Russian invasion of Ukraine

From this side of the pond, all I've seen (approx) is Trump arse lickers disputing what's happening in Ukraine and cheering Putin on for being a tough guy against terrorists...
I go onto Fox News from time to time just to see what the Right thinks - and there's a fair amount of pushback in the comments on various articles against pro-Russian commentary. Even Trump has backtracked (somewhat) from his "genius" remark about Putin.
 
What the fuck has it got to do with Russia that NATO expands? Do you ever hear Sweden, Finland, Switzerland, or Austria saying they “will not accept” more countries wanting to join NATO?

early 00s, the USA and UK were trying to forge friendly ties with Putin and were even discussing the possibility of Russia joining NATO themselves at one point.

Have you read the link to the open door declaration for Georgia and Ukraine from that article?

It says, “At the Bucharest Summit, NATO Allies welcomed Ukraine's and Georgia's Euro-Atlantic aspirations for membership and agreed that these countries will become members of NATO... Allies made clear that they support Georgia's and Ukraine's applications for MAP [Membership Action Plan]”

Georgia and Ukraine applied to join NATO. NATO have not been meddling in their elections, putting NATO puppets in power in their governments, have not bribed or forced or threatened these countries, have not even been the ones to open the discussions.

View attachment 37588
It’s what the people of Ukraine want.

Even ethnic Russians in the Donbas region aren’t happy with this invasion


Even Russians in Russia aren’t happy with this invasion

It’s not NATO’s fault that Russia are frightening their neighbours into wanting to join NATO. That’s solely Russia’s fault.

It’s not NATO’s fault that Russia are paranoid of having NATO on their borders. Especially when that argument doesn’t wash since NATO has bordered the Soviet Union or Russia since it’s inception:
During the Cold War, West Germany, Italy, and Norway bordered the USSR.
After the fall of USSR, Lithuania and Poland joined NATO which border Kaliningrad; and Latvia and Estonia joined NATO which border Russia proper.

NATO has existed and been expanding longer than modern Russia has existed, never mind how long Putin has been in power. Who is he to tell an alliance that’s existed for 51 years longer than he’s been in power that he doesn’t want counties to join them?

Plus if Russia is invading Ukraine - with Putin not even recognising Ukraine’s sovereignty, and thinks the Bolsheviks made up Ukraine and “robbed Russia” of the land where Ukraine stands - it will push Russia into having more borders with NATO. So why’s he moaning about NATO moving into having more borders with Russia?

It’s such a flimsy argument to say that it’s got anything to do with NATO that Russia have invaded. That’s the excuse they’re using for Russian imperialist expansion!

Well, like it or not, it is one of the primary reasons he's invaded. Its something he's talked about for years...has made it clear he has his own "red line" for NATO expansion, its why he invaded Georgia previously....and has repeatedly railed against expansion of NATO.

I think you need to get over the fact that this is his justification, it just is. He has always viewed NATO as a threat to Russia. You ask, who is he to tell them who can join NATO...he's the guy that wants to reconstitute the USSR, the guy who wants to flex Russia's influence in eastern europe and over their former bloc states, OF COURSE he is going to try and influence who joins an alliance that is primarily in existence to thwart Russian aggression! Come on man!

None of this makes it right, it just is what it is. Thankfully the west stands united against him, NATO will now be stronger than its ever been, and hopefully Ukraine can repel this invasion long enough for the crippling economic sanctions to force Russia to stand down.
 
I can’t even be arsed reading all that, got to the meddling in elections but.

I’ll leave this here for you to educate yourself.



See you on the match day thread.


So you don’t think Putin is about to launch his nukes at least by the weekend... Come to the game, I’ll buy you a pint. No @andyhinch before you ask, the offer doesn’t extend to you
 
From this side of the pond, all I've seen (approx) is Trump arse lickers disputing what's happening in Ukraine and cheering Putin on for being a tough guy against terrorists...
The Republican party has conveniently forgotten their lord and savior was impeached for withholding military aid from Ukriane and attempting to extort Zelensky who they have been non stop praising.

If I hear "this wouldn't have happened under Trump" one more time I might snap. The only difference is Trump would have ushered the Russians in at the border.
 
How’s everyone’s anxiety right now? Mine sky high I took a few hours off from reading the forum but I got that butterfly feeling in my stomach constantly.
Honestly? Not letting it get me down one bit and living my life as best I can. Don’t know if it’s because of where I am in Spain but the general consensus seems to be one of sympathy for Ukrainian people and a realisation anything that happens is way beyond our control so crack on with things.
 
I go onto Fox News from time to time just to see what the Right thinks - and there's a fair amount of pushback in the comments on various articles against pro-Russian commentary. Even Trump has backtracked (somewhat) from his "genius" remark about Putin.
I don’t do Twitter in terms of an account but sometimes search on there if there’s a big event in sport or current affairs and to me it looked like the American reds and blues were just mudslinging at who’s fault it was. What I did notice was barely any on either side supported Putin or Russia in this, which I suppose is something.

As a side note, Trump’s comments show how out of his depth he is. He called it a genius move just a few days ago and it’s proven to be a disaster for Russia. Trump was either presuming Putin knew what he was doing without looking at the details or he actually believes it is a genius move whilst being aware of the situation. Either way it’s a very bad look.
 

Seriously though mate, he’s full of shite with his nuke bollocks. The world ignored his thinly veiled threats and he’s gone quiet. It was a bonkers escalation of nonsense.

I look at it like this, if he’s stupid enough to launch nukes he’s going to do it anyways and will do it soon, and if he isn’t he won’t invade any NATO countries because despite his Johnny big bollocks act he actually isn’t mental and doesn’t want to wipe out Russia. Sweden and Finland … 50% off your NATO membership dibs if you sign up before weekend.
 
The Republican party has conveniently forgotten their lord and savior was impeached for withholding military aid from Ukriane and attempting to extort Zelensky who they have been non stop praising.

If I hear "this wouldn't have happened under Trump" one more time I might snap. The only difference is Trump would have ushered the Russians in at the border.
If Trump was still in it would be over by now. The western response would have been disunited and pathetic, Zelensky would be dead and a puppet government would already be in place. Ukraine wouldn't have had the weaponry to hold them off.
Sadly some on here would see that as a good thing.
 

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