Libya (Merged)

[Bilboblue]

Re: Looks like as from 10pm we are at war

then you believe that it took over 11 hours for the Americans and Chileans to contact Britain to say that Argentina were prepared to accept a peace deal.

Proof required please.

Not disputing this, just never seen it before.

 

[Cheesy]

Re: Looks like as from 10pm we are at war

Anyone who is prepared to kill a man or die for their country is an utter scumbag.
On the other hand, those who fight and die for a just cause, are the finest, most virtuous type of human being and earn a respect from me that will never die.

So you want the members of the Armed Forces to be able to pick & choose which conflict they will take part in?

Yeah, I can see that working. I'm popping in to see my Commanding Officer tomorrow to tell him that if he's got me down as having to help out with Libya then he's got another think coming.

 

[PragueBlue]

Re: Looks like as from 10pm we are at war

Good.

I think the position of your modern day stereotypical far left-winger is pretty abhorrent most of the time when it comes to foreign policy. The 'we have no business there' sort of thing. The same thing which would have lead to the entire extermination of European Jews and other minorities.

I've always been a fan of interventionism. It should be an embarrassment to us all that the horrors of Darfur and Rwanda have happened without genuine intervention.

Obviously, there needs to be some serious scrutiny on any foreign intervention to see whether it really is necessary. In Libya, I believe that is the case. Nobody should have the power to take another's life in the 21st Century, especially not to the level that Gaddafi might.

We have learnt something from the middle east uprising. We now know that it is unacceptable to intervene, until the people are brave enough to challenge their own dictator. This should have been applied to Iraq - which was a military disaster.

Well said.

 

[Kazzydeyna]

Re: Looks like as from 10pm we are at war

Good.

I think the position of your modern day stereotypical far left-winger is pretty abhorrent most of the time when it comes to foreign policy. The 'we have no business there' sort of thing. The same thing which would have lead to the entire extermination of European Jews and other minorities.

I've always been a fan of interventionism. It should be an embarrassment to us all that the horrors of Darfur and Rwanda have happened without genuine intervention.

Obviously, there needs to be some serious scrutiny on any foreign intervention to see whether it really is necessary. In Libya, I believe that is the case. Nobody should have the power to take another's life in the 21st Century, especially not to the level that Gaddafi might
We have learnt something from the middle east uprising. We now know that it is unacceptable to intervene, until the people are brave enough to challenge their own dictator. This should have been applied to Iraq - which was a military disaster.

Brilliant post sir.

When are you signing up. I'll come with you.

Are you bringing your children with you to sign up?

No? Oh.

So it'll be somebody elses kids fighting and dying then?

Brilliant.

Why don't we go after the REAL bastards that are causing death and robbery and genocide in the Arab/muslin/ middle eastern world - isreal.

Now that I'd vote for, but only if I could go myself. I'm no chicken-hawk, expecting somebody else to fight my wars for me.

You should be ashamed

 

[Jackson-ctid]

Re: Looks like as from 10pm we are at war

I'll probably get alsorts of abuse for this but... Israel is the most civilized country in the middle east. Coincidence? I think not. Countries like Iran, Libya and Syria are a stain on humanity.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

Re: Looks like as from 10pm we are at war

Good.

I think the position of your modern day stereotypical far left-winger is pretty abhorrent most of the time when it comes to foreign policy. The 'we have no business there' sort of thing. The same thing which would have lead to the entire extermination of European Jews and other minorities.

I've always been a fan of interventionism. It should be an embarrassment to us all that the horrors of Darfur and Rwanda have happened without genuine intervention.

Obviously, there needs to be some serious scrutiny on any foreign intervention to see whether it really is necessary. In Libya, I believe that is the case. Nobody should have the power to take another's life in the 21st Century, especially not to the level that Gaddafi might
We have learnt something from the middle east uprising. We now know that it is unacceptable to intervene, until the people are brave enough to challenge their own dictator. This should have been applied to Iraq - which was a military disaster.

Brilliant post sir.

When are you signing up. I'll come with you.

Are you bringing your children with you to sign up?

No? Oh.

So it'll be somebody elses kids fighting and dying then?

Brilliant.

Why don't we go after the REAL bastards that are causing death and robbery and genocide in the Arab/muslin/ middle eastern world - isreal.

Now that I'd vote for, but only if I could go myself. I'm no chicken-hawk, expecting somebody else to fight my wars for me.

You should be ashamed

Is that the same Israel that is (in spite of the best heroic efforts of people in Egypt and Tunisia for example) the only functioning democracy in the Middle East?

Having said that if you want to go and fight a war against Israel, don't let me stop you.

-- Fri Mar 18, 2011 1:49 am --

I'll probably get alsorts of abuse for this but... Israel is the most civilized country in the middle east. Coincidence? I think not. Countries like Iran, Libya and Syria are a stain on humanity.

Not from me you won't.

 

[Jackson-ctid]

Re: Looks like as from 10pm we are at war

^ someone with a bit of sense

 

[shadygiz]

Re: Looks like as from 10pm we are at war

How can we enforce it when we've decommissioned the aircraft carriers and scrapped the Harriers?

we have to fly in from malta now

 

[Fame Monster]

Re: Looks like as from 10pm we are at war

I think most people would take issue with your assertion that anyone who is prepared to die for their country is a 'scumbag'.

I know. It's a shame really, but it's a national mindset that, even in this secular society, can never be questioned.

The most bizarre thing you will ever hear is "I don't agree with the war in Iraq, but I will always support the troops because they are British". If you hire yourself out to kill (if necessary) under order, regardless of the justice of the cause, you have no-one to blame but yourself.

To my mind the difference between someone who is seeking to protect their country from what they genuinely perceive as an outside force which threatens it (however misguided) and someone who perceives that threat to come from within their own nation and attempts to change it by force is marginal.

I don't really understand what your saying. Could you please clarify your point?

I'm afraid to say as long as human beings are involved in the equation it's not going to happen. I suspect you know that, so your comments about glorious peace appear a little glib.

That is not a fact.

The wrong people are getting their hands on weapons.


As for Thatcher, I think she was just in fighting the war, because she was fighting to prevent the Falklands falling into fascist hands.

The way she fought the war, however, was legal (I shouldn't have said she was a war criminal), but grossly immoral.

The peace deal, if signed, would have kept the Falklands in British hands, and thus achieved what we was fighting for.

Some might say to take a fascist dictatorship at their word after they had invaded your sovreign territory would be a little naive.

His word was about to become an internationally binding contract.

-- Fri Mar 18, 2011 2:10 am --

Anyone who is prepared to kill a man or die for their country is an utter scumbag.
On the other hand, those who fight and die for a just cause, are the finest, most virtuous type of human being and earn a respect from me that will never die.

So you want the members of the Armed Forces to be able to pick & choose which conflict they will take part in?

Yeah, I can see that working. I'm popping in to see my Commanding Officer tomorrow to tell him that if he's got me down as having to help out with Libya then he's got another think coming.

The government (the elected representatives of the people) should put forward cases which they think the people of this country might be interested in fighting for, and say, "if you think this is a cause worth fighting for, the Government will train you, provide you with weapons, and pay you handsomely to fight in it." If there's enough men to fight in it, the war goes ahead; if there's not, it doesn't.<br /><br />-- Fri Mar 18, 2011 2:19 am --<br /><br />

When are you signing up. I'll come with you.

I'm not.

Are you bringing your children with you to sign up?

No? Oh.

Don't have any.

So it'll be somebody elses kids fighting and dying then?

I'd imagine so.

Why don't we go after the REAL bastards that are causing death and robbery and genocide in the Arab/muslin/ middle eastern world - isreal.

Israel has nothing to do with it.

Now that I'd vote for, but only if I could go myself. I'm no chicken-hawk, expecting somebody else to fight my wars for me.

Who is expecting someone to fight another's war?

If they're stupid enough to have signed up, they're fighting their own war.

 

[scall11]

Re: Looks like as from 10pm we are at war

Can someone just shut that gate please, the horse ran out about two weeks ago.

This is absolutely pathetic. The Libyans rose up against Gadaffi, and with the 'support' of other governments, they put their lives on the line to free their country. Gadaffi retaliated with air strikes against his own people, they cried out for a no fly zone, and we ignored them for a fortnight.

Gadaffi is now taking back control, and NOW we have a no fly zone.

It's pathetic that we acted so late. The UN isn't fit for purpose. They're set up to deal with matters in weeks, when, as we saw with Rwanda and Kosovo, they just can't respond within hours or day as is needed in these situations.

Pathetic. We should have enforced this sooner.