Player topic: Yaya Toure 2014/15 (continued)

[Blue Mooner]

Re: Player topic: Yaya Toure (2014/15)

The stats on his goals, assists or passes are irrelevant because there's not one person in the 328 pages on this thread that has ever questioned his ability, if they have they need locking up.

However if you take a balanced view of what people are actually disputing which is his effectiveness and effort off the ball, these stats are relevant.

If David Silva, Frank Lampard and Samir Nasri are contributing more defensively than you, you surely have to recognise you have a problem. People are saying we should accommodate Yaya by playing him in an attacking midfield role but Silva has scored more, assisted more, intercepted more and tackled more so that's not really an option is it? Unless Yaya is willing to get a few splinters in his lazy arse.

Well his stats in the champs league for the previous season when he was widely recognised as the best midfielder in the country read 1.4 & 0.9 David Silva was 0.5 & 0.8

Why the Champions league is the true measure of a players performance only you would know.

Juan Mata in the premier league reads 0.6 & 0.8 I guess they should f*ck him off ? No instead they hang a banner up for him reading the 'juan & only'

Your finding what you want to find, Yaya since he's been at City has not been and is not a defensive, in your face midfielder. What he is, is a powerful, explosive, goal scoring midfielder who can score you goals from nothing in crucial games, he can dictate play and control a game. When we haven't got the ball he's not as effective, but when you're having 70% possession it's not too much of a problem.

Where I possibly would agree is that in the games against the Barca's, Bayern Munichs of the world where you're not going to dominate possession then these are the games where I would look to rest Yaya and maybe only bring him on towards the end of a game if you need a goal.

The reality is statistically he is our 3rd highest scorer, has the highest number of passes per game, the second highest passing accuracy and is the 3rd highest rated player overall behind Silva & Aguero - and that is THIS SEASON.

Why he should be one of our players to go is complete idiocy, frankly, I think most of it is simply people with an axe to grind. It's called cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Based on what we could get for him its simply not worth replacing him. What might change is that we use him less but his experience will be invaluable and what we end up with is a City legend. Instead fans simply want to get rid, basically on a fit of pique, complete madness.

So what you're saying is his defensive contribution has halved this season? And you wouldn't play him against the likes of Bayern, Barcelona etc. because you can't trust him if we haven't got possession?

But you want to keep him because he's a City legend................... you're living in the past pal. We need to progress and evolve, not stand still waiting for the inevitable decline.

Well in 2012/2013 his stats were 1.2 tackles per game interceptions 0.9, this season it's 1.1 & 0.5 he's never been a player to launch into tackles or quick enough over half a yard to intercept passes, nothings changed, yet according to you this represents some kind of massive decline.

I'm basing my opinion on what I am witnessing game in game out and funnily enough most of the stats back me up that he is still one of our most influential players, I do accept that he is not going to get any better, but you don't lose incredible footballing ability overnight. On following seasons we should use his tremendous experience and eventually in 2/3 years he will be used more sparingly and in that time we have had plenty of time to groom his ultimate successor.

Is it any wonder we don't have any ex City players/legends fighting our corner when we are so ready to discard them. And no, I'm not living in the past I'm very much in the here and now.

I see absolutely no benefit losing a talent like Yaya Toure for what in todays money is very little money when his contribution still puts him in the top three of our players. If we need money to bring in a Pogba we should be targeting other sales not Yaya.

 

[shevtheblue]

Re: Player topic: Yaya Toure (2014/15)

Well his stats in the champs league for the previous season when he was widely recognised as the best midfielder in the country read 1.4 & 0.9 David Silva was 0.5 & 0.8

Why the Champions league is the true measure of a players performance only you would know.

Juan Mata in the premier league reads 0.6 & 0.8 I guess they should f*ck him off ? No instead they hang a banner up for him reading the 'juan & only'

Your finding what you want to find, Yaya since he's been at City has not been and is not a defensive, in your face midfielder. What he is, is a powerful, explosive, goal scoring midfielder who can score you goals from nothing in crucial games, he can dictate play and control a game. When we haven't got the ball he's not as effective, but when you're having 70% possession it's not too much of a problem.

Where I possibly would agree is that in the games against the Barca's, Bayern Munichs of the world where you're not going to dominate possession then these are the games where I would look to rest Yaya and maybe only bring him on towards the end of a game if you need a goal.

The reality is statistically he is our 3rd highest scorer, has the highest number of passes per game, the second highest passing accuracy and is the 3rd highest rated player overall behind Silva & Aguero - and that is THIS SEASON.

Why he should be one of our players to go is complete idiocy, frankly, I think most of it is simply people with an axe to grind. It's called cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Based on what we could get for him its simply not worth replacing him. What might change is that we use him less but his experience will be invaluable and what we end up with is a City legend. Instead fans simply want to get rid, basically on a fit of pique, complete madness.

So what you're saying is his defensive contribution has halved this season? And you wouldn't play him against the likes of Bayern, Barcelona etc. because you can't trust him if we haven't got possession?

But you want to keep him because he's a City legend................... you're living in the past pal. We need to progress and evolve, not stand still waiting for the inevitable decline.

Well in 2012/2013 his stats were 1.2 tackles per game interceptions 0.9, this season it's 1.1 & 0.5 he's never been a player to launch into tackles or quick enough over half a yard to intercept passes, nothings changed, yet according to you this represents some kind of massive decline.

I'm basing my opinion on what I am witnessing game in game out and funnily enough most of the stats back me up that he is still one of our most influential players, I do accept that he is not going to get any better, but you don't lose incredible footballing ability overnight. On following seasons we should use his tremendous experience and eventually in 2/3 years he will be used more sparingly and in that time we have had plenty of time to groom his ultimate successor.

Is it any wonder we don't have any ex City players/legends fighting our corner when we are so ready to discard them. And no, I'm not living in the past I'm very much in the here and now.

I see absolutely no benefit losing a talent like Yaya Toure for what in todays money is very little money when his contribution still puts him in the top three of our players. If we need money to bring in a Pogba we should be targeting other sales not Yaya.

I have a feeling it will be the salary more than the actual transfer fee, when it comes to Yaya. He's among the top 3 earners at City, maybe the highest (?) and for the way we supposedly intend to play, according to Sorriano, Yaya clearly doesn't fit the bill anymore.

 

[Marvin]

Re: Player topic: Yaya Toure (2014/15)

I can't believe that some fans think that Yaya can make those old lung busting runs but just chooses not to out of laziness

It's like accusing a regular guy of being lazy because he can't bench press 150kg. You have to do the work first. When you've done it, you can do these things but you have to put the work in first. He doesn't choose to turn it on and off like a tap.

Are you saying that he's not 'putting the work in' Marv ?

I'm struggling with Marv's analogy also..

If a bloke can bench 150kg but then chooses only to press 100 and call it a day.....then surely he isn't working to his maximum?

And where does his maximum come from? Preparation. I'm sure he'd love to be able to make those old trademark runs, but he doesn't have it in the tank now. Needs a proper pre-season

 

[pavelsrnicek]

Re: Player topic: Yaya Toure (2014/15)

Last summer what we really needed to do was move Yaya on. The birthday cake fiasco was an attempt to leave but without the ability, due to FFP, to bring in the right player he couldn't leave as we couldn't afford to replace him. He started the season slowly and hasn't sulked it's just he has been at 95% of his best. Not awful, definitely influential but the bursts are largely gone. Defensively he works less than ever and his tackling is lazy.

He may well have a stormer tomorrow but his City career is nearing the end.

 

[better dead than red]

Re: Player topic: Yaya Toure (2014/15)

Last summer what we really needed to do was move Yaya on. The birthday cake fiasco was an attempt to leave but without the ability, due to FFP, to bring in the right player he couldn't leave as we couldn't afford to replace him. He started the season slowly and hasn't sulked it's just he has been at 95% of his best. Not awful, definitely influential but the bursts are largely gone. Defensively he works less than ever and his tackling is lazy.

He may well have a stormer tomorrow but his City career is nearing the end.

You are being too generous. He is nowhere near "95% of his best."

He needs to be moved. Yes, he has contributed massively to City however, he is either past it or can't be arsed.

For those who say we can't move him because he is a City legend, Colin Bell is a City legend too. We aren't going to let him start week in and week out. And they are both not effective, that is why they shouldn't have Carte Blanche to start.

Yes. I am pissed up.

 

[fatbloke]

Re: Player topic: Yaya Toure (2014/15)

Well his stats in the champs league for the previous season when he was widely recognised as the best midfielder in the country read 1.4 & 0.9 David Silva was 0.5 & 0.8

Why the Champions league is the true measure of a players performance only you would know.

Juan Mata in the premier league reads 0.6 & 0.8 I guess they should f*ck him off ? No instead they hang a banner up for him reading the 'juan & only'

Your finding what you want to find, Yaya since he's been at City has not been and is not a defensive, in your face midfielder. What he is, is a powerful, explosive, goal scoring midfielder who can score you goals from nothing in crucial games, he can dictate play and control a game. When we haven't got the ball he's not as effective, but when you're having 70% possession it's not too much of a problem.

Where I possibly would agree is that in the games against the Barca's, Bayern Munichs of the world where you're not going to dominate possession then these are the games where I would look to rest Yaya and maybe only bring him on towards the end of a game if you need a goal.

The reality is statistically he is our 3rd highest scorer, has the highest number of passes per game, the second highest passing accuracy and is the 3rd highest rated player overall behind Silva & Aguero - and that is THIS SEASON.

Why he should be one of our players to go is complete idiocy, frankly, I think most of it is simply people with an axe to grind. It's called cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Based on what we could get for him its simply not worth replacing him. What might change is that we use him less but his experience will be invaluable and what we end up with is a City legend. Instead fans simply want to get rid, basically on a fit of pique, complete madness.

So what you're saying is his defensive contribution has halved this season? And you wouldn't play him against the likes of Bayern, Barcelona etc. because you can't trust him if we haven't got possession?

But you want to keep him because he's a City legend................... you're living in the past pal. We need to progress and evolve, not stand still waiting for the inevitable decline.

Well in 2012/2013 his stats were 1.2 tackles per game interceptions 0.9, this season it's 1.1 & 0.5 he's never been a player to launch into tackles or quick enough over half a yard to intercept passes, nothings changed, yet according to you this represents some kind of massive decline.

I'm basing my opinion on what I am witnessing game in game out and funnily enough most of the stats back me up that he is still one of our most influential players, I do accept that he is not going to get any better, but you don't lose incredible footballing ability overnight. On following seasons we should use his tremendous experience and eventually in 2/3 years he will be used more sparingly and in that time we have had plenty of time to groom his ultimate successor.

Is it any wonder we don't have any ex City players/legends fighting our corner when we are so ready to discard them. And no, I'm not living in the past I'm very much in the here and now.

I see absolutely no benefit losing a talent like Yaya Toure for what in todays money is very little money when his contribution still puts him in the top three of our players. If we need money to bring in a Pogba we should be targeting other sales not Yaya.

You quoted last years Champions League stats which show a significant (near 50%) decline this season, now suddenly because it doesn't suit your side of the discussion you change it to all competitions. Funny that.

To quote you "what he is, is a powerful, explosive, goal scoring midfielder who can score you goals from nothing in crucial games, he can dictate play and control a game" and yet you also say "in the games against the Barca's, Bayern Munichs of the world where you're not going to dominate possession then these are the games where I would look to rest Yaya". It doesn't make sense.

If he's our third most influential player and has the ability to do what you say he can why wouldn't you play him in the big games?
That's surely when we need our most influential players isn't it?
Why would you waste £200k a week (£10.4m a year) when we are restricted by FFP on someone who you don't trust to play in the big games?
What do you suggest we do for the next 2-3 years until you say Yaya will need replacing? Fernando? Zuculini? Evans?

I understand your sentiment but it seems to me like you're allowing your heart to rule your mind.

 

[mosssideblue]

Re: Player topic: Yaya Toure (2014/15)

Some people can nevel let go no matter how poorly a player is playing.

It's like that old pair of scruffy jeans that have served you for so long but you just don't have it in you to put them in the bin. And after someone has done that for you and you get a new pair, the world seems good again.

Yaya is past his sell by date and time is a commodity you cannot have back.

 

[SuperBlu]

Re: Player topic: Yaya Toure (2014/15)

Some people can nevel let go no matter how poorly a player is playing.

It's like that old pair of scruffy jeans that have served you for so long but you just don't have it in you to put them in the bin. And after someone has done that for you and you get a new pair, the world seems good again.

Yaya is past his sell by date and time is a commodity you cannot have back.

I agree, but the old jeans is still one of our best performers this season too according to the STATS.

 

[mosssideblue]

Re: Player topic: Yaya Toure (2014/15)

Some people can nevel let go no matter how poorly a player is playing.

It's like that old pair of scruffy jeans that have served you for so long but you just don't have it in you to put them in the bin. And after someone has done that for you and you get a new pair, the world seems good again.

Yaya is past his sell by date and time is a commodity you cannot have back.

I agree, but the old jeans is still one of our best performers this season too according to the STATS.

Stats only tell you what you want them to.

 

[SuperBlu]

Re: Player topic: Yaya Toure (2014/15)

Some people can nevel let go no matter how poorly a player is playing.

It's like that old pair of scruffy jeans that have served you for so long but you just don't have it in you to put them in the bin. And after someone has done that for you and you get a new pair, the world seems good again.

Yaya is past his sell by date and time is a commodity you cannot have back.

I agree, but the old jeans is still one of our best performers this season too according to the STATS.

Stats only tell you what you want them to.

Have a look

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.whoscored.com/Teams/167" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.whoscored.com/Teams/167</a>


He has the highest average pass per game 91 , the 2nd is Silva with 69 pass per game.

He is the 2nd best dribbler behind Aguero

The 3rd goal scorer