Mancini

[tolmie's hairdoo]

Fair enough. But you and others want Mourinho. Why? Because his trophy cabinet is mightily impressive. Mancini's while not close to that is pretty good for a guy not yet 50.

Pelligrini is 60 and has won nothing of any consequence. Just pointing that out.

Can't speak for anyone else, but I have enjoyed watching Mourinho's teams. They have that mixture of sheer power, pace and tactical savvy.

It just so happens trophies have also landed in his lap at frightening regularity. I love his charisma and sheer audacity to stick two fingers up to the old guard.

I don't think Mourinho is coming here and Begiristain has blocked that notion.

I don't profess to know much about Pellegrini, outside of his lack of trophies, and one-season opportunity at Real.

He does strike me as someone who is highly-regarded in footballing circles by those who actually know him and can appreciate what he does.

Mancini has been very fortunate in his career to pick up some plum jobs, I do believe his previous reputation as a wonderful footballer initially opened up many doors for him?

I remember also thinking who the hell was this Wenger fella when he rocked up at Highbury, having been in Japan?

Admittedly, he came to them in his mid 40s, but it was clear very quickly that he was a real coup by the board, just as the money started to filter into that club.

Mancini had done very well at Lazio and Fiorentina, on little money. Inter who hadn't won the league for 14 years and had fallen behind Milan and Juve in status took a punt on him.

They had had some 17 managers in 14 years prior to Roberto's arrival. He succeeded where the others failed.

I know where you are coming from but I remember both Lazio (Cragnotti) and Fiorentina (the crook Checchi Gori) throwing huge amounts at those clubs until the shit hit the fan.

Mancini, having already played at Lazio, having an established relationship with that club.

As for Inter, still a massive club, and still a plum job.

I would say Pellegrini has certainly out-performed Mancini in Europe?

Certainly if you think what he did with Villarreal and now Malaga, the resources at hand.

The only break he got was with Madrid, and although they have a penchant for firing, they do tend to go for the very best.

What was it that Madrid saw in Pellegrini and his lack of silverware to appoint him in the first place?

Especially at a time when they were rocking the world that summer in the transfer market.

I dare say, Begiristain sees the same thing Madrid did.

 

[BluessinceHydeRoad]

This thread is getting silly. The club is owned by a fabulously wealthy business man/group who bought a club which, he found, had ex-managers in every broom cupboard, had no HR department, so didn't know which staff were in work and which were on holiday. It had been so well run that many fans missed most of the first half of the match while they bought their ticket. The new board set about running the club on sound business lines and making it efficient and effective. New personnel were brought in, and many of them became instantly unpopular with some posters.

Mr Begiristain was appointed director of football. Old habits die hard and many supporters love to speculate on the "agenda" new appointments bring to the club. This is usually seen in terms of conflict and intrigue and so Messrs Begiristain and Soriano must be part of some Spanish plot to chuck out the Italian and bring in another Spaniard, or at least an Iberian. A pity there are no Borgias left. But then they're Italian. But City must surely be run on the old lines of plot and intrigue, rivalry and enmity. And the Daily Mail has just told us that the "agenda" of increasing his own power is what drives Mr Begiristain on! In fact, he behaves just like a power mad teacher.

Now for those who have trouble the role of a director of football is actually to "direct", in the sense of giving a direction, to the football of the club. In our case a club which is investing £150 million in training facilities. The declared aim of which is so that the club can produce, at minimal cost, its own "stars of the future". How bizarre then that the "director of football" wants to know what's going on in these facilities. Presumably it would be unsatisfactory if young players were told to run round one of the pitches 25 times and then to "have a game"! City want to get young kids and take them through to shine in the PL, but this won't happen without careful planning and top quality coaching. So you bet Begiristain wants reports on exactly what the coaches are up to. And he will ant to ensure "progression" - it would make no sense if the 21 year olds were doing ecactly the same as the 15 year olds! So what is done and how does it make the lads better than they were?

The point is that this is not an attempt to squeeze Mancini out. We know that Soriano and Begiristain were ruthless at Barcelona when they felt change was necessary and so it may well be possible that there will be change, of some kind, in this summer, next summer, whenever. But the reports of Mr Begiristain's activities as reported in the Mail tell us only about the efforts made to ensure that the new facilities are used to get "the kids" to play the way the club wants and helps to take them from 15 year olds to those playing at top PL standard.

So, don't expect the Etihad to be littered with corpses dripping blood from the stab wounds to their backs any time soon.

 

[BlueDejong]

Can't speak for anyone else, but I have enjoyed watching Mourinho's teams. They have that mixture of sheer power, pace and tactical savvy.

It just so happens trophies have also landed in his lap at frightening regularity. I love his charisma and sheer audacity to stick two fingers up to the old guard.

I don't think Mourinho is coming here and Begiristain has blocked that notion.

I don't profess to know much about Pellegrini, outside of his lack of trophies, and one-season opportunity at Real.

He does strike me as someone who is highly-regarded in footballing circles by those who actually know him and can appreciate what he does.

Mancini has been very fortunate in his career to pick up some plum jobs, I do believe his previous reputation as a wonderful footballer initially opened up many doors for him?

I remember also thinking who the hell was this Wenger fella when he rocked up at Highbury, having been in Japan?

Admittedly, he came to them in his mid 40s, but it was clear very quickly that he was a real coup by the board, just as the money started to filter into that club.

Mancini had done very well at Lazio and Fiorentina, on little money. Inter who hadn't won the league for 14 years and had fallen behind Milan and Juve in status took a punt on him.

They had had some 17 managers in 14 years prior to Roberto's arrival. He succeeded where the others failed.

I know where you are coming from but I remember both Lazio (Cragnotti) and Fiorentina (the crook Checchi Gori) throwing huge amounts at those clubs until the shit hit the fan.

Mancini, having already played at Lazio, having an established relationship with that club.

As for Inter, still a massive club, and still a plum job.

I would say Pellegrini has certainly out-performed Mancini in Europe?

Certainly if you think what he did with Villarreal and now Malaga, the resources at hand.

The only break he got was with Madrid, and although they have a penchant for firing, they do tend to go for the very best.

What was it that Madrid saw in Pellegrini and his lack of silverware to appoint him in the first place?

Especially at a time when they were rocking the world that summer in the transfer market.

I dare say, Begiristain sees the same thing Madrid did.

So..I have a question. Really sound out about Pellegrini ?

 

[tolmie's hairdoo]

Mancini had done very well at Lazio and Fiorentina, on little money. Inter who hadn't won the league for 14 years and had fallen behind Milan and Juve in status took a punt on him.

They had had some 17 managers in 14 years prior to Roberto's arrival. He succeeded where the others failed.

I know where you are coming from but I remember both Lazio (Cragnotti) and Fiorentina (the crook Checchi Gori) throwing huge amounts at those clubs until the shit hit the fan.

Mancini, having already played at Lazio, having an established relationship with that club.

As for Inter, still a massive club, and still a plum job.

I would say Pellegrini has certainly out-performed Mancini in Europe?

Certainly if you think what he did with Villarreal and now Malaga, the resources at hand.

The only break he got was with Madrid, and although they have a penchant for firing, they do tend to go for the very best.

What was it that Madrid saw in Pellegrini and his lack of silverware to appoint him in the first place?

Especially at a time when they were rocking the world that summer in the transfer market.

I dare say, Begiristain sees the same thing Madrid did.

So..I have a question. Really sound out about Pellegrini ?

Just a debate with a couple of fellow posters re Pellegrini's pros and cons.

I do believe there is foundation for the reports which leaked out of Chile a little while back now that his interest had been gauged.

 

[Marvin]

And as the more eloquent poster said above

This is getting silly

 

[bluemcr]

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.sabotagetimes.com/reportage/manuel-pellegrini-everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-in-demand-chilean/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.sabotagetimes.com/reportage/ ... d-chilean/</a> Definate upgrade in my humblest opinion, this guy would get us fired up again and fighting on all fronts with a full pre-season. Forget his lack lustre trophy hall, compared to mancini in managing a team ie getting the best out of them, having a plan B when needed and over all tactical nouse the guy is far superior. We have gone stagnent and everyone knows it and teams below us know it and they smell blood. I think the two ex-barca lads won't take the chance with mancini next season we just can't afford to look a laughing stock in europe again. Mancini has had his cake and eaten it, time to move on and give someone else another crack of the whip!

 

[Blue Mooner]

and your glee is there for all to see.

he sounds like a rag to me the clown

he's not as i've seen him at games but fuck me his desire for mancini to fail is unbelievable.

just a quick word to the people who want mancini sacked.
if he's sacked it means we've done badly.

why do you want that so desperately?

is "i told you so" on a forum that important to you?

Their desperation for Mancini to fail is palpable and fly's in the face of them wanting City to do well. This nonsense hasn't just been going on since we fell 15 points behind, with some of them, it's been going on since we lost away at Arsenal last season and they 'thought' we had lost the league. It simply smacks of Internet opinion warriors who are so desperate to be proven right that they appear quite happy to see City fail. Clubs with instability surrounding it never do well, it's a fact, and yet these morons seem happy to perpetuate the instability. Fortunately, they are low in number, and it is not translating into reality on a match day, but its not for the want of them trying that's for sure.

This season we are to all intents and purposes (and without wishing to be arrogant) one win away from winning the FA cup and, still, they moan about the manager.

What sort of club sacks a manager who finishes 2nd in the league and wins the FA cup ? A crackpot club. I would have far more respect for these people if they raised the debate come the end of the season and we know the outcome.

Fortunately, I believe with have owners who are far more sensible and pragmatic and will not sack Mancini even if we miss out on the FA cup. They realise it has to be evolution not revolution from here. If I'm wrong come the season end ? Who gives a f*ck.

 

[The Future's Blue]

And if that does turn out to be the case, in terms of implementing a new formation or style of play, then they do feel Mancini HAS been getting it wrong previously, but they still feel they can help him get it right.

I think it's more of 'Giving Mancini the Tools to get it Right' rather than Mancini getting it wrong.

We've come so far in such a short time that people are forgetting that a lot of our players were bought as an upgrade on the previous, moving us further forward in our attempts. Now we are there we need to maximise our strategies and only bring in those that 'fit the bill', as they say.

It's going to be good.

This is what pisses me off mate, not just you directly. You can't have it all ends up.

How much money do you feel it actually takes in terms of equating it to having the right tools for the job?

What were the £50m plus Nasri and Dzeko upgrades on?

As someone else stated, we are now needing a compliant yes man.

Does Mancini strike you as this type of manager, an autocrat who thinks he is even more informed than the club medics and outside doctors.

Apparently Micah would be back in three weeks...

Why does it piss you off, it's just an opinion? Your problem seems to be that you have a low opinion of our top brass. It may not think so but what you're are literally saying is that they are all wrong.

As for Mancini, I'm not a lover. He gets on my tits no-end but he does bring home the bacon. You infer that he is an autocrat yet he has worked under the very same circumstances, not only in Italy but here as well. He's made good noises about the new board and they have made good noises about him, that's all I am saying.

You might be pushing for a change mate but why get so irate about it, it's out of your hands and no amount of inciteful postings on here will change that fact. Unless you get enough followers, of course.

And that's what pisses me off, not you direct, but the few on here who constantly try to belittle the club or, in a way, try to destablise a ship that is still running it's course.

I have no problem with anybody having this debate but the constant berating of the current incumbent is way off scale, to the point where some are devaluing are triumphs. Now that, I don't like.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

http://www.sabotagetimes.com/reportage/manuel-pellegrini-everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-in-demand-chilean/ Definate upgrade in my humblest opinion, this guy would get us fired up again and fighting on all fronts with a full pre-season. Forget his lack lustre trophy hall, compared to mancini in managing a team ie getting the best out of them, having a plan B when needed and over all tactical nouse the guy is far superior. We have gone stagnent and everyone knows it and teams below us know it and they smell blood. I think the two ex-barca lads won't take the chance with mancini next season we just can't afford to look a laughing stock in europe again. Mancini has had his cake and eaten it, time to move on and give someone else another crack of the whip!

Sums him up as:

Pellegrini with his same old tactics of a well organised group who is difficult to play against, hard to break down and will always give 100%,

Now how many of those could you apply to us at the moment? We're reasonably well-organised, easy to play against (from a defensive point of view), reasonably hard to break down but we certainly don't always give 100%.

 

[OB1]

Interesting that this appears to be the second leak from the wider coaching staff this year. The last one was about the 433.

I cannot envisage a situation where Mancini would accept the significant reduction in authority and influence this offers. It always felt like it would come to this to be honest. I can see a conflict in the summer and the club might even get a resignation, although he's not daft enough to tantrum his way out of a payoff. 'Mutual agreement' I predict with undisclosed payoff. Maybe even painted as a resignation to suit all parties.

I have to say that this story all but eliminates my hopes for mourinho too.

I'm not a betting man but, if I was, this is the outcome that I'd put my money on.

I do think Roberto is more rather than less likely to leave but I'd say the probabilities are close to being balanced.

If Mancini consolidates second place and wins the cup, the case for him deserving another season will get a big shot in the arm. I keep saying though that what Roberto deserves should not take precedence over what is best for the club and the strategy that it wants to take forward.

I see the case for saying that Mancini has confounded expectations before and that he is a proven winner and, therefore, it is worth taking the risk to see if he can return us to being genuine title contenders and make us more of a force to be reckoned with in Europe. Maybe we will see some sign of that in the remainder of the season and I genuinely hope that we do but I am far from confident that we will; although another strong finish would not be entirely surprising as we have produced those in the last two seasons.

A strong finish to the season will not change for me the fact that this has been one of the most disappointing in my forty plus years of supporting City. And before the Dork Police whinge in, disappointing does not mean it has been one of the worst. Disappointment is a relative thing, measured against hopes and expectations (not entitlement…). I had high hopes for this season and they not been met. I didn’t expect anything to top that glorious moment in May but, in short, I did expect progress and I did have high hopes for a more entertaining brand of football. I don’t hold Mancini responsible for all that has been wrong this season but something does seem to be wrong and I cannot shake off the view that much of it stems from what the manager is or is not doing.

My biggest concern is Mancini’s much discussed man-management style because I think it is working against him and it is much harder to change your managerial style than your team’s tactics, IMO.

His relationship with Balotelli, may come to define his managerial failings at City. From the decision to bet so much on such a wild card to the apparent breakdown in relations and the downing of tools by Mario. How we could have done with the goals that Mario has already scored for Milan this season. Surely the way to get the best out of Mario was to play him up the middle as an out and out striker with no responsibility other than to attack; how often did he get that opportunity? Surely publicly humiliating him by dragging him off for attempting back heels – once in a pre-season friendly and, more recently, against the Rags – was not the best way to handle Mario? I found it ironic that many people praised the fact that Tevez was brought on and made a difference, which he did, as justification for hauling Mario off in the Derby, but I still think that Nasri should have been the one to get the hook that day. That substitution looked then, and still does, like a fit of pique and is the kind of thing that worries me about Mancini’s relationship with is players: if it is broken, fixing it by moving out players is not the right answer.