Saudi Sovereign fund

bigstanhibbert said:
OK, perhaps I asked the wrong question, how does a club manipulate the transfer market? Manchester City certainly don't
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i dont remember any manipulative transfers of city... they were all rational.... thats how city became that successful. best brand at the moment. the management was great. case study... really. it should be in lecture books and it will be probably... city made positive contribution to football market since 2008... all the clubs benefited from city's contribution. you made the market bigger. all the clubs are benefiting from it.

some psg transfers maybe...they couldnt be called manupilative also maybe. but some created a bubble...

ok, nobody at the moment pays in the market for icardi over 5-6 mio eur at the moment right? ok maybe 10 mio max. he is 31... if saudis pays him EUR 20.. that can be called manupilation.. it is a very thin line... i dont know. i am also confused...
 
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Mad Eyed Screamer said:
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kerem gokmen said:
i dont remember any manipulative transfers of city... they were all rational.... thats how city became that successful. best brand at the moment. the management was great. case study... really. it should be in lecture books and it will be probably...

some psg transfers maybe...they couldnt be called manupilative also maybe. but some created a bubble...
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There were a number of transfers that I always thought were out of the orinary.

Sideshow Bob form Chelsea to PSG (for a ridiculous fee) and then back again
Coutinho Dippers to Barca
Neymar Barca to PSG

But I still don't get you thoughts about transfer manipulation across the board.
 
bigstanhibbert said:
There were a number of transfers that I always thought were out of the orinary.

Sideshow Bob form Chelsea to PSG (for a ridiculous fee) and then back again
Coutinho Dippers to Barca
Neymar Barca to PSG

But I still don't get you thoughts about transfer manipulation across the board.
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yes neymar to psg. that one was problematic also, for me. that also came to my mind.

yes, out of ordinary transfers... can be called manipulation. very thin line as i said. complicated thing, what is manupilation and what is not.

you should tell a good story, when you are paying neymar for example EUR 200 mio. stories are important in finance. you should say that ''ok, i am paying 200mio but neymar will contribute my club that way, will generate a big cash inflow to my club in 2-3 years...etc etc''' if your story seems rational. no problem. but will saudis tell a good story?
for example, in manchester, house market. average house, i dont know lets say 200K... a guy came and started to buy houses for 500k. he is increasing the prices. manupulating. those houses value is not that much. he increased the prices, get into the minds of investors. then he slowly got out of the market, made a good profit. then in one year prices go back to 200k again. many investors lost a lot of money. that is manipulation.
it is hard to give an example in football.
ok, psg paid neymar 200mio. that also affected the prices of other players right. if neymar is 200K, then some other players price increased from 50mio to 100mio... market is fucked. some guys profited from those increases. but in a few years that the prices go back to normal. what happened? some guys profited, some clubs made big losses. that is manipulation.

cheers.
 
kerem gokmen said:
yes neymar to psg. that one was problematic also, for me. that also came to my mind.

yes, out of ordinary transfers... can be called manipulation. very thin line as i said. complicated thing, what is manupilation and what is not.

you should tell a good story, when you are paying neymar for example EUR 200 mio. stories are important in finance. you should say that ''ok, i am paying 200mio but neymar will contribute my club that way, will generate a big cash inflow to my club in 2-3 years...etc etc''' if your story seems rational. no problem. but will saudis tell a good story?
for example, in manchester, house market. average house, i dont know lets say 200K... a guy came and started to buy houses for 500k. he is increasing the prices. manupulating. those houses value is not that much. he increased the prices, get into the minds of investors. then he slowly got out of the market, made a good profit. then in one year prices go back to 200k again. many investors lost a lot of money. that is manipulation.
it is hard to give an example in football.
ok, psg paid neymar 200mio. that also affected the prices of other players right. if neymar is 200K, then some other players price increased from 50mio to 100mio... market is fucked. some guys profited from those increases. but in a few years that the prices go back to normal. what happened? some guys profited, some clubs made big losses. that is manipulation.

cheers.
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But we aren't talking about inanimate objects like houses, surely it is the players option whether he signs for ANY club, unless you think players are slaves to be sold as chattels.

Look at the prices the scum paid for rooney and camel gob years and years ago.
 
bigstanhibbert said:
But we aren't talking about inanimate objects like houses, surely it is the players option whether he signs for ANY club, unless you think players are slaves to be sold as chattels.

Look at the prices the scum paid for rooney and camel gob years and years ago.
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you are right... it is very complicated that way...
player values is very problematic in accounting also...what is the value of a player that you pay; you put that value into your balance sheet.
for example, psg can buy me today, for 10mio eur. :)) then say that kerem is worth 20 mio and put that 20 mio eur into its assets in balance sheet. you made your balance sheet bigger.... yes... silly... i dont know how they are doing it that the moment.

you are right. it is a very compicated subject. hard to solve...
 
kerem gokmen said:
yes neymar to psg. that one was problematic also, for me. that also came to my mind.

yes, out of ordinary transfers... can be called manipulation. very thin line as i said. complicated thing, what is manupilation and what is not.

you should tell a good story, when you are paying neymar for example EUR 200 mio. stories are important in finance. you should say that ''ok, i am paying 200mio but neymar will contribute my club that way, will generate a big cash inflow to my club in 2-3 years...etc etc''' if your story seems rational. no problem. but will saudis tell a good story?
for example, in manchester, house market. average house, i dont know lets say 200K... a guy came and started to buy houses for 500k. he is increasing the prices. manupulating. those houses value is not that much. he increased the prices, get into the minds of investors. then he slowly got out of the market, made a good profit. then in one year prices go back to 200k again. many investors lost a lot of money. that is manipulation.
it is hard to give an example in football.
ok, psg paid neymar 200mio. that also affected the prices of other players right. if neymar is 200K, then some other players price increased from 50mio to 100mio... market is fucked. some guys profited from those increases. but in a few years that the prices go back to normal. what happened? some guys profited, some clubs made big losses. that is manipulation.

cheers.
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I think I understand. United did this when they paid £30m each for Rooney and Ferdinand, it was beyond anything any other club at the time could afford. Given their prime financial position, it served them to drive up prices to a point that only they could afford the top players, thus enabling them to plunder the top players from even their closest rivals, and ensuring their continued primacy. At the same time, it drove up the prices of journeyman players so that their rivals could only sign journeymen. Double whammy. And then came Chelsea.
 
kerem gokmen said:
What is coming, is coming....
Saudis is gonna make the transfer market upside down, starting from this summer. this is the biggest issue, i believe, at least for relatively smaller clubs at the moment.

At the moment, they are offering icardi (gala player last year, the hero) EUR100mio or something, which is an amount impossible to compete. UEFA should take action. but they will not; as we know.
www.aljazeera.com

Why has Saudi sovereign fund taken over kingdom’s football clubs?

As more star players arrive, country announces launch of investment and privatisation project in bid to grow sport.
www.aljazeera.com www.aljazeera.com
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Why should UEFA intervene between an Asian entity and a South American player?
 
Newman Noggs said:
I think I understand. United did this when they paid £30m each for Rooney and Ferdinand, it was beyond anything any other club at the time could afford. Given their prime financial position, it served them to drive up prices to a point that only they could afford the top players, thus enabling them to plunder the top players from even their closest rivals, and ensuring their continued primacy. At the same time, it drove up the prices of journeyman players so that their rivals could only sign journeymen. Double whammy. And then came Chelsea.
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Veron was another.
Now there was a journeyman.....
 
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