Manuel Pellegrini (cont)

[supercity88]

Have some perspective in terms of our players when writing them off. Let's look at Chelsea. Man for man our squad isn't worse than theirs. Our performances are a mile off. It's the fight and the determination that has been missing. We've shown character to fight back in games but we are still making mistakes. I think the formation we played on Sat was spot on, lots have been waiting to see that for a while. Milner instead of Navas maybe but otherwise spot on. But we made errors, gave the ball away and didn't defend well. It shows that 4-4-2 isn't the issue. It shows that Pellegrini isn't the issue either. The players for whatever reason aren't responding well this season and we need to snap out of it as soon as possible. 8pts if a large gap but we've come back from it before. The likelihood is we will be out of the CL and either out of Europe or in the Europa. It would be good for this club to win the Europa. It would be something we as fans would love, even though we should be a level above.

I think it would help us build confidence and also we would then play on Sundays where Chelsea are likely to play on Saturdays. We have always been better at chasing than being chased and knowing their situation could serve as a motivation for the players. I think we will turn it around. A poor season would be winning nothing. We still have the opportunity to win things so I still remain positive.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

Agreed. Shock horror, we may not win it this season. But - ready yourselves for a shock blues - teams don't win the league every season. Not this league.

Let's say we only finish third this year.

That means we've finished 3rd (on goal diff v 2nd), 1st, 2nd, 1st, 3rd in 5 seasons. With an fa cup and league cup and charity shield thrown in for good measure.

Not good enough clearly.

After waiting 35 yrs for a trophy - any trophy - and 44 yrs for a league title to have done the above in 5 seasons is monumental.

But not for some of us. Some of us have become all that we used to hate about that lot from down the road.

I slagged MP off early last season too , which might make me a hypocrite this time around but I learned from that. Have patience and enjoy the best city sides any of us have ever seen.

Very well said, mate.

Even the mighty chelsea who we rave about have won the title 3 times in What is now abramovich's 11 seasons after a big Harding investment.

As for 3rd if you look at the seasons of arsenal, Liverpool, rags etc who have all started worse than us them there is nothing to suggest we will drop below 2nd

There's a regrettable, but to some extent inevitable, lack of perspective from much of our support.

We've averaged around two points a game this season. By any measure that's a good return. We can't win the league every year. I'm not sure it would even be a good thing if we did. Does that mean that in those seasons we finish second, or god forbid, third that people derive no enjoyment from the experience, as appears to be the case with some of our fans?

What a unfortunate world to inhabit. I do think some of our supporters aren't getting all they can out of this wonderful experience we've been blessed with, which is a shame. It's almost like they've become consumed by a desire to win everything, which is not a good place to occupy as it means regular disappointment, whoever you support.

 

[IWasHere]

Agree with most of this, also we do not know of Pellegrini has the ultimate say on signing sor if Bergiristain and Sorano do this. Of the latter do then no blame can be put on any manager.

As for players yes the following have proved not good enough and should be sold if possible:

Sinclair - no where good enough
Clichy - to many errors
Nastasic - not wanted at the club and seems to be drifting complexly
Sagna - Poor quality
Caballero - Should have got a young English keeper as backup to Hart i.e. MAYBE McCarthy who is now 2nd choice at QPR
Dzeko - good at times but way to inconsistent also
Navas - hot and cold performances
Nasri - overrated, not as good as Silva, goes missing in many games, and slows us down significantly

Possibly also Fernandinho (I believe he is not good enough) and now also it appears Fernando
Toure has probably reached the end after this season for us also.

Key 5 players to build upon:

Hart, Zabaleta, Kompany, Silva and Aguero

with Milner as a good\solid support for these 5

Bet you weren't saying fernandinho wasn't good enough last season

Last season was then, this is now. Same could be said about Dzeko but most are saying get rid of him.

So does that mean zaba's shit then?

 

[Lavinda Past]

Bet you weren't saying fernandinho wasn't good enough last season

Last season was then, this is now. Same could be said about Dzeko but most are saying get rid of him.

So does that mean zaba's shit then?

Good question. If he is, at least he's not as shit as Sagna and Clichy.

 

[OB1]

Just read the last couple of pages, and what a spoilt bunch of mard arses we've become. Looks like a lot of our fans agree that we didn't actually win the league last season, more like Liverpool and Chelsea threw it away.

The polarisation of views has become entrenched. I like Pellegrini and admire and appreciate what he did last year. This year some of his formations, tactics, selections and substitutions have invited criticism and question. Still support him though - he deserves and has earned the chance to put it right. To not want him is one thing, but some of the vitriol and disrespect is uncalled for.

Good call. My concern as well, which is partially unrelated to Pellegrini, is that I don't think any manager out there could fashion a silk purse out of Fernando, Fernandinho, Jovetic, Lampard, Nasri and an ageing Ya Ya, in terms of a winning combination. There's very little pace there with which to either counterattack or press, if you play Ya Ya it has be in the no.10 role in a 4-5-1, something he was piss awful at on Saturday and also leaves you with the problem of where to play Silva, and so on and so on. Questions need to be asked of our transfer buying strategy as much as they do the manager

You aren't in effing Exeter so why not incorporate the word pace into your location ;-)

I obviously agree about there being questions over our buying strategy and you have worn me down over the years on pace; which has to be a prerequisite in just about every new signing we make going forward.

having said that, I do think that the level of technique available amongst the players that you have listed means that we should be able to fashion a more than decent, winning combo out of that lot. And it would really help if some of them would play at the higher levels that they are capable of.

Yaya is a bit of a conundrum at the moment but I firmly believe that much of the criticism that he has received has been driven by something other than accurate observation of his contributions. And the fact remains that he makes more passes per game than any other player in the league and he is still vital to how we play. Maybe, if we could, we should have cashed in on him in the summer and maybe we should next summer - we certainly should if he wants to leave - but for now the manager has to find a winning line-up with him at the centre of it. I would prefer in many ways that Yaya chooses to have a role where he sits deep much of the time, in a holding pair, and applies himself to the defensive chores. I think he can contribute better than he did on Saturday in a slightly more advanced role but he has to be the fulcrum of the side and operate in a different way to Silva, who I prefer as the number 10.

What I do think is essential for the manager is to have available and then to regularly field Yaya, Silva, Nasri and Aguero. That combination of players is capable of keeping the ball - so that we do not have to press excessively to get it back - and of creating goals. What the manager has to do, IMO, is find the right set-up to support that foursome and minimise their defensive duties.

 

[kenzie115]

It'd be nice to see him drop some of the "first-teamers" who aren't currently applying themselves and give some of the reserves or younger lads a try. Would send the right message out that if you're not willing to put the effort in, you won't be playing. And let's face it, the kids can't do much worse.

 

[Deleted member 58678]

Wins the double.
Great achievement and what I think will keep him in his job past this season
No pre season for many key players in the team.
Good point, same for many teams. Bayern have won every game in our CL group and they had more players playing right up to the final than we did
Lost Negredo and not able to replace.
With the players we sold we had £70m to spend this Sunmer, we hammered half of that out on one player and still had loads left, we could have replaced him even if with a younger player
Most difficult opening fixtures of any side in the league.
True. But all of our best performances were against the best sides and Pellegrini has chosen to pick formations that expose our weaknesses in games against the lesser sides and he's also not installing the right mentality into them for the lesser games neither
Injuries.
Everyone has them, Arsenal more than any team last season and they lead the league for the most weeks but hardly had anyone to choose from for a few weeks so it is a valid excuse
Bayern was a close game, should've had penalty and then lost the game. Roma close again
I thought we were naïve in Munich and poor at home to Roma. We were too easy to play against and Roma (who had three starters missing) were the better side and we were at home.
and we were robbed in Moscow with that equalizing penalty.
Very true. Appalling decision. But we were fucking awful in that second half and got what we deserved. Yaya tried a suicidal flick that rebounded straight to their player and within two seconds they had that penalty. Shocking play. Look at that game and Arsenal's last two losing leads, all three are examples of not shutting up shop when it's required and I think that naïvety or blasé attitude leaves it wide open to be punished. Still a fucking awful decision for the pen
Chelsea fixture we should've had penalty via Costa foul on Dzeko. Arsenal fixture we should've had a penalty via Wilshere handball.
Agree!
Cap off the fact we were hamstrung by FFP.
Again, reckoning up those we sold, £70m is a substantial kitty for one window for a double winning side

Third place isn't so bad for a team in a 'bad moment'. We have been unfortunate so far imho and once form returns we will be fine. Chelsea have had a tremendous start and its almost unfair to compare ourselves to what is imo a perfect start from them. When you get a piss easy CL group and add Costa, Fabregas and Luis to a team it's no wonder they've improved their showings in the league. Fair dues to them, I have no problem finishing second to them should they continue being hard to beat and resilient in winning, they play good football and look drilled all over the pitch.

Keep the faith blues. If you want to cheering up look at United's summer business and their league position. Fingers crossed they miss top4 again.
Yeah agreed.

 

[dancity19]

The thing that worries me is that this was meant to be the season we really kicked on even further?

We had apparently addressed our weaknesses - a young left sided CB to partner Kompany, and a quality DM.
We had, apparently, done some fantastic business and are now an absolutely complete team. It was almost like these were the missine pieces of the jigsaw.

What has happened is almost all of our players have gone backwards. It's been said numerous times, but it is all too remeniscent of mancini's last season. The underperformance of the players was why I wanted Mancini gone - we need a manager who get's players performing at their best.

Pellegrini did this last season - and for this reason, as well as others, I would stick by him. But he has to prove he has answers and the capability to turn this situation around. I think it's 5 wins in 15. 1 win in 3. His post match interview was real head in the sand stuff on saturday.

It seems the buys aren't Pellegrini's, but they really have to be looked at. Our buying policy over the last 3 seasons just isn't what we need. Too many sub standard players.

 

[OB1]

Wins the double.
No pre season for many key players in the team.
Lost Negredo and not able to replace.
Most difficult opening fixtures of any side in the league.
Injuries.
Bayern was a close game, should've had penalty and then lost the game. Roma close again and we were robbed in Moscow with that equalizing penalty.
Chelsea fixture we should've had penalty via Costa foul on Dzeko. Arsenal fixture we should've had a penalty via Wilshere handball.
Cap off the fact we were hamstrung by FFP.

Third place isn't so bad for a team in a 'bad moment'. We have been unfortunate so far imho and once form returns we will be fine. Chelsea have had a tremendous start and its almost unfair to compare ourselves to what is imo a perfect start from them. When you get a piss easy CL group and add Costa, Fabregas and Luis to a team it's no wonder they've improved their showings in the league. Fair dues to them, I have no problem finishing second to them should they continue being hard to beat and resilient in winning, they play good football and look drilled all over the pitch.

Keep the faith blues. If you want to cheering up look at United's summer business and their league position. Fingers crossed they miss top4 again.

I think you make a lot of good points there. I do think it is possible that circumstances have conspired against and set-off a chain reaction that has ultimately knocked the confidence of the squad, a squad that I have long worried has a somewhat fragile mentality / confidence (excessively so for double champions). That would make more sense to me than the squad having a problem with the manager but who the devil knows?

We may find, and we should bear this in mind when evaluating our manager, that Chelsea are going to have such a good season that we were never going to beat them to the title; especially when it is notoriously difficult to defend your title. One of my worries is that the players might already have been thinking that. However, given our resources it would be a shame to let them win it without being put under pressure.

What City must not do is be in any way complacent about us returning to our best form. I can accept the manager having belief and trust in how we do things - and how we won two trophies last season - but it must not be blind faith, he has to know when to vary things.

 

[Millwallawayveteran1988]

The thing that worries me is that this was meant to be the season we really kicked on even further?

We had apparently addressed our weaknesses - a young left sided CB to partner Kompany, and a quality DM.
We had, apparently, done some fantastic business and are now an absolutely complete team. It was almost like these were the missine pieces of the jigsaw.

What has happened is almost all of our players have gone backwards. It's been said numerous times, but it is all too remeniscent of mancini's last season. The underperformance of the players was why I wanted Mancini gone - we need a manager who get's players performing at their best.

Pellegrini did this last season - and for this reason, as well as others, I would stick by him. But he has to prove he has answers and the capability to turn this situation around. I think it's 5 wins in 15. 1 win in 3. His post match interview was real head in the sand stuff on saturday.

It seems the buys aren't Pellegrini's, but they really have to be looked at. Our buying policy over the last 3 seasons just isn't what we need. Too many sub standard players.

Its actually 1 win in 6 in all competitions which for a team expected to compete in all competitions is the relevant figure. 7 wins in 16 competitive games for the season.

Whatever the arguments are from whoever, the above needs addressing immediately. We cannot let it become 2/10 or 8/20 which if we don't get it together shortly it could easily become with the fixtures we have coming up.

This next run of games is our best of the season in the prem for accumulating points and we need to take advantage. its Pellegrini's job to get it sorted.