PL charge City for alleged breaches of financial rules

@Prestwich_Blue are you saying the allegations if proven are not that serious including disguised investing surely that’s false accounting fraud ? Relegation ?
I'm saying that there's a difference between doing something because you genuinely think it's OK, based on proper professional advice, and doing something you know is deceitful and illegal.

Based on the evidence provided at CAS, we know that ADUG did not fund the Etihad contract and therefore, on the basis of that evidence we believe the charges under that heading are likely to fail. But the PL's lawyers could potentially have uncovered details of a conspiracy to spin the story of the central funding as a knowing lie. I doubt it, but it's a possibility.

Financially, the Fordham and Mancini allegations aren't that significant but it's the motivation for those that's potentially important. Again, I very much doubt there was any overt, malign intent to deceive in either of those, but if there was that would have a wider impact that just the figures.

I've just found out that an ex-boss of mine died last year. He ran the insurance company I worked for and when it collapsed he was convicted of fraud and went to prison for 7 years. Insurance company premiums are their main revenue and claims are their main expenses. If you pay out less in claims than the revenue you bring in, you make a profit (and vice versa of course). Claims can take many years to finalise though, so they have to be carefully managed, and reserves put aside to cover potential liabilities that may arise. Those reserves are audited and professionally assessed by actuarial experts.

We'd written some bad business over a couple of years however, and losses started to become apparent on that business. Rather than admit those, which would have spoiled the good reputation the company had built, they were hidden by not putting new claims on the system. There is a legitimate reason for not putting them on the system short-term, because you might not be clear on what the potential liability is. Bujt once you have a figure, they need to go on the system, be visible, and reserves adjusted accordingly. Bujt they were witholding them even when the potential liability was established, which meant the company appeared to be more profitable than it actually was.

The point I'm trying to illustrate is that you could be questioned on not entering claims but you coulld say you had a legitimate reason not to, citing the difficulty of establishing a potential figure for liability. If you could show a pattern of doing that but only over a short term, then that might be judged as reasonable. But if you keep claims off the system for a longer time, even when liability is established, and there's a paper trail showing that you did this deliberatley and knowingly, then you'll be in trouble, as three of the directors were.
 
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Would agree but he certainly isn’t stupid, as the article is quite carefully constructed to appear balanced - and the conclusions contained in there are superficially plausible.

He presents three scenarios. The first being that we are found guilty - because we are guilty and that the club will engage in ‘vengeful’ retribution following it. The second scenario is the we are cleared but it’s inevitably qualified on the basis that it could be a just outcome, but by implication may very well not be. And the third scenario, and one he posits as the most likely, is a middle ground and one that crucially involves an admission of guilt on our part.

There is a common theme running through those three scenarios, namely that the club has done something wrong, a view that is underpinned by his description of the emails as ‘compelling’ despite them manifestly not painting the full picture (how could they?) juxtaposed against his derision at the club’s deployment of the word ‘irrefutable’ to describe the evidence we have/had in our possession to rebut these charges, through the prism of a gratuitous and grossly exaggerated reference to the hourly rate of our leading counsel. Along with, of course, the obligatory and misleading reference to the time-barring of the UEFA charges.

And he finishes off the article to remind everyone of the wider geopolitical consequences of a finding of guilt - a worthwhile point but plainly designed to bolster the inference of that gult, given its location at the end of the article.

It’s a carefully constructed, but wholly specious work of sophistry, and whilst conspicuously better written than most of its ilk, is still consciously designed to project the unwavering position that the club must have acted dishonestly.

Maybe it has, it’s perfectly plausible, however unlikely, but it’s the absence of any suggestion at the possibility that the club has not, and what the consequences are that would flow from that (rather than us simply getting away with it) that has marked this wholly dishonest species of article for the last two and a half years.
I pretty much drew the same conclusion, on the one hand, it cut away most of the nonsense but it mentions for example City forcing Wolfsburg to sell KDB, a mere nine years ago!

The main takeaway for me at least, was the notion that a big win for the Premier League will in fact be a disaster. Ten years worth of claims, counter claims, TV contracts in peril, future deals in peril etc

It also reassures me this will be an honest panel, whereas I previously presumed the Premier League would look to influence the panel to really shaft City, this is definitely not in their own interest.
 
This is a surprisingly decent read from our mates at the Guardian.

Read it for free in the library (not helping to fund our haters).

I agree it’s not an anti City as some articles but the tone is still is that our club is shady. There’s a half hearted attempt to say what’s wrong with club funding itself but then plays to the gallery by using Newcastle as an example.

We City fans have been treated appallingly by the red loving MSM. Joyful contemplating how our club could be ruined is the norm.

It’s hard not to hate these so called journalists.
 
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I cancelled my direct debit, but seems they can restart it from their end just have to wait and see
You will be better declaring that you don't need a TV License too, which you can do on the TV license website below. Lasts for a year and then you have to declare again. Stops them mithering you. I suppose they can still send someone around to your property to check, but the amount of people cancelling I doubt they have the resource to investigate everyone. I've not had a license for about 4 years now and never had a visit or anything.

 
I've seen dozens and possibly hundreds of articles discussing potential punishments, but not a single reference to a specific sporting advantage that we might have allegedly gained, especially as we simultaneously failed (and were punished) for not meeting UEFA's early FFP requirements.

What definitely wouldn't have happened that did happen Mr Camelgob?

City were fined €60 million by Uefa and given a squad reduction in 2014. Then in 2020 ordered to pay €10 million for non cooperation by CAS. What ever City’s execs were up to around 2012 with project Longbow it didn’t have the desired effect of the club passing FFP when the club were posting huge losses. The money in fines will have wiped out transfer budgets and resulting in not getting the targets City wanted. Who remembers Frank Lampard rocking up as a free agent back in 2014.
 
I am one of those who tries to keep up with this thread, but has to skim through because of lack of time, there is one question I would like to ask of the better educated here.
Take the scenario that City have been found guilty of some or all of the substantive "fraud" and "false accounting" charges, based on the flimsy evidence that we know exists, and the Commission uses the "balance of Probabilities" rule to get over the fact there is no incontrovertible evidence of guilt.
The club will obviously appeal if in this position, but my question is what would the other parties who have been tarnished by the verdict do, or what remedies would be open to them.
In particular I am thinking about the Audit firms involved in the whole saga, to the auditors their independence from their client is sacrosanct - they have now been found guilty of colluding with their clients to falsify records with intent to mislead other parties, I don't think this would go down well with these people, is there anything to stop the audit firms from suing the hell out of the PL ??? - I think not, and for this reason I feel that the Commission will only be able to find the club guilty if they can provide some serious new "smoking gun" evidence, the bar must be set very high.
But there may be factors I am not taking into account
 
We won all our trophies on the pitch. The fact the established order don't like that should not mean they can take our trophies away. Sounds like we may succeed with the bulk of the APT case, if rumours are believed. It is not unreasonable to think City will prevail against the 115/130 charges. The press keep forgetting that City overturned UEFAs case at CAS. Unless there is new damning evidence, City will win again. The established order is fast running out of options to stop City. The Premier League's last throw of the dice with the 115/130 charges should fail based on what we know. We will win. You are not having any of our trophies.
 

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