Mancini Protest

[GStar]

Do Chelsea change thier line up from playing Stoke to playing Liverpool? I doubt it.

Will Arsenal have changed thier formation next week against Blackburn? No.

I wouldnt be surprised if both change their lineup, especially if there are fitness/injury issues as there were with us on Saturday.

Precisely my point, we keep changing tactics to accomodate the opposition as opposed to playing to our strengths and letting our quality shine through.

Again I think you overstate changes that we make to our tactical approach. But there has to be some changes, every team in the world (bar maybe Barca) will adjust there approach depending on the opposition.

Personel wise yes, but as i just mentioned to IP, thier formation and set up willremian pretty much the same.

Possibly i do, but then, 14 goals in three games then 2 shots on goal and 0 goals in 2 games... thats a huge variance and i beleive the maincontributing factor is the strings Mancini puts on us against the top 6/8 teams in the league... as far down as Stoke infact, we compromised our squad to try and 'match them'. When we had the quality to get the ball down and let our superior footbaling quality battle thier ariel game.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

Jesus H Christ! What a load of fucking bollox.

Remind me Cheesy - why did you have to resign your post of Professor of Logic & Philosophy at Oxford University?

 

[Anonymous]

Honestly if you looked back at the games against Burnley and Birmingham and Arsenal and the rags you would see nothing different from the system or gameplan we used. I don't think you'd disagree that Bellamy, Johnson and Tevez have been poor the last two games would you?? Now imagine if them 3 had even produced the kind of form they showed against Burnley and Birmingham against the rags and Arsenal and the two results may have been better.

Like moomba said, sometimes players and teams are better than the opposition, it's not always a case of what the manager has set out to do, too much emphasis is put on them these days.

Going back to your last point, you are spot on, there isn't any need to get rid of most of the squad as they are good enough for a top 4 side but Mancini and the club aren't thinking of just being good enough for a top 4 side, i'd like to think that in 2-3 years they would expect to be challenging for all major honours and that will require a tottally different squad of players than we have now.

I think we fluttered between variations of 433/442 but the big differnece is the creativity and freedom we've given the team. When we give players a liscence to get forward and create, our front men are supported and we look good.

Against Arsenal i've never seen Tevez so isolated. Bellamy and Johnson barely crossed the halfway line and we were instructed to sit very deep and very compact.

Perhaps that was the right way to approach the game, but surely as we grew into it, we could take more chances? Thats how the great teams grind out results, they make sure they give themselves every oppourtunity to score.

I don't watch utd much but they've played 433 pretty much all season, Nani/Giggs left Valencia right and Rooney up front.

They may change personel but thier philosophy and set up rarely changes.

It was all about how the players performed. Against Chelsea away, Bellamy and Tevez were on fire, they weren't yesterday, it's a simple as that, the system and gameplan was the same.

As for the rags, they vary on the system they use on who they play. 4-5-1 against the better sides with Berbatov on the bench and 4-4-2 against the lesser sides with Berbatov partnering Rooney upfront.

Chelsea never change the system as they are built like a machine, they have balance and quality across the side to make the 4-3-3 work against anyone.

Liverpool do chnage they their system as well, alot infact.

 

[GStar]

look at chelsea's line up over the season. they alter their front line every week. drogba up front, or anelka up front, or both, they swap attacking midfielders for genuine wide men, genuine wide men for strikers-cum wingers. they swap ballack mikkel lampard deco and cole around to change the balance of the midfield. they swap attacking fullbacks for defensive fullbacks.

rags changed their formation loads as well this year. they did it when they played us in the CC, changed their formation for the second leg.

rafa drives the scousers nuts because he swaps his formation and line ups about so much. they'd do it even more if they had more than one striker.

arsenal swap between walcott and eboue on the right. go from one up front to two and back again. the attacking players start in all different kinds of positions on a weekly basis.

Look at Chelsea squad rotation yes, thier formation and set up rarely changes. Anelka will move into the wide position if Drogba plays, or central if ge doesn't.

The point was never that the top teams play the same 11 week in week out, they don't.

What they do, is have a formation and core competeancies that, whoever is playing, adhere too.

They don't set up for a draw one week and they create 15 chances the next. They have a balance, work hard as a unit and look to score in every game at every oppourtunity.

 

[hilts]

Just a quick question for all those who love Mancini and will brook no criticism of him. Why do you think that some fellow City fans who love the club just as much as you do, have such reservations about Mancini's approach to certain games/periods of certain games/substitutions in some games? Are we all ignorant fuckers who don't really understand the game? Miserable fuckers who just moan for the sake of it? Hughes fans who've never given Mancini a chance? Speaking for myself I'm none of the above, but I just wish he'd had a more adventurous approach to some of the games that have passed us by. Sunderland away springs to mind. As does Liverpool at home. The substitutions in both home games against United. His decision to go with Vieira ahead of Adebayor yesterday. That's just off the top of my head, but there's probably more. OK, if we finish Fourth, the point we picked up in games against Liverpool, Sunderland and Arsenal, and his decision to try to pick up a point against United will be vindicated. However, if we miss out on Fourth, some of these decisions will come back to haunt us big time, and are fair game for discussion imo. So why does his fan club have to get so precious/defensive whenever anyone attempts to discuss them?

The problem is that we dont what the results would have been if he didnt do those things, for instance say he played adebayor from the off and got beat and lost out on fourth by one point, but as he didnt we will never know. I go off the fact that he knows more about football than i do and probably sees things that fans dont. Also most fans tend to think of subs and formation from an attacking point of view rather than how they would affect the team at the back.

I have yet to meet a fan who hasnt questioned a manager about subs or team selections even the best teams fans do it

 

[Braggster]

I wouldnt be surprised if both change their lineup, especially if there are fitness/injury issues as there were with us on Saturday.



Again I think you overstate changes that we make to our tactical approach. But there has to be some changes, every team in the world (bar maybe Barca) will adjust there approach depending on the opposition.

Personel wise yes, but as i just mentioned to IP, thier formation and set up willremian pretty much the same.

Possibly i do, but then, 14 goals in three games then 2 shots on goal and 0 goals in 2 games... thats a huge variance and i beleive the maincontributing factor is the strings Mancini puts on us against the top 6/8 teams in the league... as far down as Stoke infact, we compromised our squad to try and 'match them'. When we had the quality to get the ball down an
d let our superior footbaling quality battle thier ariel game.

THe 'big 4' have a totally different tactical approach when playing each other (and, this season, City and Spurs) than they do playing the rest of the league.

The only exception to that are Arsenal, whose playing style really doesn't change much from game to game.

Encounters between the big 4 are highly tactical affairs and full of 'negative' football. IMO.

 

[GStar]

It was all about how the players performed. Against Chelsea away, Bellamy and Tevez were on fire, they weren't yesterday, it's a simple as that, the system and gameplan was the same.

I disagree with this bit, Tevez was poor because he was isolated, Bellamy was poor because he was instructed to play so deep.

Its not huge fluctuations in individual form that causes the differnet styles we play, its how were set out from the off imo.

 

[moomba]

Encounters between the big 4 are highly tactical affairs and full of 'negative' football. IMO.

Agreed, in fact most blockbuster matches between the Sky 4 are overhyped, over publicised and boring as fuck.

 

[Bigga]

Just a quick question for all those who love Mancini and will brook no criticism of him. Why do you think that some fellow City fans who love the club just as much as you do, have such reservations about Mancini's approach to certain games/periods of certain games/substitutions in some games? Are we all ignorant fuckers who don't really understand the game? Miserable fuckers who just moan for the sake of it? Hughes fans who've never given Mancini a chance? Speaking for myself I'm none of the above, but I just wish he'd had a more adventurous approach to some of the games that have passed us by. Sunderland away springs to mind. As does Liverpool at home. The substitutions in both home games against United. His decision to go with Vieira ahead of Adebayor yesterday. That's just off the top of my head, but there's probably more. OK, if we finish Fourth, the point we picked up in games against Liverpool, Sunderland and Arsenal, and his decision to try to pick up a point against United will be vindicated. However, if we miss out on Fourth, some of these decisions will come back to haunt us big time, and are fair game for discussion imo. So why does his fan club have to get so precious/defensive whenever anyone attempts to discuss them?

spot on fella....i'm also none of the above, but i am a dyed in the wool city fan who wants whats best for this club and more fool me, i also have an opinion

Yes, 'spot on'.











Oo, except for one thing. We know, Mancini knows and everybody else knows that we don't have a play maker in the squad. Not a one. We have one masquerading as one (Mr Ireland), but not a real one.

This gives us two disadvantages. One; not being able to create chances that would make our shot tally rise beyond what it is now, when the players cannot break team down. Two; prevents Tevez from being where he does the most damage up front. He cannot always see the best pass and he tends to hold the ball far too long.

Having a play maker of reputed note allows us two things. One; being able to create chances that would make our shot tally rise beyond what it is now!! and two; allows Tevez to concentrate on doing the damage where he is best off. The last third of the pitch.

Mancini plays with Hughes' team as he said he could do this. He made a rod for his own back but, by and large, he's stuck to that decision and had sh*t loads of gumption to commit to it.

Can I also add that this is a sh*t thread? Also, is the Hughes 'inners' doing the anti Roberto thing? Surely for balance and fairness, give man time to mould a team to his own fashion before condemning him!!?!

 

[hgblue]

Just a quick question for all those who love Mancini and will brook no criticism of him. Why do you think that some fellow City fans who love the club just as much as you do, have such reservations about Mancini's approach to certain games/periods of certain games/substitutions in some games? Are we all ignorant fuckers who don't really understand the game? Miserable fuckers who just moan for the sake of it? Hughes fans who've never given Mancini a chance? Speaking for myself I'm none of the above, but I just wish he'd had a more adventurous approach to some of the games that have passed us by. Sunderland away springs to mind. As does Liverpool at home. The substitutions in both home games against United. His decision to go with Vieira ahead of Adebayor yesterday. That's just off the top of my head, but there's probably more. OK, if we finish Fourth, the point we picked up in games against Liverpool, Sunderland and Arsenal, and his decision to try to pick up a point against United will be vindicated. However, if we miss out on Fourth, some of these decisions will come back to haunt us big time, and are fair game for discussion imo. So why does his fan club have to get so precious/defensive whenever anyone attempts to discuss them?

Fairplay hg. I am an unapologetic supporter of Mancini based on a degree of tactical sophistication I had not seen at City before. Throw into the mix his CV and I stand by my support. But that does not mean I am blind, and there have been times where he has been overly negative. And it may cost us.

It may be because he has little faith in some players, I don't know. Or it maybe a lack of appreciation of the pace of the premier league.

I am just hoping rather than believing he can get us over the line.

My point is that we all are. Just because some may point to some perceived mistakes by Mancini, doesn't mean that we're not all desperate for him to lead us to the Champions League, and for many years to come. I like him, and have already posted in another thread that I'd be pleased to see him stay.......