Liverpool Thread - 2022/23

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The city of Liverpool has been on the wrong side of race relations and has been quite a racist city throughout its history, even up until fairly recently too.

Back in the mid-1800s, during the American Civil War, there were numerous fundraising events for the Confederate Army in Liverpool. Ammo, weapons and uniforms were regularly sent from Liverpool to the Confederates. It was said that at the time, ‘more Confederate flags flew over Liverpool than Richmond, Virginia’.

The last belligerent Confederate Flag of the American Civil War was lowered in Liverpool as well as the final war ship from the war surrendering in Liverpool; chosen symbolically because of the city’s support of the Confederates, as if to say, ‘look, Liverpool, you’ve lost’.

Previous to this, Liverpool’s wealth as a city was built off the back of the Atlantic Slave Trade.

And right up to as recently as 2005, the Liverpool Echo wrote an article asking whether Liverpool was a uniquely racist city. In 2019 Howard Gayle did an interview with Al Jazeera where he spoke of being racially abused by his Liverpool teammate, Tommy Smith, in the late 1970s and early 80s with nobody else in the team ever stepping in to stop it or offer support. You can also hear many stories from City fans who attended games in Liverpool at both Anfield and Goodison where the large black contingent of our support were regularly racially abused at both grounds and more than anywhere else in the country - probably moreso at Goodison, where for a time there was the saying ‘Everton are white’, but there was a period of time where City fans referred to Anfield as ‘KKKlanfield’.

Even today, as you mention, there is a hell of a lot anti-Emirati and anti-Arab language and attitudes that come from the Liverpool fanbase. However, since 90% of Liverpool’s fanbase aren’t Scouse, it would be difficult today whether that is coming from Liverpudlian Liverpool fans or the wider fanbase.
Well said. It is absolutely the case that in the 70s and 80s City's support was much more diverse than LFC and Everton and it is a fact that some of our black and mixed race fans were verbally abused and attacked when we played in the city. It was also a major issue in Leeds.
The recent re-incarnation of LFC as some sort of "socialist" club with apparent liberal values is a media construction which doesn't stand up to scrutiny. It doesn't take much for the mask to slip as shown by the scores of racist (Islamophobic) comments on some of the LFC forums.
 
That's a fair comment. A few years back I was abused and threatened by a group of Liverpool fans in a town-centre pub (the Ship and Mitre which is usually ok). The opening comment from a middle-aged respectable looking woman was: "Youse would be nothing without your dirty Arab oil money." I told her she was racist and things went from bad to worse. I later found out the woman was a secondary school teacher. It is depressing to think that someone with such racist views is teaching children. Of course racism is not confined to LFC fans but LFC rarely get called out for it.
Liverpool football club fans rarely get called out for anything.
 
The size of a club doesn’t make any difference to anything, it doesn’t even mean anything. There’s no such thing as the word ‘should’ in English football either.

Sheffield Wednesday, Sunderland, Leeds and City have all had years in the third tier… I wouldn’t even call those dark days because there are hardcore fans of clubs divisions below that who turn up week-in-week-out who would dream of their club getting up to that division. Whether the expectations of Weds Sund Leeds and City fans are way beyond the fans of clubs who could only dream of being in the third tier are neither here nor there.

League 1 Sheffield Wednesday are traditionally a bigger club than Fulham, Brentford and Brighton who are in the top half of the Premier League. But if they have any fans saying ‘Wednesday should be up where those clubs are, we’re a bigger club than all of them’, they’d be wrong. All clubs are where they deserve to be and are there for a reason (how they’re run; on or off the pitch or both).

Liverpool are currently 8th. Liverpool’s average finishing position in the all-time English league system is 8.1. You said Top 4 should be a minimum, but even in the Premier League era Liverpool’s average finishing position is 4.33.

Liverpool spent eight seasons in the Second Division not all that long before they won four European Cups in eight seasons. Which eight seasons are most representative of Liverpool? I’d argue neither, they were just two sets of eight seasons of Liverpool at their extremes and the reality is neither of them are truly what Liverpool are. The realities are more likely to be the averages, for all clubs.

It’s the average 8.1 finishing position that is what Liverpool are more than they are the team that spent eight seasons in a row in the Second Division or that won four European Cups in eight seasons.

In Liverpool’s 130 years, they’ve had 40 years where they’ve won at least one trophy but 90 years where they’ve won nothing. So it’s far more likely and more common that, even one of the most decorated clubs in England wins absolutely nothing and finishes 8th than it is they win something or even finish in the Top 4.

What gets on everyone’s nerves about Liverpool fans is this ‘should’ mentality. ‘Liverpool “should” be challenging because they’re a big club’… it means nothing.

Shoulda woulda coulda and a lorra lorra laughs. English football is competitive, no team has really won that many league titles, 19 and 20 are very low numbers for a top league’s most league title winners (English football has had 96 years where neither Liverpool or United has won the league, that dwarves even Liverpool and United’s league titles combined), no team’s average finishing position is higher than that 8.1 of Liverpool’s, and that’s all because in English football there’s no such thing as ‘should’.
I wasn't aware until a couple of days ago that the mighty and all-conquering Liverpool were once knocked out of the FA Cup by Worcester City of the Southern League in January 1959 !! Former City captain Roy Paul was player manager of Worcester City at the time of their 3rd round 2-1 win.


Don't let anyone tell youse (sic) that they've always been a football powerhouse. They've had more ups and downs than an Aldridge breatherlyzer test.
 
Just seen one of their media mouth pieces say they're the most injured team in history, breaking their own record from a fee seasons ago (trophy parade incoming for that) he then went on to name a hefty 4 players missing from their last game, Chelsea were literally their opponents in that game and had I think it was 11 players unavailable. Imagine living in that much of a self-obsessed bubble that you cannot even recognise the team you're facing have it worse.
 
Just seen one of their media mouth pieces say they're the most injured team in history, breaking their own record from a fee seasons ago (trophy parade incoming for that) he then went on to name a hefty 4 players missing from their last game, Chelsea were literally their opponents in that game and had I think it was 11 players unavailable. Imagine living in that much of a self-obsessed bubble that you cannot even recognise the team you're facing have it worse.

They are a broken side, we broke them and they are not getting fixed any day soon.
 
The FSG were the mastermind behind trying to turn football into another glorified NBA . A privileged rich only competition which would've ruined every single club across Europe other than few select clubs, but apparently Newcastle are ruining football now. Not only that but I've seen takes from the people who claim to be against sportwashing openly calling for the idea of the Super League to be brought back.
 
I got banned from RAWK for saying that comments that comments targeting only City/Newcastle whilst ignoring Chelsea who seem to be playing football manager and buying everyone on sight could be seen as xenophobic, and I got abuse, hate and been bullied for days, plus I was accused of being an undercover City fan. Doesn't help that I'm British Arab and it hurts so bad seeing my fellow fans stereotype us like this, like we going to throw every LGBTQ Liverpool fan of the tallest stand in Anfield and we are all government owned who are going to require all female Liverpool staff to wear hijab and impose sharia law in Liverpool.

I'm not saying that Qatar and the middle east are immune from criticism, they deserve to be called out on issues like migrant rights, but I feel like there is a widespread stereotyping like we are all some savages and it's not a nice thing to read especially from our fans who claim to be socialist and left wing. The comments I've seen posted it about us were straight comments you'd see on a Nigel Farage show in GB News.
Ugh, I'm sorry you have to deal with that.

What did Klopp say about Mané, @Grassland Blue?
 
The city of Liverpool has been on the wrong side of race relations and has been quite a racist city throughout its history, even up until fairly recently too.

Back in the mid-1800s, during the American Civil War, there were numerous fundraising events for the Confederate Army in Liverpool. Ammo, weapons and uniforms were regularly sent from Liverpool to the Confederates. It was said that at the time, ‘more Confederate flags flew over Liverpool than Richmond, Virginia’.

The last belligerent Confederate Flag of the American Civil War was lowered in Liverpool as well as the final war ship from the war surrendering in Liverpool; chosen symbolically because of the city’s support of the Confederates, as if to say, ‘look, Liverpool, you’ve lost’.

Previous to this, Liverpool’s wealth as a city was built off the back of the Atlantic Slave Trade.

And right up to as recently as 2005, the Liverpool Echo wrote an article asking whether Liverpool was a uniquely racist city. In 2019 Howard Gayle did an interview with Al Jazeera where he spoke of being racially abused by his Liverpool teammate, Tommy Smith, in the late 1970s and early 80s with nobody else in the team ever stepping in to stop it or offer support. You can also hear many stories from City fans who attended games in Liverpool at both Anfield and Goodison where the large black contingent of our support were regularly racially abused at both grounds and more than anywhere else in the country - probably moreso at Goodison, where for a time there was the saying ‘Everton are white’, but there was a period of time where City fans referred to Anfield as ‘KKKlanfield’.

Even today, as you mention, there is a hell of a lot anti-Emirati and anti-Arab language and attitudes that come from the Liverpool fanbase. However, since 90% of Liverpool’s fanbase aren’t Scouse, it would be difficult today whether that is coming from Liverpudlian Liverpool fans or the wider fanbase.
I remember a few years ago a report came out claiming that islamaphobic crimes were down by 15% in liverpool mainly on the basis that their star forward was muslim. Makes you think will it be business as usual when he leaves
 
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