Paul Ince Wants Rooney Rule

[Super-Barwuah]

As everyone else has said.

Paul, you aren't getting jobs because you are black it's because you are shit at it. I don't often say this but - give it up. Do something else

Quite correct, he could join Dion Dublin(creep and a rag) at Man utd hospitality reminiscing old stories to the glory hunting prawn sandwich brigade

 

[taconinja]

Just want to note that the Rooney Rule doesn't guarantee anyone being hired.

Here's how things used to work in the NFL. It might even sound familiar to some of you. There was this very small pool of men who were head coaches, ie managers in the NFL, and they would regularly be fired for underperformance... and then be rehired the next season by another club with basically no interview process whatsoever. It went like that for decades. It was nothing to do with being good enough. Those names were familiar. They had been in the coaching game of musical chairs despite how well they did the job. And it was next to impossible to break into the circle unless you were a chosen protege. What the Rooney Rule did was force owners to expand their interviewing process, and what it really did was open the owners' eyes to the fact that you didn't need to hire someone like Neil Warnock again or Harry Redknapp again just because they were a known commodity. It helped both Black candidates and White candidates get opportunities.

As for token interviews, the NFL fines the owner millions if they fuck around with people like that.

 

[BigOscar]

Just want to note that the Rooney Rule doesn't guarantee anyone being hired.

Here's how things used to work in the NFL. It might even sound familiar to some of you. There was this very small pool of men who were head coaches, ie managers in the NFL, and they would regularly be fired for underperformance... and then be rehired the next season by another club with basically no interview process whatsoever. It went like that for decades. It was nothing to do with being good enough. Those names were familiar. They had been in the coaching game of musical chairs despite how well they did the job. And it was next to impossible to break into the circle unless you were a chosen protege. What the Rooney Rule did was force owners to expand their interviewing process, and what it really did was open the owners' eyes to the fact that you didn't need to hire someone like Neil Warnock again or Harry Redknapp again just because they were a known commodity. It helped both Black candidates and White candidates get opportunities.

As for token interviews, the NFL fines the owner millions if they fuck around with people like that.

Pretty much exactly this. People in England can claim the best managers will get the job, but that doesn't add up with the fact that there are no good English managers. Either all english people are incapable of managing, or the best aren't getting a chance, while the same old names get given the jobs.

We need to take a leaf out of Portugals book on hiring managers. They are far more open to giving jobs based on people who interview well and seem like they have a plan for what they want to do with the club, and as a result have a lot of excellent managers. They are also a lot more inclined to promote young managers from the lower leagues and give them a chance. Most of these managers did very little in their playing careers and got their jobs based entirely on the strength of their interviews and their ability to outline how they would manage the club, rather than just their reputation as a player. As a result of this, Portugal has more managers in the champions league than any other country, a truly impressive achievement given the size of the country and the percieved strength of their league.

 

[sir baconface]

In theory this would open chairmen's eyes to a wider pool and maybe - if only on a future occasion - make them more receptive to a minority candidate. Some evidence of success is claimed from the USA. So on that score it seems a good thing. On the other hand, gut instinct suggests they'll almost always pre-select and just go through the motions. Most of us have a natural dislike of meddling too.

So I'm undecided at the present moment.

Part of the problem is that the few black managers we've had so far have been unspectacular at best, poor at worst. I can't think of any other reason than Sod's law. Surely with all the black players we now have in the PL some excellent ones will soon emerge. Then things could change considerably.

 

[jaiguruKun]

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.theleaguepaper.com/features/columnists/1004/why-paul-ince-should-not-get-another-chance/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.theleaguepaper.com/features/ ... er-chance/</a>

 

[Bobbins]

You will statistically see 1 in 5 of the coaches on the course being black, that in no way should translate to a managers job at all. Anyone can take a coaches course it does not give you a right to a mangers job, there may be 1in5 on the course left handed so should we expect roughly 1in5 mangers left handed.

The best for the job should get the job full stop, black,white,English foreign. The difference being that football is not all about qualifications and experience being the requisite on an application, many other elements/variables are at play and normal employment rules do not apply.

Actually, both of those things are exactly what you should expect, in a fair system. That's pretty much the basics of statistics.

If the percentages aren't the same then it is either a gigantic coincidence, or there must be a reason for the disparity. The statistics are so different that it pretty much rules out that it is a coincidence, therefore logic dictates that there must be a reason. The obvious two reasons being that either black (or left handed) people are fundamentally less capable at managing than white people, or that they are less likely to be given jobs than there equally talented white counterparts.

Given that I don't believe in white supremacy, the latter seems to be the most likely.

Why must there be a reason for the disparity ?? Could it not be jobs are given on merit and the candidate with the most merit should get the job whether they are black or white ?? You might aswell say if 1 in 5 of the candidates were Penguins then statistically 1 in 5 Penguins should get a Job
!! Do you Think Vinny or Patrick will be overlooked for the future managers job because of the colour of their skin ?? No chance they will be bang in for it and so they should.

 

[Mad Eyed Screamer]

Just want to note that the Rooney Rule doesn't guarantee anyone being hired.

Here's how things used to work in the NFL. It might even sound familiar to some of you. There was this very small pool of men who were head coaches, ie managers in the NFL, and they would regularly be fired for underperformance... and then be rehired the next season by another club with basically no interview process whatsoever. It went like that for decades. It was nothing to do with being good enough. Those names were familiar. They had been in the coaching game of musical chairs despite how well they did the job. And it was next to impossible to break into the circle unless you were a chosen protege. What the Rooney Rule did was force owners to expand their interviewing process, and what it really did was open the owners' eyes to the fact that you didn't need to hire someone like Neil Warnock again or Harry Redknapp again just because they were a known commodity. It helped both Black candidates and White candidates get opportunities.

As for token interviews, the NFL fines the owner millions if they fuck around with people like that.

We have a similar system in the UK. It is called the ''Rag Rule'' where anyone who has played for the Rags is guaranteed a job / jobs in management regardless of lack of experience / success.
Which brings us back to Paul Ince.......

 

[ShildonBlackCat]

There should be no place for the Rooney Rule in the English football. If coaches/managers are good enough, they will be considered. Hoe many fans would be happy that the likes of Paul Ince, Keith Curle, Chris Houghton are being considered for managerial jobs simply because they're not white and British. Is that not racist in itself?

 

[Deleted member 58678]

All this tells me is that there are currently no managers, who happen to have dark brown skin, who are seemingly good enough or showing enough potential to be given a job as a manager.

That's it.

Nobody deserves an interview or job based on the colour their skin may happen to be, just to fill a quota in part of a new law. That is quite frankly ridiculous.

Are there any Mancunian managers in jobs? If not, let's make sure at least one Mancunian gets an interview for every manager's job that comes available...haha, pull the other one.

If you're good enough, you're good enough, and you'll get a job. Simple as that.

 

[Deleted member 58678]

You will statistically see 1 in 5 of the coaches on the course being black, that in no way should translate to a managers job at all. Anyone can take a coaches course it does not give you a right to a mangers job, there may be 1in5 on the course left handed so should we expect roughly 1in5 mangers left handed.

The best for the job should get the job full stop, black,white,English foreign. The difference being that football is not all about qualifications and experience being the requisite on an application, many other elements/variables are at play and normal employment rules do not apply.

Actually, both of those things are exactly what you should expect, in a fair system. That's pretty much the basics of statistics.

If the percentages aren't the same then it is either a gigantic coincidence, or there must be a reason for the disparity. The statistics are so different that it pretty much rules out that it is a coincidence, therefore logic dictates that there must be a reason. The obvious two reasons being that either black (or left handed) people are fundamentally less capable at managing than white people, or that they are less likely to be given jobs than there equally talented white counterparts.

Given that I don't believe in white supremacy, the latter seems to be the most likely.

Why must there be a reason for the disparity ?? Could it not be jobs are given on merit and the candidate with the most merit should get the job whether they are black or white ?? You might aswell say if 1 in 5 of the candidates were Penguins then statistically 1 in 5 Penguins should get a Job
!! Do you Think Vinny or Patrick will be overlooked for the future managers job because of the colour of their skin ?? No chance they will be bang in for it and so they should.

Exactly right. In the next decade Vieira and Kompany will be managers of decent clubs and it won't because they happen to have a certain skin tone, it will because they are good managers.