Mancini write-up by Didsbury Dave

[Blue Tooth]

Wow, so much cyber anger directed at a poster on the internet.

I wasn't aware Mancini posted on here but it's amazing how you have captured the pictures in Dave's mind's eye.

Hahaha. That is funny. Although tbf it could be any one of the cabal. Our hatred for him knew no bounds ... ;)

aaahhh...but did any of you get your own nickname though? ;)<br /><br />-- Fri May 17, 2013 11:19 am --<br /><br />

Dismal has been very quiet since the thread started - prefering his alter ego Billy BS to be the mouthpiece on this one. Bit like Cannon and Ball but you only get one of them at once, and it's usually Ball(s)

The thing for sure is that when we are next graced with his wit and knowledge it will take the form of a pompous diatribe designed to tell us all how he knows everything and anyone who disagrees with him is...clueless...young...blah...blah

I think that was the idea. It definitely needs to go in the classics this fucker. It reminds me of Lard Arse Logan drinking castor oil, eating eggs and then going into his cherry pie contest. Sit back and watch the chaos unfold.

Brilliant.

Dismal Dave was in fact the Tyler Durden to Mancini's Edward Norton. Now they are both gone ;)

 

[Anonymous]

Not getting all this at all.

I disagree regularly with both Billy and DD. Tere's been the occasional patronising comment both ways, but nothing untoward (or I've certainly not been offended by anything directed at me, and I hope that works the other way too).

I don't necessarily agree with Dave's article, but it was a good read nonetheless. It draws together a lot of what has been written post Mancini and what Dave claims to know from inside the club as well. It also gives credit in parts to Mancini and draws an inevitable conclusion.

I've no issue with it; they're his thoughts and opinions and in my view fairly well drawn together.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

Not getting all this at all.

I disagree regularly with both Billy and DD. Tere's been the occasional patronising comment both ways, but nothing untoward (or I've certainly not been offended by anything directed at me, and I hope that works the other way too).

I don't necessarily agree with Dave's article, but it was a good read nonetheless. It draws together a lot of what has been written post Mancini and what Dave claims to know from inside the club as well. It also gives credit in parts to Mancini and draws an inevitable conclusion.

I've no issue with it; they're his thoughts and opinions and in my view fairly well drawn together.

Which is exactly the right attitude, even if you don't agree 100% with the sentiments.

 

[Lucky Toma]

Dismal has been very quiet since the thread started - prefering his alter ego Billy BS to be the mouthpiece on this one. Bit like Cannon and Ball but you only get one of them at once, and it's usually Ball(s)

The thing for sure is that when we are next graced with his wit and knowledge it will take the form of a pompous diatribe designed to tell us all how he knows everything and anyone who disagrees with him is...clueless...young...blah...blah

I think that was the idea. It definitely needs to go in the classics this fucker. It reminds me of Lard Arse Logan drinking castor oil, eating eggs and then going into his cherry pie contest. Sit back and watch the chaos unfold.

Brilliant.

Made me laugh that Pidge :)

It's the power of silence isnt it. Dave has written his piece then sat back and let the words speak for themselves.

Meanwhile his haters are doing his work for him. I've seen at least ten variations of 'If Dismal came on here no doubt he'd say...' followed by put-downs aimed at themselves. Glorious stuff.

I've had a fair few run-ins with DD in my time and sometimes one of us has twisted the knife but there has never been any lingering animosity. I just don't get the intense emotions he stirs up at all - he's a blue with strong opinions, can be condescending as hell in combat, but a decent-to-the-bone bloke.

The last bit is all that matters. The rest is just forum nonsense.

 

[Scareye]

Dismal has been very quiet since the thread started - prefering his alter ego Billy BS to be the mouthpiece on this one. Bit like Cannon and Ball but you only get one of them at once, and it's usually Ball(s)

The thing for sure is that when we are next graced with his wit and knowledge it will take the form of a pompous diatribe designed to tell us all how he knows everything and anyone who disagrees with him is...clueless...young...blah...blah

I think that was the idea. It definitely needs to go in the classics this fucker. It reminds me of Lard Arse Logan drinking castor oil, eating eggs and then going into his cherry pie contest. Sit back and watch the chaos unfold.

Brilliant.

Made me laugh that Pidge :)

It's the power of silence isnt it. Dave has written his piece then sat back and let the words speak for themselves.

Meanwhile his haters are doing his work for him. I've seen at least ten variations of 'If Dismal came on here no doubt he'd say...' followed by put-downs aimed at themselves. Glorious stuff.

I've had a fair few run-ins with DD in my time and sometimes one of us has twisted the knife but there has never been any lingering animosity. I just don't get the intense emotions he stirs up at all - he's a blue with strong opinions, can be condescending as hell in combat, but a decent-to-the-bone bloke.

The last bit is all that matters. The rest is just forum nonsense.

Spot on mate.

 

[GaudinoMotors]

I think that was the idea. It definitely needs to go in the classics this fucker. It reminds me of Lard Arse Logan drinking castor oil, eating eggs and then going into his cherry pie contest. Sit back and watch the chaos unfold.

Brilliant.

Made me laugh that Pidge :)

It's the power of silence isnt it. Dave has written his piece then sat back and let the words speak for themselves.

Meanwhile his haters are doing his work for him. I've seen at least ten variations of 'If Dismal came on here no doubt he'd say...' followed by put-downs aimed at themselves. Glorious stuff.

I've had a fair few run-ins with DD in my time and sometimes one of us has twisted the knife but there has never been any lingering animosity. I just don't get the intense emotions he stirs up at all - he's a blue with strong opinions, can be condescending as hell in combat, but a decent-to-the-bone bloke.

The last bit is all that matters. The rest is just forum nonsense.

Spot on mate.

So now the Svengali is a genius - simply by not logging in - ycnmiu

 

[gio's side step]

It's a good read and I genuinely empathise with a lot of what Dave says.

I would say (for balance) however, what would the blog have said had we (a) got a slightly easier group in the CL and (b) signed RVP? I suspect the tone re: Mancini's personality would be the same but had the players won the league again it would be very difficult for anyone to justify a sacking. The fact that we haven't doesn't mean we should just throw any critique from that perspective out of the window.

Its very easy to define this whole episode by one or two details when in reality its a complex mix of several (and in some instances the concerns raised in the blog re: Mancini's style of management do seem absolutely fair). I would also agree with Dave's point re: when the going gets tough or form dips, a generally cohesive camp are more likely to respond to adversity.

But I do think this underplays other factors i.e. players taking personal responsibility. It is not soley Mancini's fault for Aguero's dip in form (lack of goals) or Silva not being as incisive and clinical as last season. Perhaps he should take some responsibility but the players need to (regardless of whether they like Mancini's style of management) take some serious responsibility. I don't buy the argument its simply a managers job to get the maximum out of his players. It's his job to select the correct team and implement the correct tactics (again some failings noted re: 3 at the back in the blog) but the players have under performed and at times played within themselves. I am as equally disapointed in them as I am in Mancini.

The critical ingredient here is - Mancini I suspect, has not changed his management style significantly this season. He has made huge mistakes in criticising players in public regardless of whether it was deserved, but his general tone has been the same as that which brought us the title. The players on the whole are the same players working under the same manager. Thus I cannot buy the idea the players have just decided 'oh fuck off Mancini' this year. I suspect some of them have never liked him. So what? The organisation, culture brought us success. Lets not under play that either.

This season we have been defined by small margins. Failure to sign the critical ingredient in the title race. Failure to hold on at Madrid which might have changed the whole nature of the momentum in that tough CL group. Failure to stop one free kick against Utd at home which mentally swung the title in their favour. Failure to deal with Balotelli earlier.

These margins could have easily been different and we'd still be saying the same things about Mancini's personality and management style yet we might be champions again.

At times, Mancini has been a PR disaster. So have some of the players. But we have all collectively, changed the nature of this football club significantly in the past 3 years. And it is for that reason that ultimately, this is all rather sad. It doesnt matter if you detest Mancini or hold blind faith towards him, to have sacked a man on the day he brought us our first title in so long one year later is very sad indeed.

Modern football is what it is. No manager will build an empire or even stay at a club 10 years anymore. Pellegrini may well come in and take us through to the next round of the CL and win the title. But we'll find faults in him somewhere. And in a few years we'll probably make a change again for the better or worse.

 

[GaudinoMotors]

It's a good read and I genuinely empathise with a lot of what Dave says.

I would say (for balance) however, what would the blog have said had we (a) got a slightly easier group in the CL and (b) signed RVP? I suspect the tone re: Mancini's personality would be the same but had the players won the league again it would be very difficult for anyone to justify a sacking. The fact that we haven't doesn't mean we should just throw any critique from that perspective out of the window.

Its very easy to define this whole episode by one or two details when in reality its a complex mix of several (and in some instances the concerns raised in the blog re: Mancini's style of management do seem absolutely fair). I would also agree with Dave's point re: when the going gets tough or form dips, a generally cohesive camp are more likely to respond to adversity.

But I do think this underplays other factors i.e. players taking personal responsibility. It is not soley Mancini's fault for Aguero's dip in form (lack of goals) or Silva not being as incisive and clinical as last season. Perhaps he should take some responsibility but the players need to (regardless of whether they like Mancini's style of management) take some serious responsibility. I don't buy the argument its simply a managers job to get the maximum out of his players. It's his job to select the correct team and implement the correct tactics (again some failings noted re: 3 at the back in the blog) but the players have under performed and at times played within themselves. I am as equally disapointed in them as I am in Mancini.

The critical ingredient here is - Mancini I suspect, has not changed his management style significantly this season. He has made huge mistakes in criticising players in public regardless of whether it was deserved, but his general tone has been the same as that which brought us the title. The players on the whole are the same players working under the same manager. Thus I cannot buy the idea the players have just decided 'oh fuck off Mancini' this year. I suspect some of them have never liked him. So what? The organisation, culture brought us success. Lets not under play that either.

This season we have been defined by small margins. Failure to sign the critical ingredient in the title race. Failure to hold on at Madrid which might have changed the whole nature of the momentum in that tough CL group. Failure to stop one free kick against Utd at home which mentally swung the title in their favour. Failure to deal with Balotelli earlier.

These margins could have easily been different and we'd still be saying the same things about Mancini's personality and management style yet we might be champions again.

At times, Mancini has been a PR disaster. So have some of the players. But we have all collectively, changed the nature of this football club significantly in the past 3 years. And it is for that reason that ultimately, this is all rather sad. It doesnt matter if you detest Mancini or hold blind faith towards him, to have sacked a man on the day he brought us our first title in so long one year later is very sad indeed.

Modern football is what it is. No manager will build an empire or even stay at a club 10 years anymore. Pellegrini may well come in and take us through to the next round of the CL and win the title. But we'll find faults in him somewhere. And in a few years we'll probably make a change again for the better or worse.

Far better - actually rational

 

[hgblue]

It's a good read and I genuinely empathise with a lot of what Dave says.

I would say (for balance) however, what would the blog have said had we (a) got a slightly easier group in the CL and (b) signed RVP? I suspect the tone re: Mancini's personality would be the same but had the players won the league again it would be very difficult for anyone to justify a sacking. The fact that we haven't doesn't mean we should just throw any critique from that perspective out of the window.

Its very easy to define this whole episode by one or two details when in reality its a complex mix of several (and in some instances the concerns raised in the blog re: Mancini's style of management do seem absolutely fair). I would also agree with Dave's point re: when the going gets tough or form dips, a generally cohesive camp are more likely to respond to adversity.

But I do think this underplays other factors i.e. players taking personal responsibility. It is not soley Mancini's fault for Aguero's dip in form (lack of goals) or Silva not being as incisive and clinical as last season. Perhaps he should take some responsibility but the players need to (regardless of whether they like Mancini's style of management) take some serious responsibility. I don't buy the argument its simply a managers job to get the maximum out of his players. It's his job to select the correct team and implement the correct tactics (again some failings noted re: 3 at the back in the blog) but the players have under performed and at times played within themselves. I am as equally disapointed in them as I am in Mancini.

The critical ingredient here is - Mancini I suspect, has not changed his management style significantly this season. He has made huge mistakes in criticising players in public regardless of whether it was deserved, but his general tone has been the same as that which brought us the title. The players on the whole are the same players working under the same manager. Thus I cannot buy the idea the players have just decided 'oh fuck off Mancini' this year. I suspect some of them have never liked him. So what? The organisation, culture brought us success. Lets not under play that either.

This season we have been defined by small margins. Failure to sign the critical ingredient in the title race. Failure to hold on at Madrid which might have changed the whole nature of the momentum in that tough CL group. Failure to stop one free kick against Utd at home which mentally swung the title in their favour. Failure to deal with Balotelli earlier.

These margins could have easily been different and we'd still be saying the same things about Mancini's personality and management style yet we might be champions again.

At times, Mancini has been a PR disaster. So have some of the players. But we have all collectively, changed the nature of this football club significantly in the past 3 years. And it is for that reason that ultimately, this is all rather sad. It doesnt matter if you detest Mancini or hold blind faith towards him, to have sacked a man on the day he brought us our first title in so long one year later is very sad indeed.

Modern football is what it is. No manager will build an empire or even stay at a club 10 years anymore. Pellegrini may well come in and take us through to the next round of the CL and win the title. But we'll find faults in him somewhere. And in a few years we'll probably make a change again for the better or worse.

But you can't seperate the loss of form of a squad packed with top quality players from Mancini's management of those players. There's only one player who has consistantly performed at his best this season, and that just can't be a coincidence. One player downing tools, maybe two, because he has an issue with the manager, can be put down to a bad egg with a shit attitude who we'd be better off without, but when the likes of Kompany, Hart, Barry, Yaya, Silva, Aguero, basically everyone except Zab, are underperforming at the same time, then there has to be a root cause. In my opinion, and in the opinion of the majority of so called Outers, this was the management style of the manager. Seems the powers that be agreed with this assessment, and I expect to see a marked improvement in performance level next season under a decent man manager. Not because the players were playing poorly on purpose, but because they had simply all had enough of the guy and it showed on the pitch.

 

[gio's side step]

It's a good read and I genuinely empathise with a lot of what Dave says.

I would say (for balance) however, what would the blog have said had we (a) got a slightly easier group in the CL and (b) signed RVP? I suspect the tone re: Mancini's personality would be the same but had the players won the league again it would be very difficult for anyone to justify a sacking. The fact that we haven't doesn't mean we should just throw any critique from that perspective out of the window.

Its very easy to define this whole episode by one or two details when in reality its a complex mix of several (and in some instances the concerns raised in the blog re: Mancini's style of management do seem absolutely fair). I would also agree with Dave's point re: when the going gets tough or form dips, a generally cohesive camp are more likely to respond to adversity.

But I do think this underplays other factors i.e. players taking personal responsibility. It is not soley Mancini's fault for Aguero's dip in form (lack of goals) or Silva not being as incisive and clinical as last season. Perhaps he should take some responsibility but the players need to (regardless of whether they like Mancini's style of management) take some serious responsibility. I don't buy the argument its simply a managers job to get the maximum out of his players. It's his job to select the correct team and implement the correct tactics (again some failings noted re: 3 at the back in the blog) but the players have under performed and at times played within themselves. I am as equally disapointed in them as I am in Mancini.

The critical ingredient here is - Mancini I suspect, has not changed his management style significantly this season. He has made huge mistakes in criticising players in public regardless of whether it was deserved, but his general tone has been the same as that which brought us the title. The players on the whole are the same players working under the same manager. Thus I cannot buy the idea the players have just decided 'oh fuck off Mancini' this year. I suspect some of them have never liked him. So what? The organisation, culture brought us success. Lets not under play that either.

This season we have been defined by small margins. Failure to sign the critical ingredient in the title race. Failure to hold on at Madrid which might have changed the whole nature of the momentum in that tough CL group. Failure to stop one free kick against Utd at home which mentally swung the title in their favour. Failure to deal with Balotelli earlier.

These margins could have easily been different and we'd still be saying the same things about Mancini's personality and management style yet we might be champions again.

At times, Mancini has been a PR disaster. So have some of the players. But we have all collectively, changed the nature of this football club significantly in the past 3 years. And it is for that reason that ultimately, this is all rather sad. It doesnt matter if you detest Mancini or hold blind faith towards him, to have sacked a man on the day he brought us our first title in so long one year later is very sad indeed.

Modern football is what it is. No manager will build an empire or even stay at a club 10 years anymore. Pellegrini may well come in and take us through to the next round of the CL and win the title. But we'll find faults in him somewhere. And in a few years we'll probably make a change again for the better or worse.

But you can't seperate the loss of form of a squad packed with top quality players from Mancini's management of those players. There's only one player who has consistantly performed at his best this season, and that just can't be a coincidence. One player downing tools, maybe two, because he has an issue with the manager, can be put down to a bad egg with a shit attitude who we'd be better off without, but when the likes of Kompany, Hart, Barry, Yaya, Silva, Aguero, basically everyone except Zab, are underperforming at the same time, then there has to be a root cause. In my opinion, and in the opinion of the majority of so called Outers, this was the management style of the manager. Seems the powers that be agreed with this assessment, and I expect to see a marked improvement in performance level next season under a decent man manager. Not because the players were playing poorly on purpose, but because they had simply all had enough of the guy and it showed on the pitch.

I understand what you are saying here - but equally I've seen us in many home games in particular where whilst we might not have been scintilating, we have still (often in the 2nd half of games) played very well but have just lacked goals. Our defence has been outstanding (record wise) so that is taking into account your analysis of Hart and Kompany's dip in form. Equally, it is not merely down to one player - Nastasic.

The problem has really materialised in some away games where we have had a combination of (a) really poor performances collectively and (b) just didn't score enough when we were on top - which is more centred around the final 3rd players.

In my post (and I generally agree with a lot of Dave's points) I acknowledge that his style of management is problematic (on a personal level for the player) but it has still brought us results - we have still finished 2nd and should have won a major trophy (we can all argue why we didn't - but I do think some of the reasons I highlighted are significant contributory factors).

I was just asking for collective responsibility and I don't feel enough attention has been towards the players to balance out the general anti Mancini narrative