Mancini's biggest fault. (IMO)

[2sheikhs]

Capello,yes.And don't the England fans love it?(remember the WC?).Ancelotti would like to but Terry and Lampard run Chelsea,not him.Please don't tell me baconface,Mourinho and Guardiola are safety first boring managers.

mourinho is the most "negative" out of all them.
ferguson play counter attack football , boring or not is a fact of taste.
capello , everybody knows.
mancini is very similar to capello.
ancelotti manage chelsea , not terry or lampard , please dont joke.
guardiola is a sacchi like , defend high using hard pressing and tactical fouls , they seem to be an attacking side but the way they want to keep (and quickly recapture) the ball is just a form of defense. like the offside tactic and many other apparently offensive things that instead are pure defensive stuff.

-- Wed Mar 23, 2011 12:30 am --

Are you saying that when comparing players from the same team, stats are usually not wrong about who is the better passer?

If so, Zanetti is a better passer than Sneijder?

is zanetti a passer ?? ;O)

zanetti is a clear exemple of mancini's genius , he was finished as full back and mancini reinveted him as a midfield just to cover maicon's runs.

I honestly haven't got the time to explain why your wrong regarding those managers.One point I will pick up on though is you saying Capello is like Mancini.You're right.He's trying to get a bunch of Englishmen to play the Italian way.We went out of the World Cup like a team of players who had only just met.Just try and stifle and choke the opposition and create nothing.As the tournament wore on,we got sussed out by a not very good german side who twatted us.We also had no plan B because Johnson and Walcott were left at home(one has pace,one has trickery)and he played players out of position to accomodate others(Gerard,Lampard),for example.
Does that ring any bells?

 

[Nerazzurri]

nothing is lost in translation. it's just that you can not expect me to respond seriously to the question "is a better passer zanetti or Sneijder"

Ok. Who has the highest pass completion?

 

[DSonBlue]

First, great thread, interesting points of views regarding tactics and in particular how to apply players effectively. Some intelligent fans on here tonight (myself exluded, naturally).

That said, I'm going to sound over simplistic now.

The answer is time. And this has been the case, pretty much since people started complaining (circa December).

We were doing WAY better than expected until around the last week of December (ok, partially inflated by our 2 game advantage).

The signs at this point however were clear: Tevez was our best chance of goals, working excellently with Silva.

Mancini probably knew then what he is trying to fix now, namely that we can't rely on El Capitan forever.

So he effectively replaced 50% of our strikeforce, and ever since we have often struggled to either:

a) finish chances off (sometimes double figures)
b) create enough clear cut chances

Why does everyone not realise that although there are some lessons to be learned in specific games - and I'm talking about tactical approach mainly - in GENERAL, our problem is that the midfielders haven't all learned how to gel properly with one another yet (and in particular, with the two new strikers)?

Oh, and since January we've had BLOODY LOADS of injury problems, compounded by BLOODY LOADS of games.

I'm not making excuses, I'm just stating some very important facts (who said anything about you, Rafa!!???).

Anyway, let's wait until the end of the season before we give up on Bobby.

He (yes, the manager, not just the players) may just deliver our first silverware in... well you know how long. And if he does, he's done an EXCELLENT job because of my reasons, above.

And then let's wait and see if, by this time next season, the same problems exist?

Young and Pastore will complete this sqaud.

 

[Fuzzmaster101]

baconfaces success has been based on a solid defence - once you have that hen you need the players to break teams down, he has managed to do this byt creating good attackijng lineups to complement the defence. He doesn't play boring football but if you watch the rags especially this season against the better teams he ha definately setup more defensively.

Mourinho is very similar - when he was at Chelsea they were solid but still scored loads of goals because he had a balance .

City generally have a solid defense but we haven't scored the goals in critical games - clean sheet at Arsenal / Spuds but we could break and score. Our attack at times is a bit one dimensional with little pace and width. We have the capability to produce great football but we just don't do it often enough.

this because of two factors. personality and credibility of the defenders.
Unfortunately, if the team does not have full confidence in the defense attack more timidly. and confidence in the defense comes from the quality and personality of the defenders. the defense of the City lacks quality and a true leader. and this weighs on the whole team play.

I'm sorry but this is just rubbish of the highest order. City's defence is solid for the most part, at least as solid as any other top team's. The problem in attack does NOT stem from a lack of confidence in our defence, it stems from us not having a good enough shape in attack and looking for individuals to pull some magic tricks out of a bag too often. In my opinion this comes from not having a strong enough AM, SS, CAM (whatever you want to call it) to dictate play from the centre of the pitch. That's why I started this thread. Some don't agree, that's fine.

I stand by what I said and no-one has coherently argued against it yet just a string of responses either missing my point, trying to put words in my mouth, or spouting meaninless stats that show nothing other than some pointless figures with little relevance to what actually takes place in a game of football.

 

[Mancio]

mourinho is the most "negative" out of all them.
ferguson play counter attack football , boring or not is a fact of taste.
capello , everybody knows.
mancini is very similar to capello.
ancelotti manage chelsea , not terry or lampard , please dont joke.
guardiola is a sacchi like , defend high using hard pressing and tactical fouls , they seem to be an attacking side but the way they want to keep (and quickly recapture) the ball is just a form of defense. like the offside tactic and many other apparently offensive things that instead are pure defensive stuff.

-- Wed Mar 23, 2011 12:30 am --




is zanetti a passer ?? ;O)

zanetti is a clear exemple of mancini's genius , he was finished as full back and mancini reinveted him as a midfield just to cover maicon's runs.

I honestly haven't got the time to explain why your wrong regarding those managers.One point I will pick up on though is you saying Capello is like Mancini.You're right.He's trying to get a bunch of Englishmen to play the Italian way.We went out of the World Cup like a team of players who had only just met.Just try and stifle and choke the opposition and create nothing.As the tournament wore on,we got sussed out by a not very good german side who twatted us.We also had no plan B because Johnson and Walcott were left at home(one has pace,one has trickery)and he played players out of position to accomodate others(Gerard,Lampard),for example.
Does that ring any bells?

premise that i hate capello.

i believe you are unfair , you lose vs germany ( a very very good germany) with a phantom goal if i remember well.

and then , it dont seem to me that before capello's tenure England was winning left centre and right..... or am i wrong ?

the England problem , i think , its not down to a manager or another , its becouse premier league destroy English player , at the season end they are phisically unable to compete with players that has got more light season

 

[2sheikhs]

I honestly haven't got the time to explain why your wrong regarding those managers.One point I will pick up on though is you saying Capello is like Mancini.You're right.He's trying to get a bunch of Englishmen to play the Italian way.We went out of the World Cup like a team of players who had only just met.Just try and stifle and choke the opposition and create nothing.As the tournament wore on,we got sussed out by a not very good german side who twatted us.We also had no plan B because Johnson and Walcott were left at home(one has pace,one has trickery)and he played players out of position to accomodate others(Gerard,Lampard),for example.
Does that ring any bells?

premise that i hate capello.

i believe you are unfair , you lose vs germany ( a very very good germany) with a phantom goal if i remember well.

and then , it dont seem to me that before capello's tenure England was winning left centre and right..... or am i wrong ?

the England problem , i think , its not down to a manager or another , its becouse premier league destroy English player , at the season end they are phisically unable to compete with players that has got more light season

Are you saying it's because the players are tired? AW FUCK ME. I SHOULD HAVE GUESSED. YOU ARE MANCINI!!!!!!

 

[Mancio]

this because of two factors. personality and credibility of the defenders.
Unfortunately, if the team does not have full confidence in the defense attack more timidly. and confidence in the defense comes from the quality and personality of the defenders. the defense of the City lacks quality and a true leader. and this weighs on the whole team play.

I'm sorry but this is just rubbish of the highest order. City's defence is solid for the most part, at least as solid as any other top team's. The problem in attack does NOT stem from a lack of confidence in our defence, it stems from us not having a good enough shape in attack and looking for individuals to pull some magic tricks out of a bag too often. In my opinion this comes from not having a strong enough AM, SS, CAM (whatever you want to call it) to dictate play from the centre of the pitch. That's why I started this thread. Some don't agree, that's fine.

I stand by what I said and no-one has coherently argued against it yet just a string of responses either missing my point, trying to put words in my mouth, or spouting meaninless stats that show nothing other than some pointless figures with little relevance to what actually takes place in a game of football.

here is where you are wrong IMO. City's defence isnt solid , City "defensive fase" may be solid (often not enough) just thank to the tactic mancini is forced to utilize. he utilize a defense protective tactic becouse he know his defenders are not good enough to be let at themselves.

 

[Fuzzmaster101]

I'm sorry but this is just rubbish of the highest order. City's defence is solid for the most part, at least as solid as any other top team's. The problem in attack does NOT stem from a lack of confidence in our defence, it stems from us not having a good enough shape in attack and looking for individuals to pull some magic tricks out of a bag too often. In my opinion this comes from not having a strong enough AM, SS, CAM (whatever you want to call it) to dictate play from the centre of the pitch. That's why I started this thread. Some don't agree, that's fine.

I stand by what I said and no-one has coherently argued against it yet just a string of responses either missing my point, trying to put words in my mouth, or spouting meaninless stats that show nothing other than some pointless figures with little relevance to what actually takes place in a game of football.

here is where you are wrong IMO. City's defence isnt solid , City "defensive fase" may be solid (often not enough) just thank to the tactic mancini is forced to utilize. he utilize a defense protective tactic becouse he know his defenders are not good enough to be let at themselves.

Again utter rubbish. We've conceded less goals than Ushited (the league leaders) this year. If we pressed harder and used a proper attacking mid instead of Yaya we wouldn't concede much more (maybe no more, as teams who are attacked with more force feel less able to attack themselves) but we would score many more. IMO of course.

 

[2sheikhs]

I'm sorry but this is just rubbish of the highest order. City's defence is solid for the most part, at least as solid as any other top team's. The problem in attack does NOT stem from a lack of confidence in our defence, it stems from us not having a good enough shape in attack and looking for individuals to pull some magic tricks out of a bag too often. In my opinion this comes from not having a strong enough AM, SS, CAM (whatever you want to call it) to dictate play from the centre of the pitch. That's why I started this thread. Some don't agree, that's fine.

I stand by what I said and no-one has coherently argued against it yet just a string of responses either missing my point, trying to put words in my mouth, or spouting meaninless stats that show nothing other than some pointless figures with little relevance to what actually takes place in a game of football.

here is where you are wrong IMO. City's defence isnt solid , City "defensive fase" may be solid (often not enough) just thank to the tactic mancini is forced to utilize. he utilize a defense protective tactic becouse he know his defenders are not good enough to be let at themselves.

You could put it that way.Or the other to put it is,his tactics of "protecting" the defenders he has so little faith in means when we try a counter attack,it takes so long and theres no fucker to pass to that it goes sideways and the momentum is lost.We are very different Mancio.You make assumptions and cast aspertions on our players while I just deal in facts which I see right in front of me.

 

[weejh]

Is it too simplistic to say, change one of our defensive midfielders for a sneijder or modric type? And that for me would solve a lot of our problems. Watch city on sky plus at x2 speed and you have most of the top 6 passing speed. Mancini has the 4th spot weighing on his shoulders, he is so scared of not achieving it he is trying to "not lose" his way to it, and rely on a few scraped wins to see him by. The time to be bold was earlier in the season, there is no way he is going to change his style now,