Marc-Andre ter Stegen

[Rammy Blue]

It's relevant you cockend

hahaha

 

[BlueDeadHead]

I think Lino and Mavs have owned this discussion. But that's probably coz I agree with them on principle.

If Pep's system requiresplaying out of the back, and if Joe shows an inability to adapt to this, Shirley bringing in Ter Steegen isn't so ridiculous.

That Joe has been great in the past isn't a legitimate argument.

That you can't believe some want to dump Joe after all he has done, is not a legitimate counterpoint.

That Joe will succeed at playing from the back, isn't opposed to the original position posited.

That poster of the original claim doesn't have proof Joe wouldn't succeed is a red herring. As the claim States 'if he can't.

Anyway, hope Joe improves and keeps his place. But that's coz I like Joe. And I'm not ashamed to say I'm routing for him.

I think that unless there is some transfer news we should leave this thread at that until after Saturdays game because this pretty much sums it up.

 

[KCblue]

To be fair, and I think some pro-Hart posters on here have mentioned it, Joe has seemed to have some decent footwork when we've seen it in bits of training, but he has indeed been coached to just boot the ball up field. I think he deserves a chance to show what he can do. It won't be easy and I am more than aware there are other keepers out there who we know for a fact can distribute better, but Joe hasn't been forced to play in a system that asks that of him. Let's see what he can do.

 

[ADegenerate]

I'm ashamed I haven't brought this up. Can we talk about the financials a bit? How much can we get for Joe and will we really have to pay the buyout for Ter Stegen? After factoring in financials and squad roles it's almost a no brainer for me. Yeah?

 

[skiddypants]

This guy is what we need, Joe's problem has always been letting go of the ball fast.

 

[GeorgeHeslop'sTackle.]

We were never going to shift two thirds of this current squad in one transfer window, and It's very difficult to teach old dogs new tricks.

Like it or not, Pep's preferred way of playing isn't going to suit a lot of the older players we currently have, on our books.

would it not therefore, be more preferable, until such time as that situation changes, to find a method of playing that suits the players we have, rather than forcing them to play in a system that, the majority of them are clearly, in my view, still very uneasy with.

 

[ADegenerate]

It's very difficult to teach old dogs new tricks. Like it or not, Pep's preferred way of playing isn't going to suit a lot of the players we currently have, on our books.

would it not therefore, be more preferable, until such time as that situation changes, to find a method of playing that suits the players we have, rather than forcing them to play in a system that, the majority of them are clearly, in my view, still very uneasy with.

I've asked these questions myself. I think it's incredibly complex. I've thought about it and I've settled on the fact that I'm not as smart as Pep so no matter how deep I look into it I'll be wrong.

 

[GeorgeHeslop'sTackle.]

I've asked these questions myself. I think it's incredibly complex. I've thought about it and I've settled on the fact that I'm not as smart as Pep so no matter how deep I look into it I'll be wrong.

I completely agree. You're absolutely right. Lol

 

[Ric]

Still think Bravo is a more likely signing, but not sure if Stegen's injury could scupper that.

 

[ADegenerate]

I completely agree. You're absolutely right. Lol

Haha, cheers mate. I've spent too much time thinking about what you posted. I think it's a great topic and it would be fun to talk to people smarter than myself over a night of drinks.

 

[bobom]

We were never going to shift two thirds of this current squad in one transfer window, and It's very difficult to teach old dogs new tricks.

Like it or not, Pep's preferred way of playing isn't going to suit a lot of the older players we currently have, on our books.

would it not therefore, be more preferable, until such time as that situation changes, to find a method of playing that suits the players we have, rather than forcing them to play in a system that, the majority of them are clearly, in my view, still very uneasy with.

Let's play like we did last season!

 

[ADegenerate]

Let's play like we did last season!

That's bullshit. You're implying pellegrini effectively played with our squad properly and are ignoring what George was getting at.

**edit you're also ignoring new signings. Cheap post mate.

 

[bobom]

That's bullshit. You're implying pellegrini effectively played with our squad properly and are ignoring what George was getting at.

**edit you're also ignoring new signings. Cheap post mate.

Yes, I'm not above the odd cheap post.

I just think it's a nonsense to get the best coach in the world in and then suggest he should compromise his footballing philosophy because our players haven't mastered it in four weeks.

It's the way Pep has worked in the past, and why we brought him in. Look at all the great players he's sacked from his teams over the years because they don't fit into his style of playing. We're trying to become the greatest club in the world. Why settle for less?

 

[Tarzan41]

We were never going to shift two thirds of this current squad in one transfer window, and It's very difficult to teach old dogs new tricks.

Like it or not, Pep's preferred way of playing isn't going to suit a lot of the older players we currently have, on our books.

would it not therefore, be more preferable, until such time as that situation changes, to find a method of playing that suits the players we have, rather than forcing them to play in a system that, the majority of them are clearly, in my view, still very uneasy with.

Have you heard anything about our new manager? There is no way he will sacrifice his principles and way of playing.

 

[mosssideblue]

Joe certainly has the desire to get things moving from the back. He always looks to roll or throw it out if possible. I suspect the rest is a confidence thing. It's widely considered that he is skillful enough with the ball in training etc. but only actually putting it into practice in games will help build that confidence.
And tbh, it's hardly surprising. He's been trained at good old fashioned English clubs by good old fashioned coaches. A bit like Sam Allardyce's comments saying he'd teach Stones how to defend first and foremost. An old fashioned English mentality to certain aspects of the game means they will forever remain in the past.
None of our recent managers have been averse to playing out from the back, but none have shown the vision that Pep does in including the 'keeper as an extra ball playing man or even dropping an even better ball playing midfielder back to help the CBs out.
And if we think of the 'keeper-sweeper tag, it's mainly used for E.g Neuer, Lloris who generally come out to clear danger rather than start the play. (not saying that they don't do that too, but both are renowned for taking the ball off strikers' toes)

He may well have, but for me his speed of thought and action tend to let the opportunities pass him, by which time he has not many options other than to punt it up the field.

This season, he will have a lot more options and I just hope Joe becomes a lot more decisive in this aspect.

 

[ADegenerate]

Yes, I'm not above the odd cheap post.

I just think it's a nonsense to get the best coach in the world in and then suggest he should compromise his footballing philosophy because our players haven't mastered it in four weeks.

It's the way Pep has worked in the past, and why we brought him in. Look at all the great players he's sacked from his teams over the years because they don't fit into his style of playing. We're trying to become the greatest club in the world. Why settle for less?

I'm not sure you understand the questions asked. I don't mean that in any harsh way at all. It's a very fair question to ask. It's more of a philosophical question. It's taking it a step further if you will? Why can't the manager evolve to the players? Why do the players have to evolve with him? Shouldn't it be a mix of both? Haven't we paid for these players and aren't they under contract for us?

Have you heard anything about our new manager? There is no way he will sacrifice his principles and way of playing.

Why does it have to be 'no way to sacrifice'? Isn't that more impressive to work with what we have? Or are you saying it's impossible? You're telling me the greatest of our generation has to have it his way or no way at all? Isn't this Pep Guardiola?

 

[BlueRockape]

I wonder if we will buy a new GK or even discuss it ;)

 

[mosssideblue]

We were never going to shift two thirds of this current squad in one transfer window, and It's very difficult to teach old dogs new tricks.

Like it or not, Pep's preferred way of playing isn't going to suit a lot of the older players we currently have, on our books.

would it not therefore, be more preferable, until such time as that situation changes, to find a method of playing that suits the players we have, rather than forcing them to play in a system that, the majority of them are clearly, in my view, still very uneasy with.

I take your sentiment but dont believe we have such luxury of time. We currently have pep for three years, so to suggest his methods are going to be introduced over a couple or more transfer windows is fast eating into that time.

I don't know for sure, but I don't think a Hybrid system would work as we would always tinkering with it until such time everyone got it. We possibly might be back to stage 1 then again as we sell on more older players and introduce new ones.

For me, pep will want it implemented from the get go.

 

[bobom]

I'm not sure you understand the questions asked. I don't mean that in any harsh way at all. It's a very fair question to ask. It's more of a philosophical question. It's taking it a step further if you will? Why can't the manager evolve to the players? Why do the players have to evolve with him? Shouldn't it be a mix of both? Haven't we paid for these players and aren't they under contract for us?

a) it's been a few weeks. Give them time to adjust before asking Pep to give up on a particular style. Including Hart. He's a top keeper and might be able to adapt.

b) Pep is trying to change tactics because he convinced his tactics are better. Why transition slowly, and let older players stick to bad habits when they will be gone in three years anyway? In which case, why confuse our young players by saying "we'd like you to play like this, but x can't hack it, so we'll play differently until he retires"

C) anyway, Joe Hart. I recon he'll stay and we'll get someone in who can really push him.

 

[ADegenerate]

a) it's been a few weeks. Give them time to adjust before asking Pep to give up on a particular style. Including Hart. He's a top keeper and might be able to adapt.

b) Pep is trying to change tactics because he convinced his tactics are better. Why transition slowly, and let older players stick to bad habits when they will be gone in three years anyway? In which case, why confuse our young players by saying "we'd like you to play like this, but x can't hack it, so we'll play differently until he retires"

C) anyway, Joe Hart. I recon he'll stay and we'll get someone in who can really push him.

Thanks for elaborating. I can answer some questions I've been curious about for a while now. Cheers.