Mancini

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St Helens Blue (Exiled) said:
BillyShears said:
sjk2008 said:
I know his style of play is highly thought of but, to me, this wouldn't be an "upgrade" as such.

The very notion of "upgrade" is highly subjective. Is it judged on trophies, because then of all the names linked only Mourinho is an "upgrade" ...

If it's judged on trophies + man management success ... Klopp and Mourinho.

The truth is that if Txiki and Ferran have decided Mancini goes, they won't care one bit about what is perceived as an upgrade. These men passed up Mourinho for at the time a managerial novice in Guardiola. I'm sure they will comfortably back their own judgment over what the watching world or media wants or expects them to do. Even if it's to employ MP.

Well thank Fuck it won't happen.

What won't? The truth is, no-one knows what will happen. The outers don't know if he will get sacked, and likewise, the inners don't know if he will get backed. In fact, that's probably the reason why there is so much tension and anger on this thread at times- no one really knows what will happen, and as a result they are nervous their preferred option won't materialise.

What makes you so certain it won't happen??

I'm certain you sometimes type without thinking things through.
 
jackrussel said:
Jnr Kisby said:
the goats backside said:
Surely one of the main reasons this is all being debated, is that RM was not backed in the summer. The question that needs answering, is why

FFP is the answer, the owners want a self sustaining club. We have enough resources in the existing squad to have won it again this season.
we finished level with united and they strenghened in the summer (van persie)and we went on holiday,we lost the league last summer 100 percent
You can not underestimate the impact on our goal-scoring power of the loss of 50% of our strikers. I'd like to see how Mourinho, Ferguson, Pellegrini or any manager would cope with that.

Managers task is to get the most out of what they have - if what they have is suddenly less than what they started with, you have problems.

We've done OK to be where we are, and we need to carry on - then if you want you can have your civil war
 
Marvin said:
jackrussel said:
Jnr Kisby said:
FFP is the answer, the owners want a self sustaining club. We have enough resources in the existing squad to have won it again this season.
we finished level with united and they strenghened in the summer (van persie)and we went on holiday,we lost the league last summer 100 percent
You can not underestimate the impact on our goal-scoring power of the loss of 50% of our strikers. I'd like to see how Mourinho, Ferguson, Pellegrini or any manager would cope with that.

Managers task is to get the most out of what they have - if what they have is suddenly less than what they started with, you have problems.

We've done OK to be where we are, and we need to carry on - then if you want you can have your civil war

Exactly- we've done OK. I don't know for sure, but I HIGHLY doubt that phenomenally successful businessmen would be happy with 'OK'.

Especially considering how we did last season. Football is business now, and as far as my experience goes, business doesn't like to move backwards.

I doubt they will be satisfied with any season of 'OK'. They haven't put the kind of money in for that.

But really, none of us know what will happen.
 
dancity19 said:
Marvin said:
jackrussel said:
we finished level with united and they strenghened in the summer (van persie)and we went on holiday,we lost the league last summer 100 percent
You can not underestimate the impact on our goal-scoring power of the loss of 50% of our strikers. I'd like to see how Mourinho, Ferguson, Pellegrini or any manager would cope with that.

Managers task is to get the most out of what they have - if what they have is suddenly less than what they started with, you have problems.

We've done OK to be where we are, and we need to carry on - then if you want you can have your civil war

Exactly- we've done OK. I don't know for sure, but I HIGHLY doubt that phenomenally successful businessmen would be happy with 'OK'.

Especially considering how we did last season. Football is business now, and as far as my experience goes, business doesn't like to move backwards.

I doubt they will be satisfied with any season of 'OK'. They haven't put the kind of money in for that.

But really, none of us know what will happen.
OK given the impact on our forward line

Anybody smart enough to run FCB should be able to assess a manager's performance against resources available. If you had said at the start of the season that we'd lose Balotelli and Aguero would be out for a 1/3rd of the season, you'd have been gutted and would have snatched your hand off for the opportunity of Champions League qualification and an FA Cup - both yet to be won incidentally, so can we maybe just get on with getting them in the bag?
 
dancity19 said:
Marvin said:
jackrussel said:
we finished level with united and they strenghened in the summer (van persie)and we went on holiday,we lost the league last summer 100 percent
You can not underestimate the impact on our goal-scoring power of the loss of 50% of our strikers. I'd like to see how Mourinho, Ferguson, Pellegrini or any manager would cope with that.

Managers task is to get the most out of what they have - if what they have is suddenly less than what they started with, you have problems.

We've done OK to be where we are, and we need to carry on - then if you want you can have your civil war

Exactly- we've done OK. I don't know for sure, but I HIGHLY doubt that phenomenally successful businessmen would be happy with 'OK'.

Especially considering how we did last season. Football is business now, and as far as my experience goes, business doesn't like to move backwards.

I doubt they will be satisfied with any season of 'OK'. They haven't put the kind of money in for that.

But really, none of us know what will happen.

OK on the pitch and better off it - if you want to focus on the business aspects. Income has risen substantially and even all our FA cup home games are sold out. We will soon have the world's best training facility and demdand for tickets means we will be playing in a £60k plus capacity ground in the next 5 years.

Certainly things would have been better with CL progression and a decent title challenge but OK does not reflect the strides we as a Club are making. Mancini like the Sheikh and Khaldoon have helped to drive this progress.
 
Despite much speculation nothing has been announced about the stadium

And all the off-field advances are subject to the football on the pitch.

Given that we are yet to be sustainable, I think that will inform any decision-making and therefore unless the season goes into meltdown, Mancini will remain in charge.
 
Marvin said:
BillyShears said:
sjk2008 said:
I know his style of play is highly thought of but, to me, this wouldn't be an "upgrade" as such.

The very notion of "upgrade" is highly subjective. Is it judged on trophies, because then of all the names linked only Mourinho is an "upgrade" ...

If it's judged on trophies + man management success ... Klopp and Mourinho.

The truth is that if Txiki and Ferran have decided Mancini goes, they won't care one bit about what is perceived as an upgrade. These men passed up Mourinho for at the time a managerial novice in Guardiola. I'm sure they will comfortably back their own judgment over what the watching world or media wants or expects them to do. Even if it's to employ MP.
If you are so in awe of their judgement, why not step back and leave them to it.

I'd rather mancini remains and City try and sign one top-class striker. That would make all the difference

if you look throughout the team, we have two top keepers, a fantastic defence (even given the injury to Kompany), a dominant midfield which is only going to improve now that Garcia has some games under his belt, and hopefully when Rodwell recovers. The only weakness is the forward line. If Aguero can fully recover and we can add a Falcao or a player at that level, then we can fight for the title again.

If you appoint a manager like Pellegrini it could all go to pot.

if the whole season collapses like a pack of cards, which is possible, then we will have no alternative but to change manager. I wish we could all devote our energies as supporters to getting behind the team instead of finding fault with what we have, even finding faults that aren't even there.

Spot on Marvin. There is no need to demolish a house and rebuild it to overcome a loose slate on the roof!

Too much knee-jerk on here.
 
MaineRoadBlue said:
Marvin said:
BillyShears said:
The very notion of "upgrade" is highly subjective. Is it judged on trophies, because then of all the names linked only Mourinho is an "upgrade" ...

If it's judged on trophies + man management success ... Klopp and Mourinho.

The truth is that if Txiki and Ferran have decided Mancini goes, they won't care one bit about what is perceived as an upgrade. These men passed up Mourinho for at the time a managerial novice in Guardiola. I'm sure they will comfortably back their own judgment over what the watching world or media wants or expects them to do. Even if it's to employ MP.
If you are so in awe of their judgement, why not step back and leave them to it.

I'd rather mancini remains and City try and sign one top-class striker. That would make all the difference

if you look throughout the team, we have two top keepers, a fantastic defence (even given the injury to Kompany), a dominant midfield which is only going to improve now that Garcia has some games under his belt, and hopefully when Rodwell recovers. The only weakness is the forward line. If Aguero can fully recover and we can add a Falcao or a player at that level, then we can fight for the title again.

If you appoint a manager like Pellegrini it could all go to pot.

if the whole season collapses like a pack of cards, which is possible, then we will have no alternative but to change manager. I wish we could all devote our energies as supporters to getting behind the team instead of finding fault with what we have, even finding faults that aren't even there.

Spot on Marvin. There is no need to demolish a house and rebuild it to overcome a loose slate on the roof!

Too much knee-jerk on here.
thats the best analogy ive seen all day
 
MaineRoadBlue said:
Spot on Marvin. There is no need to demolish a house and rebuild it to overcome a loose slate on the roof!

Too much knee-jerk on here.

Is that meant to be another vote for stability?

I don’t know how much of the preoccupation with stability comes from some supporters’ obsession with our neighbours from Trafford but some City fans wear their stability badges like peasants in a Hammer Horror movie wear crosses and garlic; many also chant the “we don’t want to be Chelsea” mantra as if it was some sort of Hail Mary. That would be the Chelsea that in the last eight seasons have won three Premier League titles, four FA Cups, two League Cups and one Champions League title. A period during which that bastion of stability and often pointed to example of a well-run club, Arsenal, have won one FA Cup. Chelsea could yet add two cups and finish second in the league, thereby dealing a double blow to City’s remaining aspirations for the season; although I still think the Rags will be our semi-final opponents.

What exactly do people mean by stability? Surely being a stable football club means having a strong structure, being firmly established (in whatever echelon of football they aspire to), and not subject to wild changes. However, it surely does not mean resistant to any changes because that would in fact be a route to disaster. And, when a club is in City’s position, still in the early stage of a major development project, change is essential: you do not grow and improve if you do not change. City have the luxury of being able to manage that change against the backdrop of stability that comes from having a massively wealthy owner with a long-term plan and vision.

In such circumstances, changing the manager after a period of three and a half years for a better model would not imply any lack of stability; it would represent part of the progression of the club towards a goal of, I assume, being the best club in the world.
 
sadly i can't disagree with this....

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...-city-could-be-in-its-final-days-8538272.html

1 The creative tension isn't that creative any more

Gary Lineker once described Ferguson as "a strange man, irritated by everything". The same could be said of Mancini. Last month he was too angry to go into his own dressing room at Southampton, on Saturday he could not bring himself to climb up to Everton's press room. He has rounded publicly on Samir Nasri and Joe Hart while finally putting and end to his relationship with Mario Balotelli. Mancini has always had a good rapport with those in his first 11, although one former player commented: "If you're not in his team, he doesn't want to know you." That coldness may have spread beyond the substitutes' bench. When he explained the tensions at Internazionale that led to Mancini's departure five years ago, the president, Massimo Moratti, said: "We were still rowing in the same direction but we were having to row harder."



2 He is not a man for the long term

By his own admission, Mancini is not someone who sees himself at the same club for a decade and there have been plenty of offers of work coming his way. This summer will be a critical one for City and the owners may want a coach to oversee the fruits of that spending for the next half-dozen seasons or more. Mancini was appointed because he was a better, more credible brand than Mark Hughes and he may go for the same reason.


3 Club are paying for an idle summer

Mancini is not directly responsible for transfers and it was to his fury that Eden Hazard, Robin van Persie and Javi Martinez went to Chelsea, Manchester United and Bayern Munich, while he had to make do with Javi Garcia, Jack Rodwell and Scott Sinclair. The charge against Mancini is that none of these players, for whatever reason, has made any real contribution. On Friday, Mancini admitted he should have pressed harder for the club to sign a central defender in the January transfer window as cover for the injured Vincent Kompany.



4 City have become also-rans in title race

It is hard for any manager to retain a league title. In England only five men in the last 60 years have done it but in points terms City are on course to make one of the worst defences of the crown in the history of the Premier League. Only two champions have finished as far adrift of the eventual winners as City are now. Manchester United limped in 15 points behind Arsenal's "Invincibles" in 2004 while Blackburn Rovers, who had opted not to strengthen after winning the title, were fully 21 points off the pace when handing back the Premier League trophy in 1996.



5 Champions League failure counts against him

Should City win the FA Cup – and they are favourites to do so – Mancini's position with the supporters will be cemented still further. However, the key to City's progress is the Champions League and, unless they can qualify for the latter stages and raise their Uefa coefficient, they will be forever condemned to being drawn against the big beasts in the group stages. Will a management team of Ferran Soriano and Txiki Begiristain, brought up at Barcelona, really entrust the club to a manager who has never reached even a semi-final of the European Cup, a trophy that, by June, a suddenly unemployed Mourinho might have won three times?
 
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