PL charge City for alleged breaches of financial rules

[halfcenturyup]

CAS relied very heavily on witness statements but on the flip UEFAs expert witness was never afforded access to the full records . I can’t remember the quote but it was something like he had seen the tip-off the ice berg but not what went on below.

CAS weren’t in a position to test the witness statements because UEFA didnt have evidence to back up the emails although when the accounts were particularly made available the amounts and timing of payments was in accord with the second email.

People are reading too much into the CAS judgment. For 1 it’s in accord with Swiss Law and 2 it, ad it’s something I keep repeating UEFA didn’t pursue to the end the fact that some documents were never disclosed they in effect gave up on that approach had they focused on that it’s highly likely that CAS would have come to the same conclusion as UEFA.

I just can’t see how City will even remotely be able to defend full non disclosure( if that’s what happened) when there was a HC ruling on the matter and indeed a PL arbitration panel has likewise confirmed contractual obligations

When the PL and City disclose in full the evidence they will rely on at the tribunal other than the hearing where that evidence will be examined it’s unlikely that even if it goes to a further hearing that either party will be allowed to reduce any further info.

On what do you base that conclusion?

 

[tolmie's hairdoo]

If the irrefutable evidence is clear and obvious I would imagine the PL will have law suits littering there letterbox from one and all and rightly so.

Hopefully. We can just ruin them by proxy!

 

[mickster2]

They are in effect accusing our auditors of collusion with falsifying our published accounts, which would be fraudulent, or of incompetence.

No; in the event that we're found in breach, the audtors simply have to say that they audited our accounts based on the information given to them by us at the time.

An audit doesn't garantee that no fraud has taken place - eg Enron had their accounts audted like every other large Corp. There invariably has to be a large degree of 'in good faith' trust between the auditor and the client.

 

[Iassel]

I am maybe crediting someone at the Premier League with a modicum of legal intelligence, but they have left an open goal for BDO, Etihad and others to go after their own pound of flesh if we are cleared?

BDO certainly won’t give a shit - it is the responsibility of the company being audited to provide such documentation to the auditor to allow a ‘true and fair’ view to be taken.

If the PL were able to produce some smoking gun documents that discredited the Annual Report of those years being charged, BDO would simply say ‘we never saw it, and ruled on what we did see’.

 

[Dubai Blue]

They are in effect accusing our auditors of collusion with falsifying our published accounts, which would be fraudulent, or of incompetence.

They're not. They're accusing City of misleading their auditors.

 

[Kippax77]

Don't post a lot these days, but need to use some sort of forum to vent.

I find myself falling out of love with the game that has been so wrapped in to my very DNA as a person day by day. For as long as I can remember, it has made up a huge part of my life & personality. I now find the general landscape of football in general utterly depressing, rotten to the core & increasingly unbearable. The fact that the only way you can wish to see your team compete consistently for the game's biggest honours is by your club being taken over by a ruling member of a Middle Eastern royal family is something that is often, in fact, no, always lost on the detractors of City. Even withstanding how broken that is, it's not even an avenue open to clubs in Spain, Germany etc.

I love my club, Eric Brook was my Grandfather's Uncle, so it's literally been in the blood since he was smashing goal scoring records in front of 84,000 at Maine Road, but the game today fucking stinks. Gone are the days where a brilliantly managed Leeds United, Manchester City, Derby County, Nottingham Forest et al could come from nowhere & not only compete, but WIN the biggest prizes the game had to offer. Why? Because of the slow eroding of the games competitive balance by a group of entitled clubs, lobbying their own interests to prevent others using the same path they used to stardom & success. How? By changing the very foundation of what the sport is meant to be through rotten politicking dating back to the 1970's/80's. Firstly through monopolizing gate-receipts, then the breakaway Premier League & Champions League, Super League, G-14 & of course the hijacking of FFP's original purpose by moving it away from debt maintenance, to a tool to suffocate any investment @ rivals which threatens their position. Finally now, to destroy Manchester City as a competitive force at the very top of the game.

So where are the media in this? well, acting in the interests of said clubs on the whole. Whether through being pawns for these clubs via briefings & thus guaranteeing the click revenue that brings from their legions of mindless, moronic fans. Or just being bad-faith acting journalists who support these clubs themselves, distorting rulings made by CAS, the history of City post takeover, our actual ownership model & more. The battle of public opinion has been lost since Der Speigel's original 'leaks', & has tarnished the clubs commercial reputation, I don't care what anyone says. & here is what the masses never see, including most City fans, as it so brilliantly disguised... People often slate BT/Sky for their coverage, & it makes me laugh. Their subscriber base probably has a greater % of United, Liverpool & Arsenal fans than the other 17 clubs combined. It is in their VERY interest to be biased towards these clubs, commercially. The same goes for the print media. What is going to make your company richer? A positive City article, or negative one? Think about it & stop expecting impartiality.

Now, do I love our owner? Honestly no, not any more than I would any billionaire I have 0 connection to. Do I love the fact they've made my club competitive & made all my dreams come true for 15+ years, yes I fucking do, unashamedly. In an ideal world I'd love City to be fan owned, competing at the highest level. The fact is, it's impossible due to the points outlined, namely the hijacking by a bunch of greed driven, self-interested vile clubs across Europe of the games purity, with their proxy journalists in tow, spouting their interests for generations to garner public support. With that said, we take what we can get don't we? Even so, we have to put up with all this shit, & I'm tired of it, I just want to be a football fan.

The only thing Manchester City are guilty of, is gaming a rigged system.

Probably one of the best posts I've ever read on here.
I see it so much as you do

Don't post a lot these days, but need to use some sort of forum to vent.

I find myself falling out of love with the game that has been so wrapped in to my very DNA as a person day by day. For as long as I can remember, it has made up a huge part of my life & personality. I now find the general landscape of football in general utterly depressing, rotten to the core & increasingly unbearable. The fact that the only way you can wish to see your team compete consistently for the game's biggest honours is by your club being taken over by a ruling member of a Middle Eastern royal family is something that is often, in fact, no, always lost on the detractors of City. Even withstanding how broken that is, it's not even an avenue open to clubs in Spain, Germany etc.

I love my club, Eric Brook was my Grandfather's Uncle, so it's literally been in the blood since he was smashing goal scoring records in front of 84,000 at Maine Road, but the game today fucking stinks. Gone are the days where a brilliantly managed Leeds United, Manchester City, Derby County, Nottingham Forest et al could come from nowhere & not only compete, but WIN the biggest prizes the game had to offer. Why? Because of the slow eroding of the games competitive balance by a group of entitled clubs, lobbying their own interests to prevent others using the same path they used to stardom & success. How? By changing the very foundation of what the sport is meant to be through rotten politicking dating back to the 1970's/80's. Firstly through monopolizing gate-receipts, then the breakaway Premier League & Champions League, Super League, G-14 & of course the hijacking of FFP's original purpose by moving it away from debt maintenance, to a tool to suffocate any investment @ rivals which threatens their position. Finally now, to destroy Manchester City as a competitive force at the very top of the game.

So where are the media in this? well, acting in the interests of said clubs on the whole. Whether through being pawns for these clubs via briefings & thus guaranteeing the click revenue that brings from their legions of mindless, moronic fans. Or just being bad-faith acting journalists who support these clubs themselves, distorting rulings made by CAS, the history of City post takeover, our actual ownership model & more. The battle of public opinion has been lost since Der Speigel's original 'leaks', & has tarnished the clubs commercial reputation, I don't care what anyone says. & here is what the masses never see, including most City fans, as it so brilliantly disguised... People often slate BT/Sky for their coverage, & it makes me laugh. Their subscriber base probably has a greater % of United, Liverpool & Arsenal fans than the other 17 clubs combined. It is in their VERY interest to be biased towards these clubs, commercially. The same goes for the print media. What is going to make your company richer? A positive City article, or negative one? Think about it & stop expecting impartiality.

Now, do I love our owner? Honestly no, not any more than I would any billionaire I have 0 connection to. Do I love the fact they've made my club competitive & made all my dreams come true for 15+ years, yes I fucking do, unashamedly. In an ideal world I'd love City to be fan owned, competing at the highest level. The fact is, it's impossible due to the points outlined, namely the hijacking by a bunch of greed driven, self-interested vile clubs across Europe of the games purity, with their proxy journalists in tow, spouting their interests for generations to garner public support. With that said, we take what we can get don't we? Even so, we have to put up with all this shit, & I'm tired of it, I just want to be a football fan.

The only thing Manchester City are guilty of, is gaming a rigged system.

Don't post a lot these days, but need to use some sort of forum to vent.

I find myself falling out of love with the game that has been so wrapped in to my very DNA as a person day by day. For as long as I can remember, it has made up a huge part of my life & personality. I now find the general landscape of football in general utterly depressing, rotten to the core & increasingly unbearable. The fact that the only way you can wish to see your team compete consistently for the game's biggest honours is by your club being taken over by a ruling member of a Middle Eastern royal family is something that is often, in fact, no, always lost on the detractors of City. Even withstanding how broken that is, it's not even an avenue open to clubs in Spain, Germany etc.

I love my club, Eric Brook was my Grandfather's Uncle, so it's literally been in the blood since he was smashing goal scoring records in front of 84,000 at Maine Road, but the game today fucking stinks. Gone are the days where a brilliantly managed Leeds United, Manchester City, Derby County, Nottingham Forest et al could come from nowhere & not only compete, but WIN the biggest prizes the game had to offer. Why? Because of the slow eroding of the games competitive balance by a group of entitled clubs, lobbying their own interests to prevent others using the same path they used to stardom & success. How? By changing the very foundation of what the sport is meant to be through rotten politicking dating back to the 1970's/80's. Firstly through monopolizing gate-receipts, then the breakaway Premier League & Champions League, Super League, G-14 & of course the hijacking of FFP's original purpose by moving it away from debt maintenance, to a tool to suffocate any investment @ rivals which threatens their position. Finally now, to destroy Manchester City as a competitive force at the very top of the game.

So where are the media in this? well, acting in the interests of said clubs on the whole. Whether through being pawns for these clubs via briefings & thus guaranteeing the click revenue that brings from their legions of mindless, moronic fans. Or just being bad-faith acting journalists who support these clubs themselves, distorting rulings made by CAS, the history of City post takeover, our actual ownership model & more. The battle of public opinion has been lost since Der Speigel's original 'leaks', & has tarnished the clubs commercial reputation, I don't care what anyone says. & here is what the masses never see, including most City fans, as it so brilliantly disguised... People often slate BT/Sky for their coverage, & it makes me laugh. Their subscriber base probably has a greater % of United, Liverpool & Arsenal fans than the other 17 clubs combined. It is in their VERY interest to be biased towards these clubs, commercially. The same goes for the print media. What is going to make your company richer? A positive City article, or negative one? Think about it & stop expecting impartiality.

Now, do I love our owner? Honestly no, not any more than I would any billionaire I have 0 connection to. Do I love the fact they've made my club competitive & made all my dreams come true for 15+ years, yes I fucking do, unashamedly. In an ideal world I'd love City to be fan owned, competing at the highest level. The fact is, it's impossible due to the points outlined, namely the hijacking by a bunch of greed driven, self-interested vile clubs across Europe of the games purity, with their proxy journalists in tow, spouting their interests for generations to garner public support. With that said, we take what we can get don't we? Even so, we have to put up with all this shit, & I'm tired of it, I just want to be a football fan.

The only thing Manchester City are guilty of, is gaming a rigged system.

 

[tolmie's hairdoo]

BDO certainly won’t give a shit - it is the responsibility of the company being audited to provide such documentation to the auditor to allow a ‘true and fair’ view to be taken.

If the PL were able to produce some smoking gun documents that discredited the Annual Report of those years being charged, BDO would simply say ‘we never saw it, and ruled on what we did see’.

And Etihad?

 

[Gingers Dad]

Unexpected support, of sorts, from Arsene Wenger here:

Wenger always tries to come across as Mr Dependable. I don't trust him at all. Right sneaky 2hat.

 

[Dubai Blue]

And Etihad?

Etihad haven't been defamed by the Premier League. Their name isn't mentioned once in the publicly released charges and the hearing will be held in private.

 

[halfcenturyup]

Hopefully. We can just ruin them by proxy!

Not sure we will need to.

The landscape may be very different when this over: independent regulator on the horizon, ME owners for United, AD owning Liverpool's main sponsor, Instigator clubs weakened, City's position strengthened etc etc .......

Let's see how the chips fall in the next few months :)