Madeleine McCann

[Prestwich_Blue]

No. You wouldn't continue the lie. Not in this way anyway. You'd keep as low a profile as possible and disappear from the media.

Fair point but there's a whole media circus around them now plus they have been relatively quiet since the book launch.

See? They can't win can they.

That's a consequence of telling a big lie.

Look at the shooting of Jean Charles de Menezes. No one is in any serious doubt that the officers who carried out the shooting put their heads together, concocted a story and then lied through their teeth at the inquest. The choice was tell the truth and probably face a murder charge or tell a lie and take the chance you'd get away with it. They did the latter and it worked but everyone knows they are a bunch of murdering liars.

 

[Pigeonho]

Re: Maddie McCann Found

this may sound controversial, but do her parents really deserve her back?

I want her to be found alive, but I want her to be adopted to parents who can actually look after their kid properly and don't put their social life first.

Silly thing to say.
Once when I was a young dad I whipped over the road for a pint of milk, leaving my then 5 year old upstairs asleep. The shop was about 20 feet away from my house and I was back within 2 minutes flat. Looking back 7 years on, anything could have happened to him. Do I not deserve my kids because I put something like a pint of milk as a priority, naively I may add?
The McCanns will live with the guilt on a daily basis, but for you to say the kid should be adopted if she's found - well I can only presume you are either A) not a parent at all, or B) the most perfect parent in the world.

 

[mackenzie]

Fair point but there's a whole media circus around them now plus they have been relatively quiet since the book launch.

See? They can't win can they.

it's not about winning.

I know it isn't. And I am damn sure they don't either. However, we are talking about trial by a non elected jury here aren't we?

 

[mackenzie]

Fair point but there's a whole media circus around them now plus they have been relatively quiet since the book launch.

See? They can't win can they.

That's a consequence of telling a big lie.

Look at the shooting of Jean Charles de Menezes. No one is in any serious doubt that the officers who carried out the shooting put their heads together, concocted a story and then lied through their teeth at the inquest. The choice was tell the truth and probably face a murder charge or tell a lie and take the chance you'd get away with it. They did the latter and it worked but everyone knows they are a bunch of murdering liars.

Completely different situation Colin, and a poor comparison. The possible dynamics in each case are wildly different.

 

[JoeMercer'sWay]

See? They can't win can they.

it's not about winning.

I know it isn't. And I am damn sure they don't either. However, we are talking about trial by a non elected jury here aren't we?

it's called opinions on a forum.

besides it's not like we can get trial by elected jury.<br /><br />-- Thu Jul 28, 2011 8:02 pm --<br /><br />

this may sound controversial, but do her parents really deserve her back?

I want her to be found alive, but I want her to be adopted to parents who can actually look after their kid properly and don't put their social life first.

Silly thing to say.
Once when I was a young dad I whipped over the road for a pint of milk, leaving my then 5 year old upstairs asleep. The shop was about 20 feet away from my house and I was back within 2 minutes flat. Looking back 7 years on, anything could have happened to him. Do I not deserve my kids because I put something like a pint of milk as a priority, naively I may add?
The McCanns will live with the guilt on a daily basis, but for you to say the kid should be adopted if she's found - well I can only presume you are either A) not a parent at all, or B) the most perfect parent in the world.

I don't know.

I just feel like they neglected their kids in favour of their social life and thus have put Madeleine through everything she may have suffered since, and I don't feel that it's right that they can just take her back if she's found alive.

 

[mackenzie]

it's not about winning.

I know it isn't. And I am damn sure they don't either. However, we are talking about trial by a non elected jury here aren't we?

it's called opinions on a forum.

besides it's not like we can get trial by elected jury.

-- Thu Jul 28, 2011 8:02 pm --

this may sound controversial, but do her parents really deserve her back?

I want her to be found alive, but I want her to be adopted to parents who can actually look after their kid properly and don't put their social life first.

Silly thing to say.
Once when I was a young dad I whipped over the road for a pint of milk, leaving my then 5 year old upstairs asleep. The shop was about 20 feet away from my house and I was back within 2 minutes flat. Looking back 7 years on, anything could have happened to him. Do I not deserve my kids because I put something like a pint of milk as a priority, naively I may add?
The McCanns will live with the guilt on a daily basis, but for you to say the kid should be adopted if she's found - well I can only presume you are either A) not a parent at all, or B) the most perfect parent in the world.

I don't know.

I just feel like they neglected their kids in favour of their social life and thus have put Madeleine through everything she may have suffered since, and I don't feel that it's right that they can just take her back if she's found alive.

We can't get a trial by an elected jury for a good reason, namely that the police have no case. And they know it.

 

[Pigeonho]

it's not about winning.

I know it isn't. And I am damn sure they don't either. However, we are talking about trial by a non elected jury here aren't we?

it's called opinions on a forum.

besides it's not like we can get trial by elected jury.

-- Thu Jul 28, 2011 8:02 pm --

this may sound controversial, but do her parents really deserve her back?

I want her to be found alive, but I want her to be adopted to parents who can actually look after their kid properly and don't put their social life first.

Silly thing to say.
Once when I was a young dad I whipped over the road for a pint of milk, leaving my then 5 year old upstairs asleep. The shop was about 20 feet away from my house and I was back within 2 minutes flat. Looking back 7 years on, anything could have happened to him. Do I not deserve my kids because I put something like a pint of milk as a priority, naively I may add?
The McCanns will live with the guilt on a daily basis, but for you to say the kid should be adopted if she's found - well I can only presume you are either A) not a parent at all, or B) the most perfect parent in the world.

I don't know.

I just feel like they neglected their kids in favour of their social life and thus have put Madeleine through everything she may have suffered since, and I don't feel that it's right that they can just take her back if she's found alive.

She's theirs!!!! They made a really, really bad judgement call but guess what, they know that and live with it every second of the day. They are fully aware their daughter is missing because of those actions and I would imagine their twins are watched like hawks, infact Mr McCann has said as much himself. As parents we all make mistakes, i've made my fair share but we learn and don't make them again - that makes us good parents. The McCanns fucked up, they know that, but you can't not give them their kid back because of it. If that was the case, where we all had our kids taken off us for a bad judgement call, the fostering industry would be thriving.

 

[JoeMercer'sWay]

I know it isn't. And I am damn sure they don't either. However, we are talking about trial by a non elected jury here aren't we?

it's called opinions on a forum.

besides it's not like we can get trial by elected jury.

-- Thu Jul 28, 2011 8:02 pm --

Silly thing to say.
Once when I was a young dad I whipped over the road for a pint of milk, leaving my then 5 year old upstairs asleep. The shop was about 20 feet away from my house and I was back within 2 minutes flat. Looking back 7 years on, anything could have happened to him. Do I not deserve my kids because I put something like a pint of milk as a priority, naively I may add?
The McCanns will live with the guilt on a daily basis, but for you to say the kid should be adopted if she's found - well I can only presume you are either A) not a parent at all, or B) the most perfect parent in the world.

I don't know.

I just feel like they neglected their kids in favour of their social life and thus have put Madeleine through everything she may have suffered since, and I don't feel that it's right that they can just take her back if she's found alive.

We can't get a trial by an elected jury for a good reason, namely that the police have no case. And they know it.

or because the portuguese fucked up.

 

[Damocles]

She's theirs!!!! They made a really, really bad judgement call but guess what, they know that and live with it every second of the day. They are fully aware their daughter is missing because of those actions and I would imagine their twins are watched like hawks, infact Mr McCann has said as much himself. As parents we all make mistakes, i've made my fair share but we learn and don't make them again - that makes us good parents. The McCanns fucked up, they know that, but you can't not give them their kid back because of it. If that was the case, where we all had our kids taken off us for a bad judgement call, the fostering industry would be thriving.

Kids are not property.

 

[Pigeonho]

She's theirs!!!! They made a really, really bad judgement call but guess what, they know that and live with it every second of the day. They are fully aware their daughter is missing because of those actions and I would imagine their twins are watched like hawks, infact Mr McCann has said as much himself. As parents we all make mistakes, i've made my fair share but we learn and don't make them again - that makes us good parents. The McCanns fucked up, they know that, but you can't not give them their kid back because of it. If that was the case, where we all had our kids taken off us for a bad judgement call, the fostering industry would be thriving.

Kids are not property.

Pardon? I didn't say she was 'property'. What are you getting at?

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

See? They can't win can they.

That's a consequence of telling a big lie.

Look at the shooting of Jean Charles de Menezes. No one is in any serious doubt that the officers who carried out the shooting put their heads together, concocted a story and then lied through their teeth at the inquest. The choice was tell the truth and probably face a murder charge or tell a lie and take the chance you'd get away with it. They did the latter and it worked but everyone knows they are a bunch of murdering liars.

Completely different situation Colin, and a poor comparison. The possible dynamics in each case are wildly different.

Why? The point was that two groups of people were faced with the ruin of their lives because they'd screwed up and someone innocent died because of it. So they were faced with the dilemma of telling the truth or telling a lie. But it had to be all of them or none. If you were to get talking to any of those firearms officers who shot Menezes, I bet they would still swear by their (completely discredited) version of events because it's the only thing they have. They might even actually have convinced themselves they are right.

 

[mackenzie]

it's called opinions on a forum.

besides it's not like we can get trial by elected jury.

-- Thu Jul 28, 2011 8:02 pm --



I don't know.

I just feel like they neglected their kids in favour of their social life and thus have put Madeleine through everything she may have suffered since, and I don't feel that it's right that they can just take her back if she's found alive.

We can't get a trial by an elected jury for a good reason, namely that the police have no case. And they know it.

or because the portuguese fucked up.

That goes without saying, but it doesn't mean the mccanns are somehow guilty by default.
However If that child had been either murdered or killed by accident that night, in that room, then the case would have been much easier to solve. The police sniffer dog means nothing. It was a rental holiday room. God knows how many visitors had stayed there or passed through it.

 

[mcfcliam]

She's theirs!!!! They made a really, really bad judgement call but guess what, they know that and live with it every second of the day. They are fully aware their daughter is missing because of those actions and I would imagine their twins are watched like hawks, infact Mr McCann has said as much himself. As parents we all make mistakes, i've made my fair share but we learn and don't make them again - that makes us good parents. The McCanns fucked up, they know that, but you can't not give them their kid back because of it. If that was the case, where we all had our kids taken off us for a bad judgement call, the fostering industry would be thriving.

Kids are not property.

Pardon? I didn't say she was 'property'. What are you getting at?

It's just Damocles getting a bit giddy...just like he did in the 'kill the cheese' thread.

 

[JoeMercer'sWay]

We can't get a trial by an elected jury for a good reason, namely that the police have no case. And they know it.

or because the portuguese fucked up.

That goes without saying, but it doesn't mean the mccanns are somehow guilty by default.
However If that child had been either murdered or killed by accident that night, in that room, then the case would have been much easier to solve. The police sniffer dog means nothing. It was a rental holiday room. God knows how many visitors had stayed there or passed through it.

we'll never know if they are because they fucked up.

so we have to take them as being innocent, but there's always that underlying nagging doubt about it.

 

[Dobsy]

She's theirs!!!! They made a really, really bad judgement call but guess what, they know that and live with it every second of the day. They are fully aware their daughter is missing because of those actions and I would imagine their twins are watched like hawks, infact Mr McCann has said as much himself. As parents we all make mistakes, i've made my fair share but we learn and don't make them again - that makes us good parents. The McCanns fucked up, they know that, but you can't not give them their kid back because of it. If that was the case, where we all had our kids taken off us for a bad judgement call, the fostering industry would be thriving.

Kids are not property.

Pardon? I didn't say she was 'property'. What are you getting at?

think it's the way you call it the fostering 'industry' pigeonho, it implies that fostering is like a commercial business. I can just imagine the ads lol. just the wrong end of the stick.

 

[mackenzie]

That's a consequence of telling a big lie.

Look at the shooting of Jean Charles de Menezes. No one is in any serious doubt that the officers who carried out the shooting put their heads together, concocted a story and then lied through their teeth at the inquest. The choice was tell the truth and probably face a murder charge or tell a lie and take the chance you'd get away with it. They did the latter and it worked but everyone knows they are a bunch of murdering liars.

Completely different situation Colin, and a poor comparison. The possible dynamics in each case are wildly different.

Why? The point was that two groups of people were faced with the ruin of their lives because they'd screwed up and someone innocent died because of it. So they were faced with the dilemma of telling the truth or telling a lie. But it had to be all of them or none. If you were to get talking to any of those firearms officers who shot Menezes, I bet they would still swear by their (completely discredited) version of events because it's the only thing they have. They might even actually have convinced themselves they are right.

Why? Because we aren't talking about a stranger here or the loss of a career etc but the loss of a child! Of course it's different Colin.

 

[gaudinho's stolen car]

Who'd have thunk there would be a disagreement on a thread about the McCann's?

 

[mackenzie]

or because the portuguese fucked up.

That goes without saying, but it doesn't mean the mccanns are somehow guilty by default.
However If that child had been either murdered or killed by accident that night, in that room, then the case would have been much easier to solve. The police sniffer dog means nothing. It was a rental holiday room. God knows how many visitors had stayed there or passed through it.

we'll never know if they are because they fucked up.

so we have to take them as being innocent, but there's always that underlying nagging doubt about it.

Believe me when I say that I know what you mean, the nagging doubt thing that is. But having read a lot on this case I believe the mccanns are innocent. I may be wrong but I hope I'm not. The parallels with the chamberlain case make me err on the side of caution to some extent.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

Who'd have thunk there would be a disagreement on a thread about the McCann's?

I know. Let's change the subject to something we all agree on. Like religion.

 

[mackenzie]

Who'd have thunk there would be a disagreement on a thread about the McCann's?

'twas always thus, especially when it first happened.