March for the Alternative-26th March

[hilts]

I dont think any right minded person would be against companies or individuals paying their fair share of taxation, however a lot of people are using these cuts as a way of pushing their political beliefs.

If we are ever going to get a fairer society then those on the left would have to concede that anyone not pulling their weight both rich and poor need to be targeted.

i also think unions and some local government workers are overstating the amount of cuts to protect themselves

obviously just like the government will do like wise its the way the games played.

and this is the reason why we never get anywhere and never will, self interest is rife<br /><br />-- Sun Mar 27, 2011 2:47 pm --<br /><br />

I said Credible!

"Sacraficing the nation" -by reducing public spending to the levels of 2008???

500000 is a high estimate and the fact is the majority of "normal" people in this country realise that the cuts need to be made. If the unions want a return to the 70's, they will be very disapointed.

Sorry if my previous post was a bit condescending, but this is something I feel VERY strongly about.

Barclays bank paid between 1% and 2.5% tax on massive profits, I feel this is wrong.
Vodaphone negotiated a settlement with HMRC that seen a £6 BILLION tax bill reduced to £850,000 up front and £450,000 over 5 years, I feel this is wrong.
Boots moved its financial headquarters to Switzerland and seen its tax bill of £120,000,000 per annum wiped out, I feel this is wrong.
a swathe of UK companies ship goods to the channel Islands so that they can sell them online VAT free, costing the treasury over £150,000,000 per annum, I feel this is wrong.
Sir Philip Green of the Arcadia group paid his £1.2 Billion dividend in 2005 to his wife who lives in Monaco, depriving the public purse of £285,000,000, I feel that this is wrong.
There is a credible alternative, there is a better fairer way.
(& that is before I start on other financial institutions and companis that are ripping off the British public.)
Facts and figures supplied by PCS and NIPSA.

in your opinion why havent the current government done more to stop this and why did a previous labour government and so called protector of the working class fail to act?

its a genuine question by the way

 

[KpxSte]

I said Credible!

"Sacraficing the nation" -by reducing public spending to the levels of 2008???

500000 is a high estimate and the fact is the majority of "normal" people in this country realise that the cuts need to be made. If the unions want a return to the 70's, they will be very disapointed.

Sorry if my previous post was a bit condescending, but this is something I feel VERY strongly about.

Barclays bank paid between 1% and 2.5% tax on massive profits, I feel this is wrong.
Vodaphone negotiated a settlement with HMRC that seen a £6 BILLION tax bill reduced to £850,000 up front and £450,000 over 5 years, I feel this is wrong.
Boots moved its financial headquarters to Switzerland and seen its tax bill of £120,000,000 per annum wiped out, I feel this is wrong.
a swathe of UK companies ship goods to the channel Islands so that they can sell them online VAT free, costing the treasury over £150,000,000 per annum, I feel this is wrong.
Sir Philip Green of the Arcadia group paid his £1.2 Billion dividend in 2005 to his wife who lives in Monaco, depriving the public purse of £285,000,000, I feel that this is wrong.
There is a credible alternative, there is a better fairer way.
(& that is before I start on other financial institutions and companis that are ripping off the British public.)
Facts and figures supplied by PCS and NIPSA.

I dont think anyone would argue that tax avoidance by big business is wrong but unfortunately its perfectly legal and stopping it would cause all kinds of problems with the EU and international trade agreements. To even attempt to plug these loopholes would take many more years than we can afford with the national debt currently rising by over 100 billion every year. If this is the "alternative", why were Labour MP's involved when they totally failed to address this issue whilst they were in power?

 

[law74]

If we are ever going to get a fairer society then those on the left would have to concede that anyone not pulling their weight both rich and poor need to be targeted.

i also think unions and some local government workers are overstating the amount of cuts to protect themselves

But how can the poor pull their weight more, benefits are under attack, (& those that are fraudulently claiming deserve to be prosecuted), the sick and those unble to work are in danger of having their allowances taken off them, yes the welfare state needs a major overhaul, but this is not the way to do it, especialy not when there are ever increasing numbers losing their jobs.

Rather than the unions overstating the amount of cuts and the effect this will have, I feel that large numbers of the country are not yet fully awake to the true costthis will have not just to the public sector and public services, but the knock on effect to the private sector has been largely ignored to date.
From each by their means, to each by their needs.
There is a better fairer way.<br /><br />-- Sun Mar 27, 2011 2:58 pm --<br /><br />

in your opinion why havent the current government done more to stop this and why did a previous labour government and so called protector of the working class fail to act?

its a genuine question by the way

I feel that the current government are starting to look at the problem of evasion - avoidance, but not quick enough.
The previous administration was not imho a Labour Government, but new labour that continued with tory policies to the detriment of the working people of the nation (& dont get me started on the PFI PPP shambles).

The question of EU legislation and international trade agreements is worthy of note, however if we as a nation decided to use only ethical companies, and with most countries in the EU suffering the same problems with relation to tax havens, i feel that legislation could easily be brought though the European parlaiment (which has traditionally had a broader Left spectrum than the UK).

 

[hilts]

If we are ever going to get a fairer society then those on the left would have to concede that anyone not pulling their weight both rich and poor need to be targeted.

i also think unions and some local government workers are overstating the amount of cuts to protect themselves

But how can the poor pull their weight more, benefits are under attack, (& those that are fraudulently claiming deserve to be prosecuted), the sick and those unble to work are in danger of having their allowances taken off them, yes the welfare state needs a major overhaul, but this is not the way to do it, especialy not when there are ever increasing numbers losing their jobs.

Rather than the unions overstating the amount of cuts and the effect this will have, I feel that large numbers of the country are not yet fully awake to the true costthis will have not just to the public sector and public services, but the knock on effect to the private sector has been largely ignored to date.
From each by their means, to each by their needs.
There is a better fairer way.

the poor could pull their weight by being a bit more determined not to be poor, i am not a right winger by the way but this subject which has been discussed many times lies at the heart of the problem, people can be greedy,lazy and dishonest, for every business man swindling or using the tax system to his benefit there will be someone on benefits who is capable of working but doesnt want to.

i believe the figure of 8million has been quoted of people who are inactive in the economy. common sense tells me that if everyone who wasnt disabled and unable to work did their utmost to find work over the last 20 years that figure would be massively reduced.

the only way things will improve if all of us as a society rebel against those who are causing the damage, the rich blaming the benefit culture and the poor blaming big business is stupid becuase ther are both right

 

[law74]

the poor could pull their weight by being a bit more determined not to be poor, i am not a right winger by the way but this subject which has been discussed many times lies at the heart of the problem, people can be greedy,lazy and dishonest, for every business man swindling or using the tax system to his benefit there will be someone on benefits who is capable of working but doesnt want to.

i believe the figure of 8million has been quoted of people who are inactive in the economy. common sense tells me that if everyone who wasnt disabled and unable to work did their utmost to find work over the last 20 years that figure would be massively reduced.

the only way things will improve if all of us as a society rebel against those who are causing the damage, the rich blaming the benefit culture and the poor blaming big business is stupid becuase ther are both right

I know of quite a few round here that have been unemployed for so long now that they are unemployable. I also know of people that have been much worse off for taking work than they would have been if they remained on benefit, this is obviously wrong, but it does happen has happened and continues to happen.
The £5 per week disregard for someone on Income Support, Job Seekers Allowance of Employment Support Allowance that takes a part time job is a piss take.
If you are offered a job for two hours a day five days a week you get £5 extra for your effort and to try and get back into employment?
If these cuts continue to go through unabated, it will lead to many many people being unable to work, many of them young, and as we all know, it can be very hard to find employment if you have no employment record, that is one of the reasons why this government is (IMHO) cutting far too far, far too fast.
By all means offer inducements to the private sector to grow, but until it starts to grow, cutting public spending is just far too risky, and selling off public services and public buildings to line the pockets of private business is just short termism and wrong.

 

[brooklandsblue2.0]

I eagerly wait for the day when BB2 and co come whingeing on here that their friends or family can't get an ambulance or NHS treatment when they break a limb on a broken paving stone that was never fixed, can't get their streetlights repaired, can't get their bins collected or can't get their dead buried. That day is not as far away as these deeply embittered Tory apologists seem to think it is because they appear to believe the lies of Tory scum like Osborne, Cameron and his lying acolyte Clegg. Clegg's a busted flush anyway, but self-interested, smug, multi-millionaires Cameron and Osborne are a disgrace to humanity - like most Tories, if I'm being honest.

A quarter of a million marched in London yesterday; I was proud to be in that number. This is something the sunbed magnate could never and will never understand with his pathological hatred of the public sector, much of it apparently borne of either pure ignorance or from Daily Mail flim-flam.

It was a great day, no doubt about it and just the start. The ball has been set in motion now now and hopefully, we can build public strength to culminate in the Tories falling on their swords by the time they have their Conference in (incredible as it is arrogant) Manchester in October - if they haven't already done so - and they can take Clegg's Creosote Party down with them.

No doubt the pathetic actions of 500 anarchists will get parity in the media. Smashing up a bank is far more sensational than the young and the old, trade unionists and service-users alike marching together for moral reasons, isn't it?

While I wouldn't condone the actions of Anarcho-Communists who have no apparent TU affiliations, it remains a mystery to the silent majority as to why the government baulk at demanding that their targets (banks, Top Shop etc.) pay their due taxes like the rest of us.

*** Edited for accuracy ***

Thats why I go private since I was 22 and could afford to. No fucker supports me and I aint supporting no fucker either.

 

[hilts]

I eagerly wait for the day when BB2 and co come whingeing on here that their friends or family can't get an ambulance or NHS treatment when they break a limb on a broken paving stone that was never fixed, can't get their streetlights repaired, can't get their bins collected or can't get their dead buried. That day is not as far away as these deeply embittered Tory apologists seem to think it is because they appear to believe the lies of Tory scum like Osborne, Cameron and his lying acolyte Clegg. Clegg's a busted flush anyway, but self-interested, smug, multi-millionaires Cameron and Osborne are a disgrace to humanity - like most Tories, if I'm being honest.

A quarter of a million marched in London yesterday; I was proud to be in that number. This is something the sunbed magnate could never and will never understand with his pathological hatred of the public sector, much of it apparently borne of either pure ignorance or from Daily Mail flim-flam.

It was a great day, no doubt about it and just the start. The ball has been set in motion now now and hopefully, we can build public strength to culminate in the Tories falling on their swords by the time they have their Conference in (incredible as it is arrogant) Manchester in October - if they haven't already done so - and they can take Clegg's Creosote Party down with them.

No doubt the pathetic actions of 500 anarchists will get parity in the media. Smashing up a bank is far more sensational than the young and the old, trade unionists and service-users alike marching together for moral reasons, isn't it?

While I wouldn't condone the actions of Anarcho-Communists who have no apparent TU affiliations, it remains a mystery to the silent majority as to why the government baulk at demanding that their targets (banks, Top Shop etc.) pay their due taxes like the rest of us.

*** Edited for accuracy ***

Thats why I go private since I was 22 and could afford to. No fucker supports me and I aint supporting no fucker either.

thats the kind of attitude that i was talking about, rich or poor a git is still a git

 

[law74]

I eagerly wait for the day when BB2 and co come whingeing on here that their friends or family can't get an ambulance or NHS treatment when they break a limb on a broken paving stone that was never fixed, can't get their streetlights repaired, can't get their bins collected or can't get their dead buried. That day is not as far away as these deeply embittered Tory apologists seem to think it is because they appear to believe the lies of Tory scum like Osborne, Cameron and his lying acolyte Clegg. Clegg's a busted flush anyway, but self-interested, smug, multi-millionaires Cameron and Osborne are a disgrace to humanity - like most Tories, if I'm being honest.

A quarter of a million marched in London yesterday; I was proud to be in that number. This is something the sunbed magnate could never and will never understand with his pathological hatred of the public sector, much of it apparently borne of either pure ignorance or from Daily Mail flim-flam.

It was a great day, no doubt about it and just the start. The ball has been set in motion now now and hopefully, we can build public strength to culminate in the Tories falling on their swords by the time they have their Conference in (incredible as it is arrogant) Manchester in October - if they haven't already done so - and they can take Clegg's Creosote Party down with them.

No doubt the pathetic actions of 500 anarchists will get parity in the media. Smashing up a bank is far more sensational than the young and the old, trade unionists and service-users alike marching together for moral reasons, isn't it?

While I wouldn't condone the actions of Anarcho-Communists who have no apparent TU affiliations, it remains a mystery to the silent majority as to why the government baulk at demanding that their targets (banks, Top Shop etc.) pay their due taxes like the rest of us.

*** Edited for accuracy ***

Thats why I go private since I was 22 and could afford to. No fucker supports me and I aint supporting no fucker either.

So you have a private Fire Service?
With up to 200 Fire fighters to lose their jobs in Greater Manchester as part of cuts of £23,000,000 to the fire service, I hope that none of your sunbeds short out and catch fire.

 

[brooklandsblue2.0]

P.S - Ernesto I am STILL waiting for you to define the term 'the rich' or as I suspect you have run from the hills rather than risk another verbal panning from me?

-- Sun Mar 27, 2011 3:41 pm --

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.insidehousing.co.uk/news/finance/thousands-of-council-staff-earn-more-than-%C2%A3100k/6514157.article?PageNo=1&SortOrder=dateadded&PageSize=20" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.insidehousing.co.uk/news/fin ... ageSize=20</a>


All socialists on 6 figures or more should be sectioned indefinitely. Simples.
Either they are true socialists and are happy to remain true to their socialist roots (and socialist wages), or they are world class hypocrites and happy to take the capitalist dollar when it suits them.

Did anyone see the Sunday Times expose just over a week ago on Manchester Council and others – while these hypocrites are moaning about the cuts, they are refusing to take a 5% cut on their £200K+ packages. If Cameron had a backbone, he’d sack all public sector employees on over £100K who refused to take a pay cut to £75K or less (emergency services excepted). The salaries of councillors and Quangos exploded under Labour.

And we you know, it’s the looney left hypocrites that support the Islamic fascists – we need a mass round of sectioning!! Who’d have thought the day would come when the far left would lie in bed with fascists? More importantly, how do we cut this terminal disease – leftism – from society??

Maybe we could start with a slogan on a t-shirt - “I’m not selfish enough to be a socialist” or “socialists are bankrupting my children – stop them now!!”<br /><br />-- Sun Mar 27, 2011 3:42 pm --<br /><br />

Thats why I go private since I was 22 and could afford to. No fucker supports me and I aint supporting no fucker either.

So you have a private Fire Service?
With up to 200 Fire fighters to lose their jobs in Greater Manchester as part of cuts of £23,000,000 to the fire service, I hope that none of your sunbeds short out and catch fire.

wouldn't phase me, Im insured out of my arse mate.

 

[hilts]

Thats why I go private since I was 22 and could afford to. No fucker supports me and I aint supporting no fucker either.

So you have a private Fire Service?
With up to 200 Fire fighters to lose their jobs in Greater Manchester as part of cuts of £23,000,000 to the fire service, I hope that none of your sunbeds short out and catch fire.

the guy is an idiot but the fire service is not the best example