Middle East Conflict

Prestwich_Blue said:
Yet again, where did the hatred start? Arabs attacked Israel as soon as the partition vote had taken place. Be nice if some of you could bring yourselves to admit that.

The original terror group, the PLO, was formed in 1964, three years before the Six Day War that saw Israel control the West Bank and Gaza. At that time, Gaza was under Egyptian military occupation and the West Bank had been annexed by Jordan.
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Alright pal, i get this is a sensitive subject for you, it is also a subject you are well versed in from an historical perspective. Terrorism started well before that after WW2 when Zionist terror organisations fought against the Palestinian mandate and many British soldiers were killed. The Irgun, Hagganah and Lehi were far right wing jewish militias fought until the establishment of the Israeali state in 1948. Zionist insurgents hung two British army sergeants.

That though for me is years ago, it was a time of universal horror, yet 70 years later the horror continues. I am not a bad man, I am not an anti semite, even though many like me on the left where described as being just that. I want peace.

If we really looked at where the hatred started , Dan Jones books on the Knights Templar are a good place to start. Obviously read on further from his take on it and read more like Peter Oborne's book " the fate of Abraham"

Hopefully peace will win the day, jaw jaw not war war has to be the way forward.
 
Fascinating and eye-opening article imo about security concerns from an Israeli perspective.

Defensible Borders to Ensure Israel’s Future.

jcpa.org

Defensible Borders to Ensure Israel’s Future

Israel’s fundamental right to defensible borders is grounded in the strategic and legal circumstances that emerged immediately after the Six-Day War,
jcpa.org jcpa.org
 
Many new countries were established during the 20th century with arbitrary borders. These countries have moved on except the Arabs in Palestine. They have fought against the Jews to date.
Some even chanted about Khaybar yaya hud during the recent protests.
Until they let go of their hatred of Jews, there’ll never be peace in the Middle East.
Anwar Sadat of Egypt was assassinated because of his recognition of Israel.
Israel is happening whether anyone likes it or not. If you’re not going to recognise them, then at least don’t attack them then cry when they retaliate.
 
Pelegrinni said:
Many new countries were established during the 20th century with arbitrary borders. These countries have moved on except the Arabs in Palestine. They have fought against the Jews to date.
Some even chanted about Khaybar yaya hud during the recent protests.
Until they let go of their hatred of Jews, there’ll never be peace in the Middle East.
Anwar Sadat of Egypt was assassinated because of his recognition of Israel.
Israel is happening whether anyone likes it or not. If you’re not going to recognise them, then at least don’t attack them then cry when they retaliate.
Click to expand...

Hi Bibi.
 
Rascal said:
Alright pal, i get this is a sensitive subject for you, it is also a subject you are well versed in from an historical perspective. Terrorism started well before that after WW2 when Zionist terror organisations fought against the Palestinian mandate and many British soldiers were killed. The Irgun, Hagganah and Lehi were far right wing jewish militias fought until the establishment of the Israeali state in 1948. Zionist insurgents hung two British army sergeants.

That though for me is years ago, it was a time of universal horror, yet 70 years later the horror continues. I am not a bad man, I am not an anti semite, even though many like me on the left where described as being just that. I want peace.

If we really looked at where the hatred started , Dan Jones books on the Knights Templar are a good place to start. Obviously read on further from his take on it and read more like Peter Oborne's book " the fate of Abraham"

Hopefully peace will win the day, jaw jaw not war war has to be the way forward.
Click to expand...
You're someone whose views I respect, even if I don't agree with them, because I know they're genuinely held and without malice. Unlike some on here, who only seem to spout bile.

We could do the tit-for-tat 'they started it' routine probably going back to the Babylonian conquest. The Zionist militias didn't start in a vacuum but as a response to Arab terror, etc, etc. The British sergeants were hung in retribution for the hanging of three Irgun members. And yes, those three were terrorists.

All the events in the awful recent history of that part of the world have a cause. Some sympathetic to the Palestinian cause blame "mass" Jewish immigration (there wasn't) for the Arab riots n the early part of the 20th century. Yet the same people, like yourself, rightly decry our government's attitude to immigration by people desperate to escape war, poverty and discrimination. So you see why I accuse people of hypocrisy. You can't claim Arab unrest in Mandatory Palestine was justified while simultaneously shouting down Braverman and the Daily Mail.

Whether there was ever a realistic alternative to partition is a debate that's been had on here and I doubt there's any disagreement that there wasn't in the circumstances. Neither side would accept any of the alternatives put forward. Of course the ideal outcome was a secular state where everyone was free to practice their religion, or none at all. Where Jews, Muslims, Christians and others worked together for their common good. But that was never going to be accepted so we ended up with partition and, at that point, no one had forced anyone out of anywhere to any significant degree.

As someone who knows his history, you'll be aware that similar events took place on the Indian sub-continent the previous year. Tens of millions were displaced and probably a million murdered in communal violence that pitted Hindus against Muslims. Yet no one is screaming for those Pakistani Muslims of Indian descent to go back, or the Hindus who were displaced from what's now Pakistan. The Saud tribe became the rulers of Sa Arabia by wars and conquest, even up to the mid 1920's. Why is no one calling for the tribes they conquered and subdued to be given their land back? Why are the Palestinians seen as a special case among the world's refugees?

Very few are even aware that, alongside the Nakba, a similar number of Jews were displaced from Arab and North African countries, where they'd had well-established communities. That was the direct result of Arab irregular militias and regular armies attacking the newly formed state of Israel. Everything today flows from that refusal to accept partition and the failed attempt to wipe out Israel. The Arab riots of 1920 and the 1936-1939 revolt, the Irgun and Lehi, the massacres at Deir Yassin and the equally brutal Hadassah Medical convoy, they're just all white noise in this sorry saga.
 
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