Mancini

[Lancet Fluke]

You've had the answer several times, but it seems difficult for you to digest. Several of our players are overrated and once the Premier League clubs decided to pay attention to what the top European clubs were doing against us in the Champions League, their effectiveness dropped severely.

You may think I have had the answer but I haven't because I find your answer totally unsatisfactory. We sign a load of players for loads of money, they all have tremendous reputations because they have played so well at other clubs. They then play well enough for us to become champions and get 10 points in CL group. Then they are all overrated because opposition teams change their tactics and the players aren't good enough to combat this change. Or maybe, we have really good players who aren't overrated, teams have changed their tactics and Mancini (you know, the guy in charge of our tactics and combatting opposition tactics) has failed to adapt? Just a thought.

He has tried to adapt but the players have resisted saying they dont like new formations

Have they definitely said they don't like new formations? How many of them said it? Do you need an entirely new formation to change tactics? Is it realistic to think that we have a squad of players who are any more likely to resist a change of tactics than any other squad in the world? Is it the manager's job to manage his squad and convince them of a change in tactics, just like it is at any other club? As I said, some people will just blame anything and anyone before Mancini.

 

[FantasyIreland]

I never got an answer sometime back about the origins of Fantasy's user name. However if it has anything to do with a former City midfielder it would explain his dislike of Mancini, who saw Stevie for what he is, average.

We gave Hughes shed loads and it got us nowhere. Mancini has done a good job in difficult circumstances. ie permanent press hassle, weight of expectation.

Whether Moyes, Martinez etc can handle that who knows. We probably knew Mancini could because he managed successfully at Internazionale, a club who's expectation levels and history are in excess of ours.

As we saw with Hughes, quite good at Blackburn, managing a mid table outfit is no preparation for managing the modern Manchester City.

Personally feel Martinez is lightweight. Moyes may have the cojones but not the style of play and doesn't seem a fit. Laudrup of the three mentioned might have what it takes, temperamentally wise and also in coaching ability.

I liked Ireland and believed,had he not been a bit mental,he could have been brilliant,however,it was the right decision to sell him on.

My username was just a play on words i liked.

As for Hughes' contribution - you really believe the acquisitions of the bedrock of our current team had no influence on our present success?

 

[Tim of the Oak]

[I think the haters need to review their ability to be objective.

Haters?

No mate,just people who 'objectively' believe we can do better.

Do you support the team when you go to a game?

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

You simply cannot debate with such narrow mindedness that the 'inners' display.

Martinez has won fuck all so he doesnt compare?? what a load of shite,give him Mancinis fortune/resources and a level playing field then there would be a discussion.......

I'm pretty sure,given their respective situations,remit and resources,Martinez,Moyes,Laudrup and a host of other managers,stand up to Mancini very well indeed.

That is a massive assumption that could cope with such a huge club not to mention the intense pressure that comes with it.

Hughes being a good example. Give him a smaller club on a budget and he does pretty well. Give him a blank chequebook and he's useless. But the point is that all managers have their limits, bar a handful of the exceptional ones like Baconface & Mourinho. Mancini's forte is clearly the domestic cup competitions. If we want a regular semi-final or trip to Wembley then there's probably no one better. But if we want to crush the opposition in the PL or get a reasonable way in the CL then he's not the man. And that's the long and short of it.

 

[kaz7]

You may think I have had the answer but I haven't because I find your answer totally unsatisfactory. We sign a load of players for loads of money, they all have tremendous reputations because they have played so well at other clubs. They then play well enough for us to become champions and get 10 points in CL group. Then they are all overrated because opposition teams change their tactics and the players aren't good enough to combat this change. Or maybe, we have really good players who aren't overrated, teams have changed their tactics and Mancini (you know, the guy in charge of our tactics and combatting opposition tactics) has failed to adapt? Just a thought.

He has tried to adapt but the players have resisted saying they dont like new formations

Have they definitely said they don't like new formations? How many of them said it? Do you need an entirely new formation to change tactics? Is it realistic to think that we have a squad of players who are any more likely to resist a change of tactics than any other squad in the world? Is it the manager's job to manage his squad and convince them of a change in tactics, just like it is at any other club? As I said, some people will just blame anything and anyone before Mancini.

micah, barry and i think it was zab all said on camera they preferred the old system and for the millionath time the responsibility is a joint one!

 

[crystal_mais]

I've asked the question to many today and previously and non of the Mancini supporters have been able to provide a response. There has been an obvious problem - apparent since last season - still there today

How does Mancini address his obvious short comings. You press on about Ferguson - he has adapted over time since his first days in Scotland to what he is today - his players would run through brick walls for him.

Last season points from 26th Nov -
MCFC – 55 points – 26 games
MUFC – 60 Points – 26 games

more worryingly Our away form upto and inc QPR away
P - 6
W - 5
D - 1
Scored - 23
Against - 8

From then onwards
P - 13
W - 5
D - 3
L - 5
Scored - 15
Against - 9

This seasons away form has been just as poor

The reason I have chose QPR is that was the first time I saw a Prem team take on tactics from one of the opposition teams from the Champs League. High Press and quick attack - Usual teams Liverpool, Everton, Sunderland we still have Swansea to go to.

I may sound like a broken record - but it's there for all to see

It's a great post and highlights an even bigger point for me. In the whole of mancini's tenure we had one purple patch of about 25 games. It started with the FA cup semi final win over united in April 2011 and finished away at qpr at the beginning of November that same year. We had everyone available and rode the wave of confidence that huge win gave us. And it got us our two trophies.

For the entire rest of the 3.5 years he has been here we have been patchy and have rarely fulfilled our potential. Occasionally great, often laboured and sometimes very poor. With the quality we have had even that patchy form will pick us up plenty of points, but not As many as we should have.

So that's why all this 'one bad season' stuff doesn't wash with me. Overall Mancini hasn't got the best from his players consistently.

But he's got pretty close as evidenced by the trophies in the cabinet and our record this season. Yes form has dipped from an incredible high? Are you going to give him credit for that high, or only debit him for the dip since then?

You will get variations in form, that is part and parcel of the game. An obvious explanation being the missing players this season: Kompany, Aguero being the two major ones. We've also lost Mario and AJ who made major contributions last season. Garcia and Nasty have done well this season, but we wont see their best until they have been here for 12 months, that's usually the way with foreign signings.

The forward line has been decimated for various reasons, sort that out, keep Mancini and we will be the team to beat next season - providing Chelsea don't get Falcao. If we appoint someone like Laudrup we could quickly become another Blackburn, a one season wonder. There is that risk - and with FFP we might never get back in. That's way I am sure that unless we go into meltdown, and miss out on the Champions League, the owners will stand by mancini

Marvin - what DD and I are pointing out is that it's not just this season. We were hammering Bobby before the FA cup semi. We went onto win the cup. It papered over cracks. The 1st 3rd of last season was unbelievable and then the dip started. Away from home we have been stuck in this dip.

16 away games this season
W -7
D -5
L - 4
F -20
A -15

As manager it's about time he dealt with it. It's painfully obvious. Nearly 30 games and we still have the same problem. It's a good job the home form is what it is.

This season we have been extremely fortunate with the FA cup draw. Lets hope we win it

 

[FantasyIreland]

[I think the haters need to review their ability to be objective.

Haters?

No mate,just people who 'objectively' believe we can do better.

Do you support the team when you go to a game?

Of course i do,i dont sing Mancini's name however,not because i hate him but because i dont rate him.

 

[kaz7]

Haters?

No mate,just people who 'objectively' believe we can do better.

Do you support the team when you go to a game?

Of course i do,i dont sing Mancini's name however,not because i hate him but because i dont rate him.

how about showing some gratitude!

 

[Lancet Fluke]

Calling supporters who are prepared to give the manager that delivered the Holy Grail their unconditional support "Mancini rimmers" seems to display a discernible lack of appreciation of the history of this football club and what it meant to our supporters to win a trophy, let alone the Premier League, and the debt that many feel they owe to the man that delivered that prize.

I don't entirely share their unconditional love, but I certainly understand it.

I understand people supporting Mancini, that's not my gripe. It's the unconditional bit that gets me because if you're supporting a manager unconditionally (ie even prepared to support the manager when it's not necessarily for the good of the club and refusing to see any bad he may be doing) then as I said earlier, you're supporting the manager rather than the club imo. Of course I know what it meant to win the title, I was there in the worst times, but I just don't believe it was all down to Mancini, in fact I'm beginning to question how much of it was down to him at all. Strange that the same people who unconditionally support Mancini are quite happy to blame players who showed incredible determination to bring us the title. Shows a distinct lack of appreciation of our history if you ask me...

on the one hand you say bobby is to blame when they play bad but nothing to do with him if they play well,how does that work?the qpr game it was him screaming at them and pushed them over the line,i think the players had or were close to conceeding the title,he wouldnt let them give up

I have already admitted a few pages ago that I am now at a point of blaming Mancini for everything negative that happens and praising the players for everything positive that happens. I guess I'm a player rimmer not a Mancini rimmer. I do believe that the players have incredible determination though, I think they've shown it many times. I also think they dislike their manager a lot and it has now ground them down. I'm have no doubt that that sounds as absurd to the people who unconditionally support Mancini as their excuses sound to me.

 

[FantasyIreland]

how about showing some gratitude!

Behave,who do you think he is??

He was given the best gig and provided an average performance.thanks but time to find better.