Liverpool Post Match Thread

[City_Sean]

The game was lost the moment Manuel picked that ridiculously weak team.

 

[BluessinceHydeRoad]

As a contest it was well and truly over by the half hour mark: only as a humiliation did it last the full 90 minutes and more. Liverpool were slick and assured: City were truly abysmal. Now we are hearing from pundits and fans who say they saw it all coming from the time the teams were announced. When I got the team news I was surprised to see that Otamendi and Fernandinho were on the bench but there was nothing in the starting eleven which caused me any alarm. It seemed that the question facing Pellers was one of availability rather than suitability for the fixture. Sergio was fit, but we all knew he would not play more than an hour, Eliaquim was a certain starter if you take account of where our players had been and what they had done during the international break and if one had to pick the best eleven from the 22 named to start the match, it would have been the City eleven, with Coutinho the only Liverpudlian in with a shout. Some City fans were worried, not about our team, but because "it was against Liverpool" - as though the same kind of magic lurks in the muddy waters of the Mersey as used to inhabit the Manchester United badge, which means that mediocre teams become world beaters. Klopp is not a manager but a wizard just as Ferguson was always going to "get things right". In face Liverpool had played 7 games under Klopp and won 3 - only one in the league, at Chelsea. The others were 1-0 against Rubin Kazan and Bournemouth. Their last league outing had been a home defeat to Palace. There was nothing in Liverpool' form (going back over 5 years!) to suggest anything more than an upper mid-table team.

We got massacred and it's this that gives some spurios support to claims that it was inevitable with the two teams picked. I would ask which PL teams City would have beaten on Saturday? It was not the selection but the performance of the players which produced such a miserable hour and a half. Pellegrini has some responsibility in this, in particular as to weather Sagna and in particular Mangala should have been anywhere near a football match after the ordeal they have been through but the club are better placed to decide than I am. We do have a problem in central midfield and this has dogged us under Pellers since day one, but never so disastrously badly as on Saturday and usually only against opposition of a rather higher class than Liverpool. So, I'm not saying that everything in the garden is rosy and 4-1 defeats should not happen, but I don't think it's time to panic or rant and rave.

 

[adr2.8i]

defeats bloody hurt these days dont they! We just arent used to it anymore are we?

Is complacency creeping in these days?

Even the best teams get a hammering every now and then, remember united getting stuffed twice in a week by newcastle and southampton back in the 1990's and yet they still went on and won the league that same season..... mainly because they had a team of winners and you cant tell me that we havent got a team of winners. when everyone is fit we have an amazing starting 11. Its how you react to these hammerings thats important. Lets see what we are made of. Are we men or mice?

maybe a stuffing at home is just what we needed? id like to think that the players will be hurting after that performance and id like to think that the manager would have learned a few things from that game too....hopefully.

 

[Newquayblue]

I'm still trying to fathom out Pellergini's thinking behind picking that team. He must have had Juve in his thoughts as to why he left Otamendi and Fernandhino on the bench. He seriously underestimated Liverpool thinking he could use the squad to plug a few gaps and rest players.

This!

 

[onceabluealways]

As a contest it was well and truly over by the half hour mark: only as a humiliation did it last the full 90 minutes and more. Liverpool were slick and assured: City were truly abysmal. Now we are hearing from pundits and fans who say they saw it all coming from the time the teams were announced. When I got the team news I was surprised to see that Otamendi and Fernandinho were on the bench but there was nothing in the starting eleven which caused me any alarm. It seemed that the question facing Pellers was one of availability rather than suitability for the fixture. Sergio was fit, but we all knew he would not play more than an hour, Eliaquim was a certain starter if you take account of where our players had been and what they had done during the international break and if one had to pick the best eleven from the 22 named to start the match, it would have been the City eleven, with Coutinho the only Liverpudlian in with a shout. Some City fans were worried, not about our team, but because "it was against Liverpool" - as though the same kind of magic lurks in the muddy waters of the Mersey as used to inhabit the Manchester United badge, which means that mediocre teams become world beaters. Klopp is not a manager but a wizard just as Ferguson was always going to "get things right". In face Liverpool had played 7 games under Klopp and won 3 - only one in the league, at Chelsea. The others were 1-0 against Rubin Kazan and Bournemouth. Their last league outing had been a home defeat to Palace. There was nothing in Liverpool' form (going back over 5 years!) to suggest anything more than an upper mid-table team.

We got massacred and it's this that gives some spurios support to claims that it was inevitable with the two teams picked. I would ask which PL teams City would have beaten on Saturday? It was not the selection but the performance of the players which produced such a miserable hour and a half. Pellegrini has some responsibility in this, in particular as to weather Sagna and in particular Mangala should have been anywhere near a football match after the ordeal they have been through but the club are better placed to decide than I am. We do have a problem in central midfield and this has dogged us under Pellers since day one, but never so disastrously badly as on Saturday and usually only against opposition of a rather higher class than Liverpool. So, I'm not saying that everything in the garden is rosy and 4-1 defeats should not happen, but I don't think it's time to panic or rant and rave.

This is a very good post, it is pellers job to sort the midfield, he continues to play Yaya in a two man midfield which against lesser teams is usually ok. We all know what klopp is trying to do and he flooded the midfield which totally over run us. Ok maybe pellers thought Liverpool would be like previous games but after watching the first 10 minutes enough alarm bells should have been ringing to bring on another midfielder.

 

[DAGW]

Agree with Aguero and Kompany, but I would say that Silva is just more prone to getting the shit kicked out of him by piss poor defenders every time he steps on the pitch

His ankles are a concern, a bit like Wilshere's when it comes to Arsenal. But I whole heartedly agree, teams, that know they can't match our brand of football, look to stunt our play and the easiest way is to kick David up in the air at any given opportunity. The fact the latest example came in an international game just adds insult to injury. Testament to how good he really is though!

 

[GX Blue]

Losing 4-1 is a joke. Losing 4-1 twice in 2 months isn't bad luck. Its down to bad management.
3 defeats at home this season. Its only 3 months old the season!
3 games this year, WBA away, Chelsea home and Seville away are the only games where we have played like we are a decent team. Our top performace level being hit 3 times in 3 months isnt good enough for me.

 

[waspish]

Anyone else still pissed off with Saturday? I am, he needs a decent result at Juve to vindicate that suicide team selection.

Yep still pissed of and don't give a fuck about Wednesday game we are through in that group. We should of played the strongest 11 Saturday but looks like Pellegrini thinks winning the champions league will keep him his job so he is all out on winning this to the expense of the premier.

 

[Jazzman]

3 games this year, WBA away, Chelsea home and Seville away are the only games where we have played like we are a decent team. Our top performace level being hit 3 times in 3 months isnt good enough for me.

There is a point here.

 

[sir baconface]

Most of us can take defeat. It's inevitable now and then. What's more difficult to stomach is under-achievement, as shown in this and a few other recent games. Rich or poor, you make the best of what you've got.

 

[remember arthur mann]

QUOTE="feedmpenzaandhewillscore, post: 9003163, member: 48033"]I'm still trying to fathom out Pellergini's thinking behind picking that team. He must have had Juve in his thoughts as to why he left Otamendi and Fernandhino on the bench. He seriously underestimated Liverpool thinking he could use the squad to plug a few gaps and rest players.[/QUOTE]

Sounds about right, this plus we have no idea how to defend, maybe Pellegrini has no idea how to, perhaps this is why he always goes on about attractive attacking football.

 

[Phil1]

They capitalised on our poorly organised set up and made the most of a defence in disarray and midfield who took the day off. All of their goals could have been prevented had we been at even 50% capability. Unfortunately for us we weren't even close to that and faced with a team who were willing to work hard on and off the ball the result was no surprise.
A Bournmouth or Norwich would have turned us our on Saturday. Talk of them wining the league is a bit much - they'll challange for top 4 and that's about it.

 

[Blue Elmo]

I thought tactically we were shocking. The set up of a 4-2-3-1 is not a problem if players are positioned correctly to both defend and attack. But every time we had the ball, we had our four most advanced players lining up with the Liverpool back four? WHY?!

Even now, thinking about that pisses me off so much. Sterling, De Bruyne, Aguero and Navas are all 5 foot something and none of them are going to win the header, never mind flicking it on. Going long like that, knowing that the Scouse centre halves were going to win the ball is knowingly taking four of our players out of the game. The defender wins the header, and the second ball drops to our midfield two, which is subsequently outnumbered by the Liverpool midfield 3 which will press all day long. It was fucking basic. And that problem was happening and evident from minute 5.

That's why we could never build possession and get past the press. Every defender only ever had Fernando, or a centre half to pass to. We could only go backwards or sideways, which just invited the Scousers to run and harass us even more. Toure wasn't even around to help keep the ball, for some reason he pushed forward, to break the lines, yes, but in spaces where the pass wasn't on. All we needed was for Sterling, De Bruyne Navas and Toure to drop back and help us build the play up, but they didn't. Their positioning with the back 4 was so unusual that it was clearly an idea from the manager, and the fact he didn't change it until half time, when the game was 80% out of reach was just laughable.

Second half was better, but once Liverpool saw we were playing a 4-3-1-2, with no wingers, they started playing wide. They brought on Ibe etc and exploited our weakness as soon as they found it. I saw no evidence of us being particularly prepared for the game like Liverpool were. We knew they were going to press, so why were we so arrogant enough to think we could waltz around off the ball and not work for the win?

The Sevilla game was the best tactical display from the manager since he's been at the club. It had everything going for it, the pressing in the right areas especially. But now we go back to how we played before, a lazy team who is brilliant on the ball and refuses to do the dirty side of the game. I think the manager sees playing with a solid midfield 3 as a defensive move, but look at Barcelona. To a ridiculously lesser extent, look at fucking Liverpool! They had a midfield 3 of Lucas, Can and Milner and still they had wave after wave of attack. Can was even back heeling the ball to Coutinho for the third goal.

I don't even know what to think of the Pellegrini anymore. His tactical deficiencies are rather frequently exposed and we are quite often beaten by bigger teams with a game plan and a work rate. He needs to understand that you need more than just ability. Hopefully we see MASSIVE improvement mid week because I think Saturday is the worst we have played in a long long time. Not even in the shit shit days did we get beat 4-1 at the Etihad.

 

[Goater=Legend]

Still pissed off with his stubbornness to play Yaya in a midfield 2. He's been here 3 years, the first year was fine because he was unplayable then the year after he should of seen that it just can't work anymore. The fact that he played a midfield 2 against a team who likes to press is just naive from him.

What's worse is seeing Suarez and Neymar blitz Real Madrid after the international break whilst he thought he could drop our players is disgusting, if you don't have your best defender you don't then drop your second best as well.

Really like Pellegrini and love the job he's done here but I feel his stubbornness could cost us the title this year and ultimately his job.

 

[M18CTID]

In many ways this was the "perfect storm". Best central defender and midfield player in the league missing, top scorer not match fit, our next two best players getting back from South America late and being omitted accordingly, two players who were with the French squad at the Stade de France, against a decent team with the new manager bounce, with a real sense of grievance against the club and one of its players, whose two beat best players didn't travel in midweek and an early own goal to set them on their way. Hopefully, it won't happen again.

"Perfect Storm" was exactly the phrase I was thinking about in the aftermath of this game. I've been quick to give Liverpool and their manager credit for their performance - I don't like it when fans give zero credit to the opposition and blame it all on ourselves (at the end of the day it's 11 v 11) - and we haven't got too many excuses when you compare the respective levels of performance of either side but I do believe there were a few mitigating circumstances, pretty much all of them mentioned in your above post. We certainly have no idea what state of mind Sagna and Mangala were in following the Paris attacks and perhaps we shouldn't be too quick to judge either player.

 

[Father Paul]

Lots of people are hurting, largely, I suspect because of having to listen to Redknapp, Carragher, Owen, Mcmanaman, Thompson, Quinn etc crowing in the media. For me, I recognise that, without days like yesterday I wouldn't have enjoyed putting them in their place quite as much as I have. And, to be honest, I've loved every second of their outrage and indignation. It really is their cup final and I don't say that lightly. They approach games against the rags with a huge inferiority complex but games against us as though we are the architects of their current lowly status. Deliciously, they are justified in that belief so I'm not surprised they burst every sinew to beat us. To his credit, Pellegrini sees the game for what it is, just another game against a mid-table side and, rightly, expected the players to turn in a competent performance sufficient to beat them. The point is, we have bigger fish to fry in midweek which, in the scheme of things, we can do and still win the league comfortably, injuries permitting.

You cannot be serious?

 

[Father Paul]

Christ some people are embarrassing on here. Pellegrini out ..... ok he has made a few mistakes tactically but the amount is a lot less that the decisions he has got right. Its as much the players fault as Pellegrini. People was praising him vs sevilla ( o what a great line up he got it spot on ) have a bit of loyalty and stick by the man in charge, thats how you get sustained success !!!or at the very least keep the fucking consistency with your comments.

"2015 has seen a lot of very bad defeats and many of us are getting a wee bit angry!!!

 

[Dave Ewing's Back 'eader]

"2015 has seen a lot of very bad defeats and many of us are getting a wee bit angry!!!

I think it is the fact that a good number of those defeats were avoidable with a little bit of footballing nous! Pellers has been steeped in football for six bloody decades. It's all well and typical City to set up with ne'er a thought as to how you are going to maximise the points of a Saturday tea-time. He must IMPOSE a system on a team that simply does not rely on team members bringing top form, international class and the magic onto the pitch coupled with a mentality that presumes the opposition are going to let you perform to the best of your undoubted ability!

 

[BringBackSwales]

nope, none of them were offside. all were very close but onside each time

Cheers, hard to see from family stand and I couldn't watch motd, from where I was it looked like a possible handball or 2 in the area and a foul on Sterling, not an excuse for us being shit though

 

[Father Paul]

"Perfect Storm" was exactly the phrase I was thinking about in the aftermath of this game. I've been quick to give Liverpool and their manager credit for their performance - I don't like it when fans give zero credit to the opposition and blame it all on ourselves (at the end of the day it's 11 v 11) - and we haven't got too many excuses when you compare the respective levels of performance of either side but I do believe there were a few mitigating circumstances, pretty much all of them mentioned in your above post. We certainly have no idea what state of mind Sagna and Mangala were in following the Paris attacks and perhaps we shouldn't be too quick to judge either player.

With respect to Mangala I have judged the guy long ago as, not very good. He can do a job if minded by VK but struggle to understand how we paid so much for him. However, given the events in Paris I am willing to forgive his crap performance on Saturday.