Russian invasion of Ukraine

[cleavers]

I disagree about Tanks and Armoured Vehicles - The Trophy system is being updated to take out drones as well as AT missiles so as at every conflict since 1973 I think the death of the tank is well over stated.

It's not just that either, for every new technology, another new one will come along to beat it, that's generally how wars work, out of necessity things develop.

This conflict is a mix of modern tech versus archaic (and often poorly built) tech/tactics.

russia didn't win it's 3 day war, because they used WW1 tactics at a bad time of year (mix of frozen and mud), so had to use roads, where they were effectively picked off by relatively small numbers, and eventually they had to retreat to prevent losing stupid amounts of weapons and people. It was a very ill thought out invasion, so now they basically have what they started with, plus a bit extra, near to what they started with.

On the other side, with more modern western tactics, taught by NATO defence schools, and better tech, Ukraine have been able to hold them up sufficently, that glide bombs (old tech really) is the only way russia can terrorise Ukraine away from the front line, by attacking civilians and infrastructure pretty inefficently, they still can't fly their jets anywhere near the frontline, but neither can Ukraine (apart from unmanned).

Meanwhile Ukraine, benefitting from western tech, has started to develop their own decent tech (from drones to missiles), that can attack thousands of km behind the rusiian border, but it's also pretty inefficent in reality.

 

[fulabeer]

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

This isn’t a done deal. Not quite.

Yes the landscape has hugely changed, but so it’s changed in relation to Russia since Trump was ousted. I don’t think he’ll want the world to think Putin has profited from his truculence on his own watch. Not when Putin has been so weakened by his own conflict.

Hopefully the golden showers thing is bollocks!

And if he doesn’t, then we, as the rest of NATO, have to pick up the slack.

 

[Blue Maverick]

Would Ukraine be willing to exchange some land for NATO membership? So they give up Kursk and say Crimea, Putin wouldn’t know what to do.

 

[Blue Maverick]

And, to repeat, you seem to fundamentally misunderstand MAGA.

MAGA is isonationalist. Parochial. Myopic. Beyond the borders of US-Canada and US-Mexico, they don't give a fuck what happens.

Bush did that and look a how that turned out

 

[Blue Maverick]

I guess a lot of people in the US will be surprised that even if the US drops out of NATO it wont reduce the US's military spend. it will probably increase it. It certainly wont change the military doctrine that the US has of wanting to be able to take on the rest of the world combined and win.

What would happen with the UK nukes don’t we need their permission to fire them?

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

Would Ukraine be willing to exchange some land for NATO membership? So they give up Kursk and say Crimea, Putin wouldn’t know what to do.

The only way any deal can sustain is if whatever is left of Ukraine is part of NATO, or a de facto member.

That the only way to effectively contain Russia going forward.

 

[KS55]

The only way any deal can sustain is if whatever is left of Ukraine is part of NATO, or a de facto member.

That the only way to effectively contain Russia going forward.

Putin won’t abide by any treaty and will use any newly acquired territory to launch a new invasion. If he has the resources, that is , which is doubtful.

 

[uwerosler28]

Looking at the current gains Ukraine would have to give up Donbas and Donesk , cant see them agreeing to that.

 

[Blue and true]

Would Ukraine be willing to exchange some land for NATO membership? So they give up Kursk and say Crimea, Putin wouldn’t know what to do.

Why the fuck should they have to give up any of their land to a tyrant?