Middle East Conflict

[kaz7]

First there are 450,000 thousand settlers
that are spread over lands that separate the peoples and are thus a kind of human wall that separates and keeps the peace, and where exactly does a resident of Gaza try to live a normal life and develop other than getting up in the morning and thinking of murdering and killing! Why isn't one country out of 20 Arab countries and 70 Muslim countries ready to accept one refugee from Gaza?
The world opened its doors to Ocarina and why are their brothers not ready?
A question that perhaps explains who and what Israel has to deal with

You are hardly unbiased on this subject

 

[mancity2012_eamo]

You are hardly unbiased on this subject

You could argue that none of us are, but his lack of self awareness of how badly he is coming across, is difficult to believe.

 

[BrianW]

I agree with much of what you say. Regarding the tunnels reference the IDF first finding them and then destroying them it's a massive task considering the size of the system which from what I can gather is vast and fighting through them would be a nightmare they are easily defended. I'd fully expect the IDF to take high casualties irrespective of trying to minimise losses. Just to give you an example. I was an infantryman and the first time I did a house clearance after learning the theory of it we then put it into practice. We went to a house, we were a ten man section, front door gets kicked in and a practice grenade goes in, bang, entry team enter shooting and clearing rooms ground floor to bedrooms. Easy. We went to another house and did the same thing. Door goes in after much more kicking and I chuck a grenade in which comes bouncing out again because there was an upright mattress just inside, there was concertina barbed wire nailed to the floor and up the stairs. We couldn't get through the door for ages and once inside the defenders upstairs dropped grenades through the floor which they'd sandbagged to stop us shooting through the ceiling at them. My point is you'll rarely encounter the same scenario. I've done tunnels running under houses which was worse still.

A post like this is worth 1000 speculations from people who know SFA.

 

[St.Pauli support]

I agree with much of what you say. Regarding the tunnels reference the IDF first finding them and then destroying them it's a massive task considering the size of the system which from what I can gather is vast and fighting through them would be a nightmare they are easily defended. I'd fully expect the IDF to take high casualties irrespective of trying to minimise losses. Just to give you an example. I was an infantryman and the first time I did a house clearance after learning the theory of it we then put it into practice. We went to a house, we were a ten man section, front door gets kicked in and a practice grenade goes in, bang, entry team enter shooting and clearing rooms ground floor to bedrooms. Easy. We went to another house and did the same thing. Door goes in after much more kicking and I chuck a grenade in which comes bouncing out again because there was an upright mattress just inside, there was concertina barbed wire nailed to the floor and up the stairs. We couldn't get through the door for ages and once inside the defenders upstairs dropped grenades through the floor which they'd sandbagged to stop us shooting through the ceiling at them. My point is you'll rarely encounter the same scenario. I've done tunnels running under houses which was worse still.

Yeah, I get your point.
What about flooding tunnels, wouldn't that be a threat? No idea how realistic that is at all. Just a thought how to minimize own losses in tunnels.
I know, where does the water come from.

 

[Mr Kobayashi]

Here's some solutions, mostly from the Israeli viewpoint I think, it would be interesting seeing solutions from a Palestinian viewpoint. I think the only definite is that Hamas have to go.

1: Hamas meet the IDF on the battlefield well away from 'innocent' citizens of either side.
2: Hamas surrender and are brought to court to face the consequences for their actions.
3: The 'innocent' Palestinian people rise up and overthrow Hamas. Yes it's hard, yes thousands will die but doing nothing means that thousands of 'innocent' Jews will die because the 'innocent' Palestinians are seemingly doing nothing but being 'innocent'.
4: The UN should get off their fat backsides, forget their fat pensions, stick their good words up their arses and actually DO something.
5: Israel destroys Hamas themselves. Hamas apparently are in tunnels, schools, hospitals, etc and hiding behind their own children. The necessary fighting from building to building (if ground forces go in) will be very dangerous. The Israelis have decided that to preserve as many Israeli soldiers lives as possible that they will bomb as many known Hamas hideouts as possible. This is the crux of war, how many 'innocent' Palestinian lives are worth an 'innocent' Israeli life? Should you destroy an entire army of say 10,000 men plus multiple civilian deaths to save 4 men of your own?
6: Ceasefire now and then negotiate. Very unlikely.
7: One state solution. Don't make me laugh.
8: One side is given land in another part of the world and leaves the area forever? Very unlikely.
9: The rest of the world insist that both sides go back to the original border agreement.

Soldiers aren't innocents are they?

 

[I'm With Stupid]

Don't worry everyone. The Premier League has just solved it.

 

[mancity2012_eamo]

Irish governments have in general towed the line when dealing with criticisms of Israeli governments and policy for decades, although to be fair we probably have raised more objections to the suffering of the Palestinian people than most.

But there has always been issues raised by independents in our Dáil Éireann (Houses of Parliament).
Richard Boyd Barrett called for the expulsion of the Israeli Ambassador years ago.

I don’t know if that undercurrent is there in the rest of Europe or not. Is there dissenting voices in other parliaments that reflect an opinion like that, which is widespread on the ground.
I don’t know what the answer to Israel/Palestine is but I do feel that removing Hamas and continuing to give Carte Blanche to the other injustices in the area, basically ensures that Hamas will just be replaced by a new generation of‘Terrorist’.

I’ve seen interviews with the current ambassador to Ireland and she comes across as reading from the same cliched script of denial and misinformation that they all do.

Rightly or wrongly, the impression I get from Israel officials every time is, that we don’t give a fvck what you think, we will do what we want, so butt out.

Here’s footage doing the rounds at the moment, from nearly a decade ago.

 

[goalmole]

You could argue that none of us are, but his lack of self awareness of how badly he is coming across, is difficult to believe.

That's because his attitude and perspective is quite normal in his country so he thinks his posts and view are quite normal.
Imagine a country full of his type and it tells you why this problem isn't getting solved peacefully.

 

[bluethrunthru]

meanwhile the Police are making up crimes that may never happen

 

[Johnny Mars Bar]

meanwhile the Police are making up crimes that may never happen

Personally I'm on the Israeli "side" but that guy is doing nothing wrong whatsoever. He has every right to show support for Palestine and its people (something I agree with - I take issue when these people show support for Hamas and spout antisemitic views, which they can often do).

I didn't get through that whole video but it doesn't need to be 6 mins long. Here's how it should go, time stamped:

0.01: copper knocks on door
0.02: Hello copper, am I doing anything illegal?
0.15: after a friendly exchange, copper explains no, you're not doing anything illegal.
0.30: after another friendly exchange, you politely tell copper to fuck off your property and catch some real criminals.
0.35: kettle on, settle down for Antiques Roadshow / Netflix / whatever.

Absolutely fucking sick of seeing videos of dickhead coppers playing games with dickhead GoPro enthusiasts.