regard fifth as the norm and they will be wanting to better that. Moyes has done an incredible job, but if Everton end up ninth this season, nobody will be blaming Lescott because it will have been nine months since he left. They will blame the manager but, when you consider the job he has done that would be totally unfair.
Everton have just been victims of the modern system in football and individuals aren't to blame. We are too far down the line to change it because the money involved is so huge, but it is great for those who are riding the gravy train.
Just to make it clear no way the fee is over £22 million in total.
The fact the deal was definately happening was first broken by Ian Cheeseman on GMR at around Mid day Saturday 22nd the noises he and BBC GMR were making were £20 million with £2 million in addons based on success. He juiced into the club; so this is as close to an accurate estimation of the fee as we will ever get IMO.
We made it clear we would not go substanially over the £18 million we originally offered, we waited long enough so this rings true. If Everton then hagled the fee downwards by potentially including Jo in the deal at the end of the season I guess we wll find out down the line.
As for the tapping up, clearly this is a non starter, they have no proof (If they did it would have been in the press long ago) plus Moyes ruined this lie by admiting yesterday that he was always going to be sold and theat they were annoyed we would not pay the fee they were demanding ala Trannie and Rags.
The fact the deal was definately happening was first broken by Ian Cheeseman on GMR at around Mid day Saturday 22nd the noises he and BBC GMR were making were £20 million with £2 million in addons based on success. He juiced into the club; so this is as close to an accurate estimation of the fee as we will ever get IMO.
We made it clear we would not go substanially over the £18 million we originally offered, we waited long enough so this rings true. If Everton then hagled the fee downwards by potentially including Jo in the deal at the end of the season I guess we wll find out down the line.
As for the tapping up, clearly this is a non starter, they have no proof (If they did it would have been in the press long ago) plus Moyes ruined this lie by admiting yesterday that he was always going to be sold and theat they were annoyed we would not pay the fee they were demanding ala Trannie and Rags.
sam221985 said:Neil McNab said:Looks like Golum is going for Shawcross who I mentioned as target for City, they will get a better defender there IMO.
Shawcross better than Lescott? Eh?!
Maybe in the future but certainly not now.
Without any doubt. Lescott is by far way better than Shawcross. And why would Shawcross be one of the targets ?!
alera said:Just to make it clear no way the fee is over £22 million in total.
The fact the deal was definately happening was first broken by Ian Cheeseman on GMR at around Mid day Saturday 22nd the noises he and BBC GMR were making were £20 million with £2 million in addons based on success. He juiced into the club; so this is as close to an accurate estimation of the fee as we will ever get IMO.
We made it clear we would not go substanially over the £18 million we originally offered, we waited long enough so this rings true. If Everton then hagled the fee downwards by potentially including Jo in the deal at the end of the season I guess we wll find out down the line.
As for the tapping up, clearly this is a non starter, they have no proof (If they did it would have been in the press long ago) plus Moyes ruined this lie by admiting yesterday that he was always going to be sold and theat they were annoyed we would not pay the fee they were demanding ala Trannie and Rags.
Well reports are suggesting that the fee is £22m and £2m in addons based on success, which at the end of the day will rise the fee to £24m.
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