Political relations between UK-EU

[mcfc1632]

Well I’ll take your word for that and you’d represent that compassionate side of yours more if you restrained yourself from belittling posts that suggest there are some short term losers from Brexit

I was genuinely not intending to do that

Just drawing the distinction between those incidents and the apocalypse that some insisted would happen

Can you accept that it has not?

No other Remainers have that I have spotted

Would it not be fair for Leavers to expect that some would?

 

[journolud]

I was genuinely not intending to do that

Just draw the distinction between those incidents and the apocalypse that some insisted would happen

Can you accept that it has not?

No other Remainers have that I have spotted

Would it not be fair for Leavers to expect that some would?

Yes I’d accept that on a large scale the apocalypse has not happened... yet. And I never expected an earthquake the day after Brexit. However several people have been affected by tremors and the jury will be out for a while on how successful Brexit is for the country. The evidence against seems to be mounting, albeit on a small scale and of course I know you look to the longer term. I guess the question is how long do we give it before we start to doubt that sentiment?

 

[west didsblue]

Seems there’s a new narrative amongst the Brexit fans that they were told by Remainers that Brexit would cause an immediate apocalypse and would be catastrophic. The reality was that this was stated about No Deal. With a deal most sensible people just reckoned it would be a bit crap and not immediately noticeable day to day. Seems the reality is that it’s actually worse than a bit crap for many but most haven’t noticed yet.

 

[PannickAtTheDisco]

Being Pro-Brexit has taken a fair few people down various RW rabbit holes. A good number of the people you would most associate with being Pro-Brexit happen to be on the right of politics and a person who is Pro-Brexit could quite conceivably have looked for evidence to back up their reasoning from various websites that unbeknown to them lead them down the rabbit holes. They become part of the Pro-Brexit team. Some of the leaders of the Pro-Brexit team know this and it gives them a captive audience to spread further propaganda. A person who starts out thinking Pro-Brexit is a reasonable political position is also subjected to what the Pro-Brexit leaders believe in, be it climate change denial, anti-vax, QAnon, etc They are also fed a diet of propaganda stating that being Pro-Brexit makes them a Patriot so they look to identify with other Patriots, that leads them to the MAGA stuff and the American Patriots. Hence on twitter you see a proliferation of flags . Human beings like to be part of a collective identity, me and you do it with City for example. That is part of our collective identity and as a result we will tend to see all things from very much a Blue perspective.




Good post Rasc. In summary then, it’s because all anti-vaccers are idiots and most idiots are pro-Brexit.

dunno what the hell you were attempting with that quoting.

 

[Didsbury Dave]

dunno what the hell you were attempting with that quoting.

Yeah, got in a bit of a mess there, sorry!

 

[mcfc1632]

Yes I’d accept that on a large scale the apocalypse has not happened... yet. And I never expected an earthquake the day after Brexit. However several people have been affected by tremors and the jury will be out for a while on how successful Brexit is for the country. The evidence against seems to be mounting, albeit on a small scale and of course I know you look to the longer term. I guess the question is how long do we give it before we start to doubt that sentiment?

There are people on this thread that have experience in managing major transformation programmes

Let's just say that - how Brexit has been done does not reflect 'best practice'

I have said on many occasions that the UK should have been managing Brexit as a major change programme since 2016. I have also said many times that Leave supporters have a lot more reason to be unhappy with the UK government than Remainers - May/Hammond wasted years refusing to sanction/commence/fund the planning and preparation for the UK to Leave the EU - they bear a lot of the responsibility for any lack of preparedness

Rank amateurish management by the UK government for 4 years

 

[bluethrunthru]

The evidence against seems to be mounting, albeit on a small scale

In the first week that seems to be affecting the fishing industry - predictable really because fresh fish sold abroad has to be moved fast and all the customs hold ups etc are not amenable to that.

After being warned of this impact on their totem I expect that by week 2 Leavers will resort to the other thing they were told " its only a small issue as fishing is such a small part of our economy" with not one jot of irony in the statement.

This will be the impact of the changes in the relationship with the EU sticking to what they said they would do from the outset.

 

[BobKowalski]

There are people on this thread that have experience in managing major transformation programmes

Let's just say that - how Brexit has been done does not reflect 'best practice'

I have said on many occasions that the UK should have been managing Brexit as a major change programme since 2016. I have also said many times that Leave supporters have a lot more reason to be unhappy with the UK government than Remainers - May/Hammond wasted years refusing to sanction/commence/fund the planning and preparation for the UK to Leave the EU - they bear a lot of the responsibility for any lack of preparedness

Rank amateurish management by the UK government for 4 years

That because Brexit was trapped by its own rhetoric. There was no need to ‘sanction/commence/fund the planning and preparation for the UK to Leave the EU’, as we would be getting the same deal we had now or even better.

Then when it started going pear shaped, we stubbornly clung to the idea we could ‘have our cake and eat it‘ because they sold stuff to us and ‘German car makers’.

Finally, we also believed that the EU would back down at the last minute and give us everything we wanted thereby making any planning and preparation redundant. Steely British resolve and all that.

In the end we caved on the outstanding issues and we are left pretending that there is no Irish Sea border (there is), and there would be no form filling or checks (there are) and that the deal meant, to quote Johnson, ‘there are no non tariff barriers’, which was a lie as there is now a web of administration, rules and regulations, the extent of which is slowly dawning on UK industry.

The problem with selling something with lies is that you can never come clean on the truth or prepare for the reality.

 

[Vic]

Hey - I just posted an article from the Washington Times

Exactly. Made no difference to you who wrote it. I checked.

 

[Vic]

Proof - more fish - 7 days in and the fishing industry finds out that what they were promised and what they have got are polar opposites - suits Johnson though as this will be handy when he needs a diversion to claim the EU post Brexit aren't sticking to the "spirit" of the rules when in fact they are just sticking to the rules as was pointed out all along

Scottish seafood exports 'held up by post-Brexit rules'

The Scottish Seafood Association says the delays are caused by "entire trailers" having to be checked rather than samples.

www.bbc.co.uk

Cornish fishing boats 'gathering dust' as EU shellfish exports halt

Shellfish exports to the EU have stopped, leaving tanks empty and boats "gathering dust" in port.

www.bbc.co.uk

The BBC 2 series Cornwall, A Fishing Life is very educational. Tonight's had them catching crabs for export to Spain and others pointing out that the price of holiday coastal homes mean they have to live well inland, a long drive to keep an eye on their boat.

And perhaps the bloviating poster who wouldn't discuss fish can admit he knows nothing about the industry.