Middle East Conflict

[goalmole]

The guy is a ****.

A stupid one at that.

 

[Roachy]

I’m no expert on anything Middle East but I am surprised that Sunak on his so called diplomatic mission to release seven hostages held by hamas has come out and said that he will support Israel and hopes they win. If I was a diplomat I would secure the releases before nailing my sail to the mast

I think visiting Israel would be an indicator without a word being spoken tbh.

 

[Ducado]

Which Palestinian group?

There loads of them in the 70s, and they were based in the countries that financed Abu Nidal was based in Iraq, some were in Libya, and some in Syria, ultimately they were armed and trained by the Soviets all of them were secular

 

[cucumberman]

OK, I watched your youtube video. If you had seen the aftermath pictures of the site your brain wouldn't get the stupid idea to suggest the undamaged hospital walls were exposed to the devastating impact of such a JDAM airbust seen in the video.
Think again, Mr Holmes.

Then, given your decorated skills of knowing better, ask Mike Mihajlovic. He’s just another Mr.Holmes so respond to his analysis of.

 

[Dax777]

Hamas have to be removed. Either the Palestinian people remove Hamas themselves (ideal solution), elect a civilised government with their own peoples interest at heart and then negotiate an acceptable peace deal with Israel OR the UN take control of the Gaza strip and bring civilised a government etc OR Israel destroy Hamas themselves (not easy). Leaving Hamas in place is not an option or solution. Israel have a democratic mechanism to get rid of any leader they wish, Palestine appears to be controlled by those who have the biggest gun.

Again, like I said in a post way back there is no solution to this problem. At least not in this generation or the next...

Hamas is not going anywhere politically. The Palestinians generally support Hamas and agree with it. A majority of those in Gaza and the West Bank would prefer if Israel and the Jews were cleansed from the area. So if Hamas is to be neutralized then it would have to be Israel doing it.

Generally, Palestinians are raised to hate Isrealis. The average Palestinian is raised the same way the far right orthodox Jews are raised. I.e. not to give an inch. Thus the prevailing wish of most Palestinians if it was up to them would be Israel gone.

Sure, a good sum may prefer, peace, safety, stability, and economic growth for now, but those are just primary needs. Once those needs are satisfied, Israel gone is next in importance.

For the most part, Israelis in Israel mostly understand this. Even the liberal ones who want the best for the Palestinians including the interfaith types... Almost none of them think Palestinians want a 2 State solution. So it's pointless for them to keep pretending this is an option...

The Settlers in the West Bank are even worse.And are as adamant as the most adamant Palestinian.

It is diplomatically an unsolvable problem.

the prevailing attitude thus seems to be whatever it takes to keep us safe while doing the best not to make of the Palestinians what others around the world used to make of us... But it's hard to balance these interests.

 

[splinter]

It's going to get real messy..idf commander just told the troops we want total annihilation of hamas and any other terrorists...won't be long till everyone involved. I'm going to need more booze

 

[Ducado]

I have the feeling Putin taught western leaders to stand together and say enough is enough. The same kind of concentrated support could happen now in the Middle East, defending the same values.

Israeli Defence Minister Gallant told troops gathered at the Gaza border today that they will soon see the Palestinian enclave “from inside".

We will see what Biden has to say today tonight 1am.
US Navy already arrived to show strong presence.

I can see enough signs to expect ground action against Hamas infrastructure.
The Israeli shock sits too deep and the structures behind the 7 Oct attack will have to be destroyed to make a repetition of that drama impossible, for some time at least.

Hamas has fucked it up will be the message. Neither them nor Hesbollah or Iran must come out as 'winners' of this terrible development from a western view.

I believe this exactly what Hamas and the Iranians want, a long drawn out soul sapping urban war, start a new front in the north and Israel is in serious trouble, that’s what is worrying the Americans, that this whole situation has been engineered is getting quite obvious they know Israel can’t stand back once attacked

 

[I'm With Stupid]

Because they are generally more successful than the larger host community.

Well that and 2000 years of Europe being told that they were responsible for Jesus' death. Let's be honest, a community doesn't have to be economically successful to be subjected to massive discrimination. The difference with the Jews is that they've literally always been a minority, at least until Israel was formed. Other than Jews, the only other groups that have only existed as a minority anywhere in the world for large parts of their history would be native people or travelling communities, and they are almost exclusively treated like shit too.

As for the Muslim antisemitism, I'd be interested to know how much of that there was before the formation of Israel, because certainly in modern times, it's almost entirely based around that.

 

[Metal Biker]

Then, given your decorated skills of knowing better, ask Mike Mihajlovic. He’s just another Mr.Holmes so respond to his analysis of.

So we have one group GeoConfirmed, respected source given their accurate coverage during the Ukraine/Russian Invasion, saying it was fired from inside Gaza and the warhead hit the car park.

Here we have another respected physicist saying the type of warhead isn't something Hamas have.

But Islamic Jihad is being blamed, not Hamas.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

RIP, very sad.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

I see we have more missile experts than yesterday. I also note that all new proposed solutions put 100 percent onus on the Palestinians.

 

[Travellingman]

The Arab media is unrelenting in its support for the Palestinians and its hatred for Israel. All of them still claiming that it was Israel bombing the hospital.
I’m currently working in Libya, it’s a topic to be avoided at all costs with the locals.

 

[Metal Biker]

Well that and 2000 years of Europe being told that they were responsible for Jesus' death. Let's be honest, a community doesn't have to be economically successful to be subjected to massive discrimination. The difference with the Jews is that they've literally always been a minority, at least until Israel was formed. Other than Jews, the only other groups that have only existed as a minority anywhere in the world for large parts of their history would be native people or travelling communities, and they are almost exclusively treated like shit too.

As for the Muslim antisemitism, I'd be interested to know how much of that there was before the formation of Israel, because certainly in modern times, it's almost entirely based around that.

Shorthand version, the Quran's verses state that God is angry with the Jews because they reject the word of the Prophets Jesus and Muhammad and for perverting the scriptures of God.

 

[The blue phantom]

They need 150 trucks of Aid a day and there's just 20 on the border that can't get in. Some children now down to a meal every 2 Days. 50'000 pregnant woman with no medical assistance. Sanitation fucked. Minimal Water and no Fuel.

Over 2 Million people suffering in squalid conditions and some of this could be put right with the click of a finger.

Absolute Bastards.

 

[robbieh]

In 1948, 500 Palestinians villages were destroyed and 700,000 people fled the area that is now Israel.
The Jewish people quite rightly never forget the Holocaust and keep alive the memories of family and friends lost. It's also easily understandable why they craved and still crave, security and a homeland.
It's also the case that Palestinians will never forget the Nakba; lives, land and possessions lost forever.
It does seem an intractable problem.

 

[domalino]

Shorthand version, the Quran's verses state that God is angry with the Jews because they reject the word of the Prophets Jesus and Muhammad and for perverting the scriptures of God.

I don’t think it actual singled out Jews for that, most verses are about nonbelievers or mention Christian’s and Jews.

Besides, the Ottoman Empire was an Islamic caliphate that was by far the most welcoming and hospitable place for Jews for 700 years while they were still banished or fiercely persecuted in most Christian countries.

Most of the animosity between religions really is from the last 200 years and particularly the Zionist movement putting the two groups directly at odds.

 

[I'm With Stupid]

Shorthand version, the Quran's verses state that God is angry with the Jews because they reject the word of the Prophets Jesus and Muhammad and for perverting the scriptures of God.

Well yeah, religion hates other religion shocker. But I meant more day-to-day. Plenty of Jews lived in Muslim countries pre-1940s, and I don't know if they were specifically singled out for discrimination (any more than any other minority would have been at the time). But the massively violent antisemitism we see nowadays from Muslim countries and large parts of the population is definitely a post-Israel thing.

 

[Roachy]

I see we have more missile experts than yesterday. I also note that all new proposed solutions put 100 percent onus on the Palestinians.

New from what date?

 

[Ducado]

Shorthand version, the Quran's verses state that God is angry with the Jews because they reject the word of the Prophets Jesus and Muhammad and for perverting the scriptures of God.

Yet there have golden ages in the relationship between Judaism and Islam, and to fair Islam doesn’t tend to mix well with other religions, it was spread by the sword in its early days

 

[Metal Biker]

Well yeah, religion hates other religion shocker. But I meant more day-to-day. Plenty of Jews lived in Muslim countries pre-1940s, and I don't know if they were specifically singled out for discrimination (any more than any other minority would have been at the time). But the massively violent antisemitism we see nowadays from Muslim countries and large parts of the population is definitely a post-Israel thing.

I think it's always been there, bubbling under the surface. Generally Jews were regarded as "lesser" rather than hated.