Players season ratings

JoeMercer'sWay said:
As proved by Liverpool's moneyball stat attempt at combining Downing/Carroll not only not winning them the league, but making them a discernibly poorer team and losing them a ton of money.
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There was a quote from Slurgie in the press the other day about statistics being absolute nonsense and he didn't pay any attention to them and he believes in scouting. If anyone comes across the article please post it in here.
 
I'll give it a go

GK-Hart-(8) Keeps us in games, makes the occasional mistake but his leadership and shot stopping ability more than make up for it. If Kompany goes this summer I'd like to see him be the new skipper.
Caballero-(6) Dreadful at times, but of course the league cup final was magnificent for Willy. Glad he will be remembered for the league cup performance rather than his other performances.

LB-Clichy-(6.5) Missed him early in the season, he was far more effective than kolarov. Should be part of the squad next season.
Kolarov-(3.5) Was ok at times the season, but was miserable most of the time. No desire, hopefully he gets sold asap.

CB-Kompany-(6) When he was playing, he did well enough. However, as much as it pains me to say it, his injuries are too much of a liability and I wouldn't be opposed to selling him this summer.
Otamendi-(6.5) Don't quite understand why so many people thought he was so poor this season. He made the occasional mistake, but at times dominated. Should be in the starting 11 for the next few seasons imo.
Mangala-(6) At times superb, at times lost. I love his desire, and still think he has a very bright future. I would be upset if he is sold so that someone like Stones could come in. Maybe he won't make it with pep, but he should at least be given a chance.
Demichelis-(3) Should have left last season. Not much else to say.

RB-Sagna-(6.5) Limited in attack, but he performed far better than I expected him to. I think his performance has earned him another season here.
Zabaleta-(5) Injuries ruined his season, and I don't think we'll ever see the old zabs ever again. Will be sad to see him go, but we should be open to any offers for him this summer.

MID-Yaya Toure-(5) Showed glimpses at times, but unfortunately he just sucked most of the time this season. Hopefully a Chinese club comes calling this summer.
Fernandinho-(8) My favorite player this season. Worked tirelessly all season long. Worried to see reports that pep doesn't like him, as any club would be lucky to have him.
Fernando-(6.5) Turned a bad season into a solid one with his performances in the past couple months. I thought for sure he would be gone this summer, but he may have earned another season at city.
Delph-(4.5) I think he could be ok if he wasn't always played out of position. Doesn't have the quality needed to make it here at city, but he's English so we'll probably keep him on for next season.
De Bruyne-(8.5) Has so much class. I am so excited to see what city can do if we have a healthy KDB all season long. Bright future for this one.
Nasri-(NR) Can't really assess his season, but he's worthy of a mention. Had the one superb game. Wouldn't be shocked to see him go, but I have a feeling he still has a couple good seasons in him if he can stay healthy.
Navas-(5) He is such a frustrating player. He does some things so well, but he just doesn't know how to kick a ball. Have a feeling pep will keep him, but if I were in charge I'd be desperately trying to sell him.
Sterling-(5.5) Showed glimpses, but he just stopped using his strengths, such as running at defenders. Have to assume he will continue to develop. I hope pep puts him on the right wing.
Silva-(5) Started the season out so well. He was probably the best player in the premier league for the first month. Then injuries ruined his season, and possibly his career. I would listen to offers for him this summer, but I would expect to see him here next season.

FWD-Aguero-(8) Scored a lot of goals again. Disappointing at times this season, but that may have been due to the failures of others around him (Navas). We are very fortunate to have him.
Bony-(3) Miserable.
Iheanacho-(6.5) Took his chances very well this season. Has such a bright future ahead of him. Get used to seeing him score goals in a city shirt, because there will be a lot of them over the next decade.
 
cleavers said:
In numerical order, where the mark is the same, I've listed them in order of how I think they've performed, so Sterling is nearer a 4, and Navas nearer a 6, if that makes sense.

Nasri -
Zaba -
^----------not rated due to injury
Bony 2
Kolarov 2
Otamendi 4
Demichelis 4
Sterling 5
Silva 5
Delph 5
Yaya 5
Caballero 5
Navas 5
^----------average or less (and I won't shed any tears over any of these leaving, expect Silva, but he needs to up his game considerably)
Clichy 6
Mangala 6
Aguero 7
Kompany 7
Fernando 7
Kelechi 7
Hart 7
De Bruyne 7
Sagna 8
Fernandinho 8

That we don't have 11 better than 'average' says it all, and for instance while I've rated Aguero 7, I actually think he's been pretty disappointing by his standards, which is why he's listed as the lowest 7.
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Don't agree with a 7 for Kompany. I know he has played well when fit but given the number of games he has missed this should be reflected in his rating. In the same way I think that a player like Navas needs to get some recognition for the amount of heavy lifting he has done even if the end product is usually missing so his 5 is possibly a tad harsh.
 
Neville Kneville said:
That's where stats are very useful, to show how many times a player does something. Also useful to show how far a player has run & what speed etc.

Other than that, no use at all. No info given there for the number of times DeBruyne went missing from his job. No detail on the real quality of anything, only the statistical value.

He technically got some 'tackles' in. So he gets a stat for it. How difficult were they ? Should he have got a lot more in ? Etc etc etc.

Stats are a guide to help judge a performance, nothing more. The main judgement depends on the difficulty involved & the nature of the job required.
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I don't disagree with you Neville.

Yep, stats are just a historic record of events and facts - how often, how many, how much, how far etc etc - and can be useful as indicators but, as you infer, without context they mean jack shit.
Then there is the world of analytics which tries to interpret the stats to predict future performance. That's another world entirely.
 
oliverz4 said:
Hart 7/10 Solid season from Hart as you'd expect, no bad patches of form so good season always reliable when called upon.

Willy 4/10 One great game against Liverpool, but every other time he has featured he has looked woeful.

zaba 4/10 Poor season from Zabas standards, looks like his age might be catching up with him, looks suspect when played.

sagna 7/10 Solid but unspectacular, does well defensively but doesn't offer much going forward, still good though.

demi 1/10 Season to forget, hasn't looked good when featured and should have kept Denayer instead.

otamendi 4/10 Has looked solid when beside Kompany, but when with Mangala or Demi he looks worse or as bad as the other, time will tell on this one.

mangala 2/10 Apart from maybe the odd game here and there looks really shaky and hasn't improved enough, should sell/loan out next year.

vinny 7/10 Can't argue with Kompanys performances when he's played, the stats say it all really, always better with him in the team than without.

clichy 6/10 Average year for Clichy, didn't feature much to begin with but has become better as the seasons gone on, better defender than Kolarov without a doubt.

Kolarov 2/10 Poor year from Kolarov really, has been missing his attacking/creative qualities that made him look so good in the past, and his defending has been woeful when played.

navas 1/10 Really bad year for Navas, how he has played so many games I will never know, doesn't even do anything! Doesn't have confidence, can't seem to score, poor end product, just keeps getting worse not better.

Fernando 6/10 Has improved in the last 6 months, began really slow always used to foul a lot when he first joined but has looked a lot more composed recently, can't attack for toffee mind but still he could prove to be a squad player under Guardiola, makes good tackles now and is aggressive but has gotten a lot better and sometimes you need a De Jong kind of CDM in the team.

Fernandinho 7/10 Solid year from Fernandinho, always reliable when called upon, has needed to step up when Yaya has been missing (which has been all too often this year especially) gives 100% every game.

yaya 2/10 Has played a lot more games than he should have done, doesn't look passionate to be wearing the City shirt anymore and doesn't do his amazing runs/long shots that we have all been used to in the previous seasons, either something is not right in his head, if he doesn't like Pellegrini or if he just doesn't want to play in this team, or if he is just past it, I don't know but he's really disappointing, lazy arsed player as well doesn't ever track better, struts around the pitch with that 'been there done that' attitude, occasionally plays a nice pass or shows glimpses of his past brilliance, what every 15 games? Well I don't know but he's useless now and has to be sold to clear up his undeserved wage and get someone who actually runs around at least!

nasri 5/10 Hard to judge, like Kompany really, I'll go first on the record and say I've never been a fan of Nasri ever since he joined us I've just thought he has underperformed a lot, but when he came in he actually offered something to the team, I was actually surprised that he was so much better than Sterling and Navas, alas it was short lived though and you have to question if someone this injury prone can stay, like Toure another high wage.

silva 4/10 One of Silvas seasons to forget, like Zaba his wage may just be catching up on him, and the emergence of KDB as that playmaker may even question his future here, problem with Silva is when he's playing well, even in the past he's been like this, you wouldn't have anyone else in the world, but he goes on runs of form where he'll just disappear without a trace, and he has done for most of this season just gone, wages again, could sign someone like an Isco to replace him.

sterling 3/10 It sure doesn't help when you're sitting there looking a HUGE 49 million transfer fee that we were foolishly made to pay by Liverpool, but still he has not been good, he looks like a player out of his comfort zone which I find strange for a home grown player as you'd think they'd just fit in straight away (De Bruyne has and he's from Belgium!!!!!!!) and he looks like a very limited player, pace is clearly the only thing he really excels at which is not enough for that price, he has no shot on him, dribbling average, touch a bit poor, and he's not really a creative player, I mean if this was another season I might have mistaken him for Navas, but I hope Pep comes in and helps him find some form and hopefully turns him into a different player, I guess time will tell, like Otamendi.

Delph 3/10 Average player, only really bought to strengthen up the english players quota, and you could argue that we should have kept Milner instead (nothing special but can play both wings, especially a lot better than I've seen Delph play wings) and again he's injury prone, which is worrying for a new player, I don't know what Pep will see in this guy, might just get rid of him.

kdb 9/10 Him and Aguero definitely the best players of our season, De Bruyne (and Aguero for that matter!) is the kind of player you could build a team around for years to come, technically one of the best players in the world you could argue, has such a good shot and even running with the ball looks deadly, only shame for me is obviously he got that bad injury against Everton in the league cup, and he has been played as a winger out of position on the left as Sterling has been useless, but still he has been amazing and none of that is his fault, if there's one thing to salvage from this season it will be him.

nacho 8/10 Great debut season from Nacho, how he has not played more times over Bony really baffles me, and his goal to games ratio is great, if he keeps improving the way he is, we could have a real player on our hands in about 5 years time like we do with Aguero now, really composed in front of goal as well for his age, and if Pep sees that he may choose to build a team around him, stranger things have happened.

aguero 9/10 Great season as ever from Aguero, only issue I have with the way City have played for the last 2 seasons now is that they seem to rely upon him because everyone else is so damn useless, but not his fault, we do need 1/2 more strikers like we used to have in Mancinis teams, but again like Nacho is goal to games ratio speaks for itself, and is always capable of the unexpected which is definitely a good thing.

bony 1/10 Useless, has not tried, looks like a bodybuilder, struts around the pitch like Yaya, if he does score he waits for someone to play it right on his foot (which is not the way city play thank you very much we are not Swansea City!) and even then he has just gotten worse, slow lazy player which is disappointing, makes you wonder why we sold Dzeko, Negredo, and even Jovetic just to replace them with this guy who is 10 times worse, I think he will go either permanently in the summer or out on loan somewhere,

Sorry for the lengthy opinions! Got a bit carried away with some of them as you might expect after the season we've just had!
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Astonished that you give Navas only a score of 1. He lacks end product but his work rate alone deserves a score of 5 or 6. If we had more players putting in the effort he does we would be in a much stronger position.
 
Hart 6
Caballero 5
Zabaleta 5
Sagna 7
Kompany 4
Mangala 5
Otamendi 5
Demichelis 3
Kolarov 4
Clichy 6
Delph 4
Fernando 6
Fernandinho 8
Yaya Toure 6
Nasri 4
Navas 6
Sterling 5
De Bruyne 8
Silva 7
Aguero 8
Iheanacho 7
Bony 4
 
Shaelumstash said:
Mate are you a mathematician? Seriously, I'm not having a go, but you seem completely blinded by statistics to the point of obsession and I think it's clouding your ability to judge a football match by watching it with your own eyes.

The DeBruyne thread is a good example of what I'm talking about. As opposed to discussing the point that our best form came in our first 5 games, you obsessed over the fact that DeBruyne played 70 minutes in one of those games as if it somehow made my point completely irrelevant and flawed. This isn't a mathematical paper where one wrong statistic will mean you fail your exam, we're just chatting about football.

DeBruyne did play for those 70 minutes, I admitted I got that wrong and held my hands up. But my point remains that our best form this season came at the start of the season before DeBruyne had signed. You think the fact I missed out on those 70 minutes completely invalidates my argument. If it was a statistical analysis paper I could totally understand why I'd get marked down, but again, I don't mean to sound mean, but you come across like Sheldon off The Big Bang Theory when you obsess over a small mistake on statistics. Look at the wider point, not just the minute detail.

Again your point about the "100 incremental points between 9 and 10" you're turning this in to an academic paper, it's the wrong forum (pun intended) for that. Essentially DeBruyne got scored at over 93% for his performance on Sunday by that algorithm. As you say, 100 is the maximum score. So in simple terms DeBruyne's performance was only 7% away from being the highest possible score he could achieve. There is not a football man on earth, not De Bruyne himself or his own mother that would argue that to be accurate. It's completely flawed.

The statistics or the algorithm is not an accurate representation of performance. It is simply an accurate representation of the data that has been mined.

It's like when you see these articles in the paper every few months about some researchers at MIT that have found the perfect algorithm for the funniest joke. The joke it produces usually isn't very funny. Because you see, some things can't be explained by mathematics. Humour, art, football, there is no algorithm to explain them. I know that's probably very difficulty to accept as mathematician, you learn that everything can be explained through numbers and data, but it can't. There is no algorithm for Michelangelo's architecture, Jimi Hendrix's guitar playing, Eddie Murphy's comedy timing, Jennifer Lopez's bum, David Silva's vision, why a babies laugh makes you smile, they're just all beautiful and you have to accept that beauty can't always be explained by maths or science.

Honestly, I couldn't give a fuck who was the "stat Man of the match". The "attempted tackles" stat as an example, it's completely irrelevant. If you look at the stats of which defenders attempted the most tackles, it's often no indication whatsoever of how good they are. Rio Ferdinand used to score terribly on "attempted tackles" because he didn't have to tackle players because he read the game so well that he'd intercept the ball before it even had chance to become a tackle. You'll then argue to me well look at the interceptions stat then. But that only tells you half the story too. If a player in possession sees his mate marked by Ferdinand, he'll think twice about giving him the ball because he knows how good he is, how he's already anticipating the pass.

The stats will only ever get you so far in football.
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My contribution in the KDB thread was minimal - 1 short post only if IIRC. Your response to my post (and other posters who picked up on the BS facts behind your opinion) bordered on War and Peace. A bit like now actually.
 
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