Restoring the Death Penalty in Britain

[Halfpenny]

I see the loony left has taken over again.

Of course we have to kill to prove that killing is wrong!

I'd have a thousand innocent people killed, just for one psycho being put to a stop!

Just look at the stats from countries with the death penalty, countries like the USA, Saudi Arabia and North Korea, it obviously acts as a deterrent there, and gives the people peace of mind in their free and open societies! Hell, lets follow Irans example and execute juvenile offenders on the street, that'll stop them hoodies!

Oh come on, it's not a deterrent. Look at how many mass shootings they have in the USA compared to here. We've basically had two/three in the last 20 years, Dunblane, Derrick Bird and Raoul Moat (does that count?). And two of those killed themselves. There have been dozens in the US since then. Coupled with lax gun legislation it doesn't seem to act as much of a deterrent. It's not a 'loony left' idea to be against the death penalty, and it's ridiculous that you seek to put it down as such.

An eye for an eye is absolutely not the way to go, and I am completely against the death penalty being reinstated.

Well, it was a sarcastic post, but yeah, it does look pretty genuine.

DAMN! I forgot to mention do-gooders. I've failed...

Yeah, fooled me. I'd usually spot it a mile off but I'm too tired to spot it right now and I feel pretty strongly about this subject so I led myself into that one.

 

[Ancient Citizen]

Ah the Death Penalty question.

The last bastion of those who try to find an excuse to make themselves "better" than a certain class of people.

Put short, you want to kill people. Everything else in this argument is entirely irrelevant. You want to kill another person, and in my mind, that loses you an ability to have a rational discussion, because you're acting out of hatred rather than logic.

Pro death penalty people disgust me in the worst possible way, because they believe that they have the right to decide why somebody's life should be ended. They are also the same people who dig in at places like Saudi Arabia as savages then try their best to get our system to emulate it.

Interesting. Soldiers also want to 'Kill people,' are they acting out of hatred? My father knew for certain he killed 2 Germans in 1944, he was on his own and made the decision himself. The state trained him and encouraged him to take as many lives as possible, but he hated himself afterwards. I know we are discussing State execution here but you are indicating that anybody who opposes your view should be dismissed entirely as irrational as they must be acting purely on hatred.This is not the case for millions of pro death penalty supporters, and rational decisions are not exclusive to people who are against.
My personal belief is that civilised countries should not employ it, but there is an awful lot of pertinent argument for.
Live and let live.

(Could'nt resist that.)

Idiocy in the extreme. Most soldiers do NOT "want" to kill people and those that do, often want to for the reasons of hatred and revenge so that example is ridiculous in the extreme. There is a difference between having to kill in war to stay alive and wanting to kill.

You have completely missed the point, so the idiocy analogy may have found a new recipient. The point being made, at the risk of being repetitive, is that pro hanging supporters are not necessarily motivated by hatred. The soldier in question killed when in no danger at all; he was not threatened, his victims were pissed up young lads who strayed into the wrong place. He killed them because that was what he had been trained to do.
I was merely pointing out opposing views can not just be discounted purely and simply as 'Hatred'.

 

[SWP's back]

Interesting. Soldiers also want to 'Kill people,' are they acting out of hatred? My father knew for certain he killed 2 Germans in 1944, he was on his own and made the decision himself. The state trained him and encouraged him to take as many lives as possible, but he hated himself afterwards. I know we are discussing State execution here but you are indicating that anybody who opposes your view should be dismissed entirely as irrational as they must be acting purely on hatred.This is not the case for millions of pro death penalty supporters, and rational decisions are not exclusive to people who are against.
My personal belief is that civilised countries should not employ it, but there is an awful lot of pertinent argument for.
Live and let live.

(Could'nt resist that.)

Idiocy in the extreme. Most soldiers do NOT "want" to kill people and those that do, often want to for the reasons of hatred and revenge so that example is ridiculous in the extreme. There is a difference between having to kill in war to stay alive and wanting to kill.

You have completely missed the point, so the idiocy analogy may have found a new recipient. The point being made, at the risk of being repetitive, is that pro hanging supporters are not necessarily motivated by hatred. The soldier in question killed when in no danger at all; he was not threatened, his victims were pissed up young lads who strayed into the wrong place. He killed them because that was what he had been trained to do.
I was merely pointing out opposing views can not just be discounted purely and simply as 'Hatred'.

If you cannot see the difference between the necessity of killing during a world war and bringing back the death penalty then I have no hope.

You also said that soldiers "want" to kill when most don't though those that do, usually want to through hate.

 

[Ancient Citizen]

Idiocy in the extreme. Most soldiers do NOT "want" to kill people and those that do, often want to for the reasons of hatred and revenge so that example is ridiculous in the extreme. There is a difference between having to kill in war to stay alive and wanting to kill.

You have completely missed the point, so the idiocy analogy may have found a new recipient. The point being made, at the risk of being repetitive, is that pro hanging supporters are not necessarily motivated by hatred. The soldier in question killed when in no danger at all; he was not threatened, his victims were pissed up young lads who strayed into the wrong place. He killed them because that was what he had been trained to do.
I was merely pointing out opposing views can not just be discounted purely and simply as 'Hatred'.

If you cannot see the difference between the necessity of killing during a world war and bringing back the death penalty then I have no hope.

You also said that soldiers "want" to kill when most don't though those that do, usually want to through hate.

If you cannot see that not everybody is motivated by hate, then I agree there is no hope.

 

[SWP's back]

You have completely missed the point, so the idiocy analogy may have found a new recipient. The point being made, at the risk of being repetitive, is that pro hanging supporters are not necessarily motivated by hatred. The soldier in question killed when in no danger at all; he was not threatened, his victims were pissed up young lads who strayed into the wrong place. He killed them because that was what he had been trained to do.
I was merely pointing out opposing views can not just be discounted purely and simply as 'Hatred'.

If you cannot see the difference between the necessity of killing during a world war and bringing back the death penalty then I have no hope.

You also said that soldiers "want" to kill when most don't though those that do, usually want to through hate.

If you cannot see that not everybody is motivated by hate, then I agree there is no hope.

So what motivates someone to want the death penalty?

 

[scowy68]

Not even worth a debate.This will never happen again.

 

[Damocles]

Ah the Death Penalty question.

The last bastion of those who try to find an excuse to make themselves "better" than a certain class of people.

Put short, you want to kill people. Everything else in this argument is entirely irrelevant. You want to kill another person, and in my mind, that loses you an ability to have a rational discussion, because you're acting out of hatred rather than logic.

Pro death penalty people disgust me in the worst possible way, because they believe that they have the right to decide why somebody's life should be ended. They are also the same people who dig in at places like Saudi Arabia as savages then try their best to get our system to emulate it.

Interesting. Soldiers also want to 'Kill people,' are they acting out of hatred? My father knew for certain he killed 2 Germans in 1944, he was on his own and made the decision himself. The state trained him and encouraged him to take as many lives as possible, but he hated himself afterwards. I know we are discussing State execution here but you are indicating that anybody who opposes your view should be dismissed entirely as irrational as they must be acting purely on hatred.This is not the case for millions of pro death penalty supporters, and rational decisions are not exclusive to people who are against.
My personal belief is that civilised countries should not employ it, but there is an awful lot of pertinent argument for.
Live and let live.

(Could'nt resist that.)

Idiocy in the extreme. Most soldiers do NOT "want" to kill people and those that do, often want to for the reasons of hatred and revenge so that example is ridiculous in the extreme. There is a difference between having to kill in war to stay alive and wanting to kill.

I accept that.

Now tell me why soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan are killing people to stay alive. This is where your argument falls down.

Back on topic, this is a very simple issue. Those who want the death penalty want to bring it back because of fear. They are scared of criminals. It's no different from any of the isms that you want to throw out; people always want to kill those that they are scared of.

 

[ali benarbia's studs]

only for roma s ,pikey s and gary glitter.

 

[SWP's back]

Interesting. Soldiers also want to 'Kill people,' are they acting out of hatred? My father knew for certain he killed 2 Germans in 1944, he was on his own and made the decision himself. The state trained him and encouraged him to take as many lives as possible, but he hated himself afterwards. I know we are discussing State execution here but you are indicating that anybody who opposes your view should be dismissed entirely as irrational as they must be acting purely on hatred.This is not the case for millions of pro death penalty supporters, and rational decisions are not exclusive to people who are against.
My personal belief is that civilised countries should not employ it, but there is an awful lot of pertinent argument for.
Live and let live.

(Could'nt resist that.)

Idiocy in the extreme. Most soldiers do NOT "want" to kill people and those that do, often want to for the reasons of hatred and revenge so that example is ridiculous in the extreme. There is a difference between having to kill in war to stay alive and wanting to kill.

I accept that.

Now tell me why soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan are killing people to stay alive. This is where your argument falls down.

Back on topic, this is a very simple issue. Those who want the death penalty want to bring it back because of fear. They are scared of criminals. It's no different from any of the isms that you want to throw out; people always want to kill those that they are scared of.

No it doesn't fall down Damocles. They are sent there and have no say in that. They can't opt out and once they are there, live in the field, they have to kill to stay alive. Have you watched nothing of the firefights taking place in Afghan?

I am not saying it is right that they are sent there. I am saying that they are often forced to kill once they get there. Do not confuse the politics of us being there with the reality on the ground for the lads that are.

 

[Ancient Citizen]

Interesting. Soldiers also want to 'Kill people,' are they acting out of hatred? My father knew for certain he killed 2 Germans in 1944, he was on his own and made the decision himself. The state trained him and encouraged him to take as many lives as possible, but he hated himself afterwards. I know we are discussing State execution here but you are indicating that anybody who opposes your view should be dismissed entirely as irrational as they must be acting purely on hatred.This is not the case for millions of pro death penalty supporters, and rational decisions are not exclusive to people who are against.
My personal belief is that civilised countries should not employ it, but there is an awful lot of pertinent argument for.
Live and let live.

(Could'nt resist that.)

Idiocy in the extreme. Most soldiers do NOT "want" to kill people and those that do, often want to for the reasons of hatred and revenge so that example is ridiculous in the extreme. There is a difference between having to kill in war to stay alive and wanting to kill.

I accept that.

Now tell me why soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan are killing people to stay alive. This is where your argument falls down.

Back on topic, this is a very simple issue. Those who want the death penalty want to bring it back because of fear. They are scared of criminals. It's no different from any of the isms that you want to throw out; people always want to kill those that they are scared of.

Fear is indeed one of the reasons; fear and hatred are bedfellows. However, I will reiterate, it is not the only reason. Some people with strong religious views ( of whatever persuasion ) demand an eye for an eye. This is not motivated by hatred as many of these folk are gentle in the extreme and merely view it, rightly or wrongly as the punishment decreed by God, many muslims demand the death penalty, as do many christians and are by no means swivel eyed lunatics driven by hatred. So no, it is not all fear/hate or whatever.