Public enquiry into Manchester bombing

Blue Maverick said:
Absolutely agree although we aren’t trained to the high standard of paramedics many of us are trauma technicians who they were screaming for they know we can do a bit more than stretcher bearing, would we have saved anyone, who knows but what I do know is would have done everything we possibly could.
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I wasn't meaning to be dismissive. My daughter says they often get back-up from fire crews for cardiac arrests, where every pair of hands counts.
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
I wasn't meaning to be dismissive. My daughter says they often get back-up from fire crews for cardiac arrests, where every pair of hands counts.
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I didn’t take it that way mate, and unfortunately we don’t do cardiac arrests anymore with the paramedics they stopped in September
 
Having heard some of the reports on Radio 4 about six o'clock they weren't making it clear the firemen were prevented from assisting. It was clear in earlier reports which tallied with Blue Maverick's accounts from the days after the incident.
 
pride in battle said:
Bit simplistic that mate, huge errors were made, how many times can we say, oh well lessons learned, the chief of the fire service basically did a runner after the events.
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pride in battle said:
Bit simplistic that mate, huge errors were made, how many times can we say, oh well lessons learned, the chief of the fire service basically did a runner after the events.
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Your response is the over simplistic .............yes the fire service had shortcomings but I'll ask you how can we prepare to cover EVERY eventuality in EVERY event be it a natural disaster a terror attack or major disaster such as a fire and have a 100% sound response every time? Are you prepared to state now that can be trained for and done?
 
Blue Maverick said:
What has come from this is a one size fits all is not fit for purpose but more importantly to me is they should look at the people making decisions, many are pen pushers who get to that rank because they are pen pushers and not common sense decision makers, sadly in this day and age to get on it seems they’d rather have someone who follows blindly a piece of paper rather than someone who can think for themselves, which in certain jobs is ok but not in emergency services.
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Then when firefighters, paramedics and police officers rush in and are caught in a secondary blast or get in each others way because its total chaos and nobody is following a "pen pushers" planned response what then? There has to be planning and strategy - anarchy is not the way
 
brass neck said:
I've not followed this today. Has there been any mention of the actual criminal investigation. Has the whole Mi6 connection come up? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4546934/PETER-OBORNE-MI6-share-blame-jihadis.html
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There was a lot of interesting stuff posted during the aftermath of the bomb about “blowback”, and how the scum (who did it) and his family were allowed to travel to Libya and subsequently return to the UK “no questions asked”, obviously the British authorities saw him/his family and others like him going to Libya and returning here as less important than toppling Gaddafi (his family opposed Gaddafi’s rule - hence them ending up here as asylum seekers).
Not a lot has been said since.
 
I have often wondered why the scum didn’t like us here?
We gave his family asylum when they were fleeing Libya by way of Saudi Arabia and we played a huge part in toppling his family’s main enemy.
You’d think he’d be happy for two significant interventions from the British government. You’d think he and his family owed our government a debt of gratitude for intervening, twice. Instead he did what he did? It doesn’t make sense!
 
bluethrunthru said:
Your response is the over simplistic .............yes the fire service had shortcomings but I'll ask you how can we prepare to cover EVERY eventuality in EVERY event be it a natural disaster a terror attack or major disaster such as a fire and have a 100% sound response every time? Are you prepared to state now that can be trained for and done?
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I think ignoring his posts is the best way forward. He's said some provoking things without substance and follows them up with more controversial and unsubstantiated posts. He adds nothing and responding to him makes him relevant, which he isn't.
 
bluethrunthru said:
Then when firefighters, paramedics and police officers rush in and are caught in a secondary blast or get in each others way because its total chaos and nobody is following a "pen pushers" planned response what then? There has to be planning and strategy - anarchy is not the way
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I’m not advocating that but what I am saying is that in the fire service they are more concerned with if you’ve followed procedures than actually doing the job in hand believe me it happens day in and day out, this time it’s come back to bite them in the arse and rightly so. Things like this are fluid and procedures are fine to a point but then you have to rely your instincts and common sense, fortunately there was a police officer on the ground who did this or more could have died.
 
bluethrunthru said:
Your response is the over simplistic .............yes the fire service had shortcomings but I'll ask you how can we prepare to cover EVERY eventuality in EVERY event be it a natural disaster a terror attack or major disaster such as a fire and have a 100% sound response every time? Are you prepared to state now that can be trained for and done?
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We only need to ask Auntie Beeb, or any of the MPs, or councillors who came on. They had all the answers we'd ever need. Oh, wait a mo, weren't they jabbering about 'learning lessons' again. Ah, well, scrub that first sentence!
 
Blue Maverick said:
What has come from this is a one size fits all is not fit for purpose but more importantly to me is they should look at the people making decisions, many are pen pushers who get to that rank because they are pen pushers and not common sense decision makers, sadly in this day and age to get on it seems they’d rather have someone who follows blindly a piece of paper rather than someone who can think for themselves, which in certain jobs is ok but not in emergency services.
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We all felt for the fire service at the time and were grateful for your explanation of the reasons.

Unfortunately the Fire Service suffers in much the same way as most public services these days in the way your post describes. Even the House of C. has managed to fill itself with former apprentices from local authorities who have now graduated to MP's.
Now no need for whips because most of them have no idea which way to vote anyway and have to be told.

We are governed by people from a narrow cross section of society and it seems our public services suffer in much the same way, commen sense being a very low priority so that it is no longer commen and certenly not sense on many occasions.
 
SilverFox2 said:
We all felt for the fire service at the time and were grateful for your explanation of the reasons.

Unfortunately the Fire Service suffers in much the same way as most public services these days in the way your post describes. Even the House of C. has managed to fill itself with former apprentices from local authorities who have now graduated to MP's.
Now no need for whips to correct those with a brain because most of them have no idea which way to vote anyway and have to be told.

We are governed by people from a narrow cross section of society and it seems our public services suffer in much the same way, commen sense being a very low priority so that it is no longer commen and certenly not sense on many occasions.
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Anyone think the response would have been different if it was Wembley arena?

The reporting comes across as northern bashing. Manchester doesn’t have the money or the resources our capital has. High pressure situations, decisions are made rightly or wrongly. Scapegoating in this case doesn’t help anyone apart from opportunist parasites wanting to profit from tragedy.
 
mat said:
Anyone think the response would have been different if it was Wembley arena?

The reporting comes across as northern bashing. Manchester doesn’t have the money or the resources our capital has. High pressure situations, decisions are made rightly or wrongly. Scapegoating in this case doesn’t help anyone apart from opportunist parasites wanting to profit from tragedy.
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Hopefully we will never know, but LFB turned out to all the terror incidents last year and at the same time as the other blue light services. I’ve read the report and it doesn’t tell me anything we didn’t know last year, there are a lot of people in positions they clearly should not be in, some have left I expect more to follow. I haven’t seen anything about northern bashing completely the opposite tbf, resources didn’t have anything to do with it, just how they were used.
 
Manchester police didn't know the Ariana Grande concert was taking place on the night of the arena bombing as transport police were responsible for the venue, the inquiry has heard.

He told the hearing that Greater Manchester Police (GMP) "did not know on an organisational level about the Ariana Grande concert and had not made any provision or plan for the concert that night"

news.sky.com

Manchester bombing: Police unaware Ariana Grande concert was taking place on night of attack, inquiry hears

The inquiry opened with the issues surrounding the emergency response to the arena bombing.
news.sky.com news.sky.com
 
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