Pep's tactics

[Rammyblues]

Better to lead than be led. Just sayin :-)

 

[its a Barm]

other teams might try and play this way, but our squad is one of the best in the world full of top quality players who should make the difference.

 

[Bellamy's Caddy]

Quick high-pressing is all the rage. It's what fucked us up this last 2 years.

But if I lost sleep over things like that I would never, ever sleep.

Definitely. The last few seasons were frustrating watching us come up against those teams and have no answer for it. Pep is a master tactician, who seems prepared for all scenarios. How quickly our players will adapt to those methods is another matter though.

Without sounding arrogant, we have an extremely strong squad, particularly compared to league rivals. I would hope that even if other teams were to mirror our tactics we would have enough quality to overcome it.

 

[Shaelumstash]

Loving the tactics and looking fwd to chatting about them with fellow blues, feel very excited to have Pep.

As an opposition coach coming up against the tactics of our full backs going into defensive centre mids, allowing KDB, Silva between the lines, our wingers one on one, what would you do firstly to combat this and also to carry threat.

The most obvious one is to not push on to the full backs, which would allow space to Clichy and Sagna (but how much of a threat would that be?), this would allow players to go with Silva and KDB and be quicker to double up on our wingers.

There is also the possibility that a side will leave their winger high up the pitch in space, this would leave one of the back 3 going to cover and being left one on one...This we are bound to see as and when we are leading and teams need to take a risk.

For me the main issue would be if Sagna and Clichy carry enough threat with the ball...I would expect based on a similar team that if the FB's where not pressed then it is possibly that we Ferndinho would not drop back and Sagna would make the back 3, or Stones would step out and Clichy would make the back 3 would be tried to increase the threat of giving time to players in this position.

I look fed to seeing what other blues think and mostly seeing what Pep does!!

Good post mate.

I think the obvious way to counteract how we played on Saturday would be to play 433 with the two wingers pushed really high, similar to how Chelsea played under Mourinho in his first spell. As you said, this would lead to one on ones against the centre back and open up space for the centre forward.

However, there is no way Guardiola would set up like that against a team that plays 433 with the wingers pushed on. He'd only set us up like that against a team that is parking the bus and playing one up front. It's a great way of pulling players out of position.

I can see him setting us up in a similar shape against the likes of West Brom, Hull etc, and I just can't see their manager's being bold enough to throw their wingers high up.

I could see Mourinho for example figuring out the way to counter that, but I'd be stunned if Guardiola set us up like that against the Shite. I think against better quality teams playing 4231 we'll see our deep-lying midfielder holding his position and the full backs holding the same line, so we are basically matching their 3 attacking midfielders man for man.

So something like this:

.............................GK
................Stones..............Kompany
Sagna................Fernandinho...............Clichy
.............Silva.......................De Bruyne
Sterling................Aguero.....................Sane

 

[jay_mcfc]

At 2-4 down against Juve last season he played with three right wingers all swapping who ran down the right wing crossing balls in. I've never seen that tactic in my life.

They won the game in ET

This guy's got tactics for every situation

The more I see and read about Pep I am adamant he is a fan of the NFL. His attacking tactics remind me exactly of all the different situations an offensive co-ordinater would do to try to create space, numerical advantages and mis-matches. What you describe is like when in the NFL they put three wide receivers on the field instead of the usual two to try to create one on one situations for the WR's or to create space elsewhere for another player in a different position to take advantage.

That's just one situation, there are countless others that are very similar. I don't suppose Pep has ever mentioned American Football in any of his books?

 

[casserole of nonsense]

According to people who have played for him, he is apparently a superb coach tactics wise. The guy just doesnt know how to manage people.

Oh mercy, please. That'll be why Lady Glenda's enjoyed a succession of top coaching jobs over the last decade.

 

[Stato]

The more I see and read about Pep I am adamant he is a fan of the NFL. His attacking tactics remind me exactly of all the different situations an offensive co-ordinater would do to try to create space, numerical advantages and mis-matches. What you describe is like when in the NFL they put three wide receivers on the field instead of the usual two to try to create one on one situations for the WR's or to create space elsewhere for another player in a different position to take advantage.

That's just one situation, there are countless others that are very similar. I don't suppose Pep has ever mentioned American Football in any of his books?

pretty sure he went and studied over there after he left Barca.

 

[Zin 'messiah' Zimmer]

Good post mate.

I think the obvious way to counteract how we played on Saturday would be to play 433 with the two wingers pushed really high, similar to how Chelsea played under Mourinho in his first spell. As you said, this would lead to one on ones against the centre back and open up space for the centre forward.

However, there is no way Guardiola would set up like that against a team that plays 433 with the wingers pushed on. He'd only set us up like that against a team that is parking the bus and playing one up front. It's a great way of pulling players out of position.

I can see him setting us up in a similar shape against the likes of West Brom, Hull etc, and I just can't see their manager's being bold enough to throw their wingers high up.

I could see Mourinho for example figuring out the way to counter that, but I'd be stunned if Guardiola set us up like that against the Shite. I think against better quality teams playing 4231 we'll see our deep-lying midfielder holding his position and the full backs holding the same line, so we are basically matching their 3 attacking midfielders man for man.

So something like this:

.............................GK
................Stones..............Kompany
Sagna................Fernandinho...............Clichy
.............Silva.......................De Bruyne
Sterling................Aguero.....................Sane

Not letting this silva/gundogan fight go I see (:

 

[Shaelumstash]

Not letting this silva/gundogan fight go I see (:

Haha I think it's you that's not letting the Gundogan / Silva fight go because you keep bringing it up.

I don't even think there is a Silva / Gundogan fight. I don't think there's a Silva / De Bruyne fight either. All 3 of them have big roles to play.

I think if you're expecting us to play the same team, same shape every week and he's going to pick your favourite Buzz Lightyear and Action Man where you want them to play, you're going to end up awfully disappointed ;-)

 

[Zin 'messiah' Zimmer]

Haha I think it's you that's not letting the Gundogan / Silva fight go because you keep bringing it up.

I don't even think there is a Silva / Gundogan fight. I don't think there's a Silva / De Bruyne fight either. All 3 of them have big roles to play.

I think if you're expecting us to play the same team, same shape every week and he's going to pick your favourite Buzz Lightyear and Action Man where you want them to play, you're going to end up awfully disappointed ;-)

Mate, I genuinely expected you to hold your hands up there and say 'shit, forgot about him'...

I've been talking about variations since Pep was announced and you're rIght, although his spine invariably stays the same, I think the same will apply here...

It's ok, I get the silva love but if people find the Joe hart thread hard to comprehend, wait till the little man gets bumped (:

 

[Phil1]

Mate, I genuinely expected you to hold your hands up there and say 'shit, forgot about him'...

I've been talking about variations since Pep was announced and you're rIght, although his spine invariably stays the same, I think the same will apply here...

It's ok, I get the silva love but if people find the Joe hart thread hard to comprehend, wait till the little man gets bumped (:

I'm saving all my anger up for that.. :-)

 

[Woodman1801]

The more I see and read about Pep I am adamant he is a fan of the NFL. His attacking tactics remind me exactly of all the different situations an offensive co-ordinater would do to try to create space, numerical advantages and mis-matches. What you describe is like when in the NFL they put three wide receivers on the field instead of the usual two to try to create one on one situations for the WR's or to create space elsewhere for another player in a different position to take advantage.

That's just one situation, there are countless others that are very similar. I don't suppose Pep has ever mentioned American Football in any of his books?

Seems to talk about Basketball a lot, I've not heard him mention NFL

 

[Shaelumstash]

Mate, I genuinely expected you to hold your hands up there and say 'shit, forgot about him'...

I've been talking about variations since Pep was announced and you're rIght, although his spine invariably stays the same, I think the same will apply here...

It's ok, I get the silva love but if people find the Joe hart thread hard to comprehend, wait till the little man gets bumped (:

Forgot about who? Gundogan? I'm pretty sure he's still not fit so not available to play?!

If you look back at my post earlier today I actually said when Gundogan is fit I can see him playing as the pivot and Fernandinho replacing Sagna as a right back dropping in to midfield. He'd be superb in that position and looking at our performance on Saturday, Sagna was the player who looked most unsuited to his role (other than Caballero!).

Oh, and regarding bumped, I can't even comprehend what is going to happen if De Bruyne gets bumped. You and the rest of the fan club are going to have to decide who you fancy more out of Kev and Pep! It's going to be a real 1D Vs Biebs moment! :-)

 

[dennishasdoneit]

pretty sure he went and studied over there after he left Barca.

he def.went to New York for what was described as a break after barca, but there would have been ample time for study( of the NFL) if indeed that is where he gets his inspiration from

 

[Zin 'messiah' Zimmer]

Forgot about who? Gundogan? I'm pretty sure he's still not fit so not available to play?!

If you look back at my post earlier today I actually said when Gundogan is fit I can see him playing as the pivot and Fernandinho replacing Sagna as a right back dropping in to midfield. He'd be superb in that position and looking at our performance on Saturday, Sagna was the player who looked most unsuited to his role (other than Caballero!).

Oh, and regarding bumped, I can't even comprehend what is going to happen if De Bruyne gets bumped. You and the rest of the fan club are going to have to decide who you fancy more out of Kev and Pep! It's going to be a real 1D Vs Biebs moment! :-)

I Didnt realise kompany and sane were fit?? I thought you were putting forward a prospective team?

Mate, you're being silly now, KDB is peps signing (:

 

[jay_mcfc]

Couple of very interesting responses to my question about NFL, i.e. he has spent a lot of time in America and he is influenced by basketball. Obviously not a direct link to NFL but still there is enough there. It would take me hours to actually write down what I am thinking but I'd be interested to hear if any other NFL fans can see a correlation.

 

[Zin 'messiah' Zimmer]

The more I see and read about Pep I am adamant he is a fan of the NFL. His attacking tactics remind me exactly of all the different situations an offensive co-ordinater would do to try to create space, numerical advantages and mis-matches. What you describe is like when in the NFL they put three wide receivers on the field instead of the usual two to try to create one on one situations for the WR's or to create space elsewhere for another player in a different position to take advantage.

That's just one situation, there are countless others that are very similar. I don't suppose Pep has ever mentioned American Football in any of his books?

The gospel in coaching stems from vince Lombardi, I'd be amazed if he isn't well versed, regardless of talking about it or not, you can see the many variations in tactics originates in other sports... Phil Jackson talks about the applied methods for the Bulls team of the 80/90s, applying Lombardi methods to the NBA, I'd say it's a fair assumption that most top coaches use his methods!!!

 

[Walking on the blue moon]

I Didnt realise kompany and sane were fit?? I thought you were putting forward a prospective team?

Mate, you're being silly now, KDB is peps signing (:

And Silva is Pep's chosen captain.:) I don't see why we can't have all three together for some truly beautiful football.

Btw, there is a pretty great article on FFT about Pep's management style and tactics. It was recced in City Now today. Don't know whether it has been posted but it's a good read. Helped me see the tactics against Sunderland better. All those passes and movements were meticulously planned and not overly reliant on player instincts. The part on different playing zones are particularly enlightening imo.
http://www.fourfourtwo.com/features...anagement-and-tactics?page=0,3&utm_m_medium=t

 

[Zin 'messiah' Zimmer]

And Silva is Pep's chosen captain.:) I don't see why we can't have all three together for some truly beautiful football.

Btw, there is a pretty great article on FFT about Pep's management style and tactics. It was recced in City Now today. Don't know whether it has been posted but it's a good read. Helped me see the tactics against Sunderland better. All those passes and movements were meticulously planned and not overly reliant on player instincts. The part on different playing zones are particularly enlightening imo.
http://www.fourfourtwo.com/features/long-read-guardiolas-16-point-blueprint-dominance-his-methods-management-and-tactics?page=0,3&utm_m_medium=t

Thanks for the link mate, will have a gander... I'm just pulling a few chains, of course the 3 will play together, I just believe there's more productivity with certain players than others....

 

[Shaelumstash]

I Didnt realise kompany and sane were fit?? I thought you were putting forward a prospective team?

Mate, you're being silly now, KDB is peps signing (:

Yes, a perspective team.

Not the definitive team that is going to start every game.

It's a rather antiquated idea - what's your best team? Well, who are we playing, who's available, who's in form, have we got another game in mid-week?

We aren't going to play the same team every week, so if Gundogan or De Bruyne are left out for certain games, there really is no need to get upset.

For the record, when fit I assume Gundogan will be a very important player for us, one of the first names on the team sheet. If we were to play the exact same system as we did on Saturday, and every player was fit, my team would be:

................................GK
.....................Stones.......Kompany
Fernandinho.......................................Clichy
...........................Gundogan
..........De Bruyne........................Silva
Sterling..............................................Sane
............................Aguero

Delph could even get a run ahead of Clichy, who knows. But all of your favourites are included in this team, so there is no cause for alarm.

My post earlier was more to illustrate the shape I'd expect us to line up against a 4231 team rather than my personal preferred 11. But then if you've read the post you'll know that already.